Why Secularism will Worsen Pakistan’s security situation

[Indos]

It can be turned around to ask whether Pakistan’s illiteracy is a result of Islam.

In which university do you have your bachelor degree ?

 

[Indos]

Check Pakistan literacy rate

The problem is not secular or not secular. It is when uneducated folks try to learn Islam.

Islam itself comes from God, the highest intellectual entity ever in the universe

Better education system, better spread of education will likely push better thinking process and this thinking process is needed when any person try to learn and understand Islam.

More understanding on Islam will prevent inter killing between Muslim, less arm rebellion

It will take very long if we use education as the effect needs time

The best Pakistan need to do is to influence Islamic Cleric that is respected within TTP and Baloc Rebel to have better understanding on Islam

Just like Indonesia try to influence many of Indonesian Al Qaeda leaders (Jamaah Islamiyah) that now they have understood they are wrong

There is declaration from Indonesian Jamaah Islamiyah leadership (based of AQ and ISIS in Indonesia) in Indonesia that they are wrong

Just Google. This should be two approach, directly to their cleric and leaders and through education

Previously we have solved problem with Aceh Rebel as well, Alhamdulillah

 

[BananaRepublic]

Pakistan doesn't follow any philosophy, except philosophy of corruption, betrayal, bribery and bending over to foreign powers. This is why we are in this situation. We need to declare education emergency in Pakistan, increase our literacy rate to over 90%, that is college+ graduates, teach people ethics, morals, values, basic Islamic values, Pakistan naziriyah, peace, unity, hard work, basic economy and how to build a nation. After a few decades we will witness a good change.

Again! You just blurt out outcomes lol

What is your plan for getting there beyond wishful thinking?

As for corruption, foreign interference blah blah - that applies to almost all countries.

What is unique to Pakistan within South Asia are:

1. Religion as a unity tool
2. Military first mindset

You cannot wish to win whilst holding two giant crutches!

 

[That_Guy]

And you assume this is a case for secularism, how?

Never said it was.

Did Rashidun Caliphate allow such impunity to any group?

Pakistan isnt the Rashidun Caliphate.

In fact the very first group that did takfir became enemy number one, called Khawarij, not cause celebre for secularism.
So the metastasis you are championing also provides cover for those who do takfir on others!

No idea what this has to do with my point.

 

[BananaRepublic]

The first Khaleefa nothing happened to him, the 3 others were assassinated. What is your point? Noone is denying we have traitors amongst us.

Do you think Muslims have more traitors amongst them than others?

If so, why is that?

And why did it manifest itself right at the beginning of the faith?

Cannot blame that one on CIA - I am afraid!

 

[Distant_Observer]

So, you Pakistanis believe that South Indian DNA is inferior?

I wouldn't go as far as that but there is a 1500 mile difference from where Pakistanis are so we don't share the same values, customs, culture, aesthetic preferences and history.

 

[PakAl]

Again! You just blurt out outcomes lol

What is your plan for getting there beyond wishful thinking?

As for corruption, foreign interference blah blah - that applies to almost all countries.

What is unique to Pakistan within South Asia are:

1. Religion as a unity tool
2. Military first mindset

You cannot wish to win whilst holding two giant crutches!

When have we ever tried what I mentioned. Pakistanis just sit and imagine things but never get the work done.

 

[arjunk]

A decade ago, merely uttering the word secularism on PDF, asserting that Jinnah’s vision for Pakistan was inherently secular, or pointing out that Allama Iqbal declared Islam and secularism to be compatible would have provoked a storm of criticism, staunch opposition, and even torrents of abuse. It is reassuring to witness a shift, where such discussions no longer meet the same vehement resistance.

But unfortunately, the stark reality is that this issue is now moot. Any attempt to extricate religion from Pakistani politics now would only accelerate the disintegration of an artificially devised nation—constructed upon imposed, inorganic constructs and ideological frameworks rather than on organically cultivated bonds such as a shared language, culture, and historical heritage....

Why are such harsh words only used for Pakistan? There are plenty of multi ethnic states in the world.

Is the US not a multi ethnic state founded recently on the basis of a common ideology, rather than ethnicity?

Is Israel not a multi ethnic state untied by religion, not even consisting of locals like Pakistan, but immigrants from across the world? Hate it all you want, their population and diaspora is united under the flag of Judaism. And they’ve successfully b1txhed the Arabs over 75 years.

There are others too - Turkey, Switzerland, China, Iran, Russia.

Pakistan has been more or less a united political entity in many forms prior to 1947 - maybe not explicitly named Pakistan, but it has existed quite frequently. The Pakistan declaration itself outlines the major differences with ‘India’ beyond religion.

Until you educate a large enough portion of the population to make informed political decisions, removing the safety net that Islam provides against ethnic hate, LGBT kids, etc. is suicidal.

 

[arjunk]

Pakistan doesn't follow any philosophy, except philosophy of corruption, betrayal, bribery and bending over to foreign powers. This is why we are in this situation. We need to declare education emergency in Pakistan, increase our literacy rate to over 90%, that is college+ graduates, teach people ethics, morals, values, basic Islamic values, Pakistan naziriyah, peace, unity, hard work, basic economy and how to build a nation. After a few decades we will witness a good change.

You write this while feudal lords threaten children to not go to school

 

[PakAl]

Previously, one Pakistani member, Muji Iqbal, wants Pakistan adopt Japanese style solution

One thing that could be implemented to solve security problem is to ban weapons in Pakistan hold by civilians. It is firstly done by Hideyoshi when he united whole Japan under his rule

If weapons are banned in Pakistan, the police, security forces, taliban, dacoits, mafias will loot us 24 7. We have weapons in certain areas because people live in isolated areas or its tribal culture to hold a weapon. Terrorism is related to some extremist elements, the same ones who used to bomb Indonesia through Jemaah Islamiya, they get training and weapons from foreign agencies.

 

[arjunk]

You'd have Al-hadees and Wahhabis calling you a heretic, because for them ignoring the Hadith is blasphemy.

They can follow the Hadith if they want, Quran is the final complete word of Allah and anyone opposing it can be tried by the state for blasphemy too.

Even Saudi’s are acknowledging the issues of reliability and authority of many Hadith that mullahs use for their own political agenda.

 

[PakAl]

Do you think Muslims have more traitors amongst them than others?

If so, why is that?

And why did it manifest itself right at the beginning of the faith?

Cannot blame that one on CIA - I am afraid!

Every nation has traitors, who killed Kennedy, it wasnt a Muslim.

 

[arjunk]

Previously, one Pakistani member, Muji Iqbal, wants Pakistan adopt Japanese style solution

One thing that could be implemented to solve security problem is to ban weapons in Pakistan hold by civilians. It is firstly done by Hideyoshi when he united whole Japan under his rule

This is a ridiculous proposition which will result in two things:

1) Mass rebellion by Pakistanis

2) Illegal gun owners and corrupt police officers who protect them will oppress ant idiot dumb enough to surrender their right to self Defence.

Pakistan is not a ‘vegetarian man’ East Asian nation like Japan.

 

[arjunk]

Check Pakistan literacy rate

The problem is not secular or not secular. It is when uneducated folks try to learn Islam.

Islam itself comes from God, the highest intellectual entity ever in the universe

Better education system, better spread of education will likely push better thinking process and this thinking process is needed when any person try to learn and understand Islam.

More understanding on Islam will prevent inter killing between Muslim, less arm rebellion

Exactly. And if you replace Islam with secularism like some people are dying to do, instead of killing in the name of Islam the same people will kill in the name of ethnicity, which is a far bigger and more difficult problem to solve.

 

[arjunk]

I don’t understand why Muslims of Indian subcontinent are so sensitive about their ancestry and DNA.

We are not the ones claiming to be the origin of aryans who invaded Europe, nor do we follow a caste system revolving around ancestry like you do.

Stop projecting and scram. Your highest caste, ‘Brahmin’, is literally a cheap insult akin to ‘chamar’ in Pakistan. We could not care less about your genetic mental gymnastics.