Pakistan Missiles - Updates, News & Discussion

[Bentley777]

Agreed. Keeping up with the latest generation of missiles should be synonymous with being a credible nuclear power and offensive deterrence. If you can't deploy warheads effectively they are close to pointless.

I think we are too comfortable with our lagging missile tech, even considering our economic reality.

Those who say we have no economy what is north Korea economy? they got top notch systems. Its about goal and resisting sanctions which current gov doesnot have spine to handle also in past to bajwa didn't have i think asim munir can do it.

 

[Bentley777]

There are no two ways about it. Pakistan will have to invest in a hypersonic missile.

Its a basic common sense and should be the goal of armed forces.if Some One here knows someone from higher authority officer from this forum pass on the message

 

[falcon34]

I think GHQ is overconfident that we got some great missiles in our arsenal this is not the case even houthis allegedly claim to have hypersonic missile. You can call yourself a nuclear power but you don't have even a supersonic cruise missle. Our nuclear power is diluting because no point having warhead if you can not deliver it effectively both are interrelated if one of them compromises your whole nuclear deterrence compromises. The best investment pak ever made and paid price for it by taking so much in the face of sanctions and faced terrorism blood shed of civilians is disappearing. SPD and GHQ is sleeping.

Dude we didn't even use F2s and indians are already crying, all the damage was done by F1s.
If Indians are accepting damages on 4 airbases, than it mean rest were hit too. Pak generals just showed too much restraint. We should have used Raad, Babur, and Shaheen 1As to strike deep inside India, hate 'em for not doing that, it would have given indians some PTSDS.
And they are conventional types of these missiles, they are not solely reserved for nuclear strikes.

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[MS Sandhu]

Agree.

Pakistan needs the equivalent of Brahmos that are both difficult to intercept(very high speed),, have a declared "conventional" role/purpose only so that there is no risk of misunderstanding that it is a nuke which is the case with Pakistan's Babur and Ra'ad platforms, so that can wizz about India and hit targets at their will.

The other thing Pakistan needs, is something cheap and chearful like the Shahed 136 to overwhelm Indian AD. This was done by mass imports from Turkey, so the value of such a capability is understood, but there should be a local solution in place aswell for this.

Ballistic missiles are pointless to develop any further than what Pakistan currently has as they can be confused for a nuclear strike, they are very expensive to make and their CEP makes them only useful for large area denial payload.

Pakistan has the CM-400 AKG platform, but it is in limited numbers as it is quite an expensive platform. A local solution would be cheaper to produce and deploy.
Pakistan's engineers that work on its ballistic missiles, should be redirected to supersonic cruise missile, hypersonic missiles, mass produced drones.

Developing Brahmos like solution needs almost whole new line of R&D infrastructure that may be really expensive for Pakistan so clearly a no go.
From this stand off;
We can conclude that Pakistan has done quite good against brahmos.
According to @Oscar ,Pak achieved almost 66% interception rate against Brahmos.
From OSINTs,
One brahmos was intercepted through Hard kill over Jacobabad.
Second one through hard kill near Shorkot

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One crashed near Sundar Industrial State - soft kill

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One crashed in Jay Singh Wala village

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So Brahmos is not something out of this world that can't be intercepted.It can be and Pakistan has demonstrated this capability though thicker AD network is required to thwart Saturation Attack.
Our problem is not Brahmos.It's Saturation Attack where we struggle.

Our way forward is to increase the production of Fatah series missiles.If you look at the angle of attack of these missiles, it's almost 45 degree.That's clear indication that our missiles are following depressed trajectory.There may be room for further refinement and that's where our focus should be instead of opening Pandora box of whole lot of new complexities.

 

[hussain0216]

Developing Brahmos like solution needs almost whole new line of R&D infrastructure that may be really expensive for Pakistan so clearly a no go.
From this stand off;
We can conclude that Pakistan has done quite good against brahmos.
According to @Oscar ,Pak achieved almost 66% interception rate against Brahmos.
From OSINTs,
One brahmos was intercepted through Hard kill over Jacobabad.
Second one through hard kill near Shorkot

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For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

One crashed near Sundar Industrial State - soft kill

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For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

One crashed in Jay Singh Wala village

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For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

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So Brahmos is not something out of this world that can't be intercepted.It can be and Pakistan has demonstrated this capability though thicker AD network is required to thwart Saturation Attack.
Our problem is not Brahmos.It's Saturation Attack where we struggle.

Our way forward is to increase the production of Fatah series missiles.If you look at the angle of attack of these missiles, it's almost 45 degree.That's clear indication that our missiles are following depressed trajectory.There may be room for further refinement and that's where our focus should be instead of opening Pandora box of whole lot of new complexities.

Can someone also confirm the warhead weight for the Fatahs, because I read somewhere it was high and could be quite devastating

I like the fatah program, and once we build up large numbers I think it will be devastating

 

[MS Sandhu]

Can someone also confirm the warhead weight for the Fatahs, because I read somewhere it was high and could be quite devastating

I like the fatah program, and once we build up large numbers I think it will be devastating

According to EDR defence Magazine,F-2 can carry warhead of 365kg.
"Seven-and-half metres long, it carries a 365 kg unitary blast/blast fragmentation warhead, which lethal radius was not provided. The rockets can be launched in single mode as well as in salvo mode."

WDS 2024 - First public appearance for Pakistani Fatah-II guided missile - EDR Magazine

At the WDS 2024, GIDS of Pakistan showcased the new Fatah-II long range guided rocket, which first test took place on 27 December 2023.

www.edrmagazine.eu

 

[TallGuy]

The options for long range strikes were not an issue but the restraint the forces showed was, Majority of the missiles fired were F1s,
A few volleys of F2.
Whilst F3&4 waren't,
Meanwhile this an alleged vid of F2 bypassing Indian defences

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this video is not Fatah 2 GMLRS Rocket.

its from TP-2 Iranian missile and its MaRV making evasive maneuver - this video is voice over. also where is the Bang and missile sound.

 

[TallGuy]

Can someone also confirm the warhead weight for the Fatahs, because I read somewhere it was high and could be quite devastating

I like the fatah program, and once we build up large numbers I think it will be devastating

Fattah 1 and 2 GMRLS warhead weight is 18kg. Yes its 18kg these are rockets not missiles.

yes it would with current limited numbers we did well.

 

[TallGuy]

According to EDR defence Magazine,F-2 can carry warhead of 365kg.
"Seven-and-half metres long, it carries a 365 kg unitary blast/blast fragmentation warhead, which lethal radius was not provided. The rockets can be launched in single mode as well as in salvo mode."

WDS 2024 - First public appearance for Pakistani Fatah-II guided missile - EDR Magazine

At the WDS 2024, GIDS of Pakistan showcased the new Fatah-II long range guided rocket, which first test took place on 27 December 2023.

www.edrmagazine.eu

ok..so Fattah 2 GMRLS has a 365kg warhead unitary or blast fragmented warhead

but those fired were intercepted by S400 SAM System since they cannot perform evasive maneuvers.

 

[falcon34]

Fattah 1 and 2 GMRLS warhead weight is 18kg. Yes its 18kg these are rockets not missiles.

yes it would with current limited numbers we did well.

Dude what ya smoking,
It's 150kg for F1 and 365kg for F2

 

[TallGuy]

Dude what ya smoking,
It's 150kg for F1 and 365kg for F2View attachment 121912

i was taking about Fattah 1 GMRLS Warhead weight? where did you get F1 figure of 150kg
you are showing Fattah 2 brochure

 

[MS Sandhu]

ok..so Fattah 2 GMRLS has a 365kg warhead unitary or blast fragmented warhead

but those fired were intercepted by S400 SAM System since they cannot perform evasive maneuvers.

Pakistan fired F1
I'm unable to find proof of F2 being fired and intercepted.
And no missile can perform Evasive Maneuveres like you are suggesting not even subsonic ones.
They travel on pre-programmed flight path and that flight path can be optimized for Ballistic Missiles also.
People are seriously undermining ballistic missile tech that has significantly evolved.
We have solid base now for ballistic technology and need to climb over that.

 

[TallGuy]

Pakistan fired F1
I'm unable to find proof of F2 being fired and intercepted.
And no missile can perform Evasive Maneuveres like you are suggesting not even subsonic ones.
They travel on pre-programmed flight path and that flight path can be optimized for Ballistic Missiles also.
People are seriously undermining ballistic missile tech that has significantly evolved.
We have solid base now for ballistic technology and need to climb over that.

sorry, 2-4 Fattah 2 was used and was intercepted near Hisar, India they were launched at New Dehli these were intercepted by S400 SAM System.

yes rockets travel exactly like you said. but aeroballistic missile operates in same depressed trajectory with MaRV as well. that MaRV gives evasive maneuver capacity. thus, providing extreme problems to SAM systems with high speed.

i hope GIDS finds a solution (hypersonic - MaRV based) 600-900km solution quick.

 

[MS Sandhu]

sorry, 2-4 Fattah 2 was used and was intercepted near Hisar, India they were launched at New Dehli these were intercepted by S400 SAM System.

Can you provide some OSINT details of this incident ?
I'm not really aware of this incident

 

[hussain0216]

sorry, 2-4 Fattah 2 was used and was intercepted near Hisar, India they were launched at New Dehli these were intercepted by S400 SAM System.

yes rockets travel exactly like you said. but aeroballistic missile operates in same depressed trajectory with MaRV as well. that MaRV gives evasive maneuver capacity. thus, providing extreme problems to SAM systems with high speed.

i hope GIDS finds a solution (hypersonic - MaRV based) 600-900km solution quick.

Sure, but I also think fatahs systems are great, fast, large warhead, destructive

We also stopped a number of brahmos missiles, nothing is fool proof

We just need to build up numbers
Fatah 3 has just been tested
Fatah 4 is probably a year or two away
Fatah 2 was only revealed about a year ago

So our numbers are limited, once we ramp up production for a few years and increase the amount of launchers then it's going to be a lethal mobile system