Turkish Naval Programs

[FuturePAF]

Greek PM Mitcotakis
The issue is not what our neighbours are doing, but what we are doing. We have a serious strategic advantage. A year from now we'll have 3 ultra-modern Frigates.



Turkiye is currently building 34 Warships simultaneously
The Turkish Navy is coming to become stronger than Hellenic+Egyptian+Israeli Navies combined


even the French Navy will be faint to compare with the Turkish Navy, when MUGEM Aircraft Carrier , 8 TF-2000 class Destroyers , 8 ISTIF Frigates , 4 modernized MEKO-200TN Frigates , 10 HISAR OPVs , 10 new FACs , STM-500 mini attack Submarines , 6 REIS ( Type-214TN ) class AIP Submarines , MILDEN class AIP Submarines , NUKDEN class nuclear Submarines , RAMJET powered supersonic anti-ship Missile , Hypersonic anti-ship Ballistic Missile , etc enter service



Associate Professor Dr. Colonel UCAR, Director of the Naval Forces Design Project Office:

Information exchange with TAI is ongoing regarding the KAAN's ability to take off and land from MUGEM Aircraft Carrier should it be produced

View attachment 140687

Cyber defenses will be crucial for these warships and their networks as well. It seems the Greeks will be looking to use cyber to make up for their numerical disadvantage.

The following analyst is very knowledgeable; worked for Rand, very well versed on the French way of war, to the point French military academies invite him to teach their officers on grand strategy. France being Greece’ biggest backer in Europe, I think this analysis is worth a listen.

Summary: Greeks going for A2AD, lots of modern anti ship missiles, spread throughout the island chains. Also the Greeks will splurge on modernizing their old systems, to have enough good enough mass alongside modern equipment in a major arms buying spree.

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[Foinikas]

Cyber defenses will be crucial for these warships and their networks as well. It seems the Greeks will be looking to use cyber to make up for their numerical disadvantage.

The following analyst is very knowledgeable; worked for Rand, very well versed on the French way of war, to the point French military academies invite him to teach their officers on grand strategy. France being Greece’ biggest backer in Europe, I think this analysis is worth a listen.

Summary: Greeks going for A2AD, lots of modern anti ship missiles, spread throughout the island chains. Also the Greeks will splurge on modernizing their old systems, to have enough good enough mass alongside modern equipment in a major arms buying spree.

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Last night I read the newest about the Italian FREMM Bergamini. Apparently,the talks are going very well and our government is also interested in two more used FREMM Bergamini frigates that will be ready once the FREMM EVO replace the next two as well.

It is expected that the PM or MoD will announce the deal for a 4th FDI HN,the upgrade of the four MEKO and maybe the signing of a memorandum with Italy about the first two FREMM,the Carlo Bergamini and the Virginio Fasan,probably in September.

You mentioned EW and one issue that's been bothering the Greek defence community is the ECM for the FDI. For years,some sites had been criticizing the lack of an ECM for these modern frigates,however others had been reporting that Naval Group and Thales have been working on a brand new state-of-the-art ECM that will supposedly be installed on the FDI and Horizon class ships as well.

Some sites have reported in 2024 that this system is almost ready and is on trials or something. The FDI is supposed to have a top R-ESM already,but that's not enough. It has also been reported that the ships will have the Kentavros|(Centaur) C-UAV installed on them as well.

 

[Foinikas]

Cyber defenses will be crucial for these warships and their networks as well. It seems the Greeks will be looking to use cyber to make up for their numerical disadvantage.

The following analyst is very knowledgeable; worked for Rand, very well versed on the French way of war, to the point French military academies invite him to teach their officers on grand strategy. France being Greece’ biggest backer in Europe, I think this analysis is worth a listen.

Summary: Greeks going for A2AD, lots of modern anti ship missiles, spread throughout the island chains. Also the Greeks will splurge on modernizing their old systems, to have enough good enough mass alongside modern equipment in a major arms buying spree.

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I watched the video,he made some mistakes,but mostly not his fault.

• The Lynx deal fell out,as our government thought it was too expensive at the time. It was supposed to be 3,5 billion euros for 206 Lynx IFVs(or 250 according to some sources)with a production line in Greece,the upgrade of 123 Leopard 2A4 to Leopard 2A7 and the transfer of 200 Marder 1A3 IFVs from Germany to Greece.
• The VBCI deal with the French is still hanging. They haven't signed it nor cancelled it,it's like they froze it without knowing what they want to do. It's about producing the new VBCI Philoctetes in Greece and some 120 used VBCI of the French Army being delivered to Greece.
• He did mention the BMP-1s,but he forgot to mention the 40 Marder 1A3. Just saying. It's not important.
• He made a mistake,Cyprus has the Akeron ATGMs,not Greece.
• We haven't ordered any Puls yet and it seems that the Puls is postponed or cancelled,probably due to political pressure.
• The problem with the Air Defence is that a lot of the systems are Soviet/Russian and need replacement,because the spare parts will run out and the missiles will expire. These systems are the OSA AKM,the Tor-M1 and the S-300PMU1. The HAWK also need replacement as they are very old already. The Velos(Skyguard)needs upgrade because it uses Sea-Sparrow missiles.
• The Navy fleet also needs a lot of new ships and submarines. The four Type 209 submarines need to go and the MoD currently wants to modernize the four Type 214. The Navy has to replace the nine Kortenaer(Elli class)frigates and 4 FDI are not enough. That's why we need the 2+2 FREMM Bergamini. The other problem is the 8 Combattante FAC that we need to replace. And they don't seem to be doing anything about that. They want to upgrade the 7 Roussen class FAC,but we also have 8 old(or even obsolete)Combattante.
• The gunboats are not removing their guns I think,they're just adding the SPIKE NLOS and that's only on four of the gunboats. The four Mark V SOC will have SPIKE LR2 installed on them and some say the four Island class patrol boats too.

 

[Oublious]

Last night I read the newest about the Italian FREMM Bergamini. Apparently,the talks are going very well and our government is also interested in two more used FREMM Bergamini frigates that will be ready once the FREMM EVO replace the next two as well.

It is expected that the PM or MoD will announce the deal for a 4th FDI HN,the upgrade of the four MEKO and maybe the signing of a memorandum with Italy about the first two FREMM,the Carlo Bergamini and the Virginio Fasan,probably in September.

You mentioned EW and one issue that's been bothering the Greek defence community is the ECM for the FDI. For years,some sites had been criticizing the lack of an ECM for these modern frigates,however others had been reporting that Naval Group and Thales have been working on a brand new state-of-the-art ECM that will supposedly be installed on the FDI and Horizon class ships as well.

Some sites have reported in 2024 that this system is almost ready and is on trials or something. The FDI is supposed to have a top R-ESM already,but that's not enough. It has also been reported that the ships will have the Kentavros|(Centaur) C-UAV installed on them as well.

View attachment 141973

You should ask the Indians with the spectra hype, the France idiots do not have CIWS because ther ew/ecm. They think ther superior systems are enough.

IF you wrote this 20 years ago your ships would be in advantage, but that time have passed foni. If you underestimate Turkish EW, you will regret it.

Beside all that hype you do not have the money.

 

[Foinikas]

You should ask the Indians with the spectra hype, the France idiots do not have CIWS because ther ew/ecm. They think ther superior systems are enough.

IF you wrote this 20 years ago your ships would be in advantage, but that time have passed foni. If you underestimate Turkish EW, you will regret it.

Beside all that hype you do not have the money.

But you are the one underestimating us now. 4 FDI HN and 2+2 FREMM Bergamini are a very good combination. Of course we need more ships,corvettes would have been a nice solution to replace the Combattante and support the frigates.

 

[MMM-E]

Cyber defenses will be crucial for these warships and their networks as well. It seems the Greeks will be looking to use cyber to make up for their numerical disadvantage.

Turkish Warships dont use foreign systems ..... full of indigenous Systems from CMS to Radars

Only USA , Turkiye , The UK and France use their own Systems and Weapons on their Warships in NATO

ADVENT - Network Supported Data Integrated Combat Management System​

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https://www.havelsan.com/en/solutions/advent-combat-management-system

Also Turkiye is now one of top Countries in NATO with great Electronic Warfare technologies

Libya in 2020 , Turkish KORAL Radar Electronic Warfare System show up as horizontal noise as it is jamming frequencies with the digital signal of the EMPAR Radar on board Italian HORİZON class Destroyer




4 HAVASOJ airborne stand off jammer Aircraft to enter the service soon to jam and paralyze enemy Radars and communications systems from 400 km away


Aselsan ANTIDOT-2U Electronic Warfare Pod
The system operates fully autonomously. It can suppress and deceiveall radars of Warships and the Air Defense Systems with the electronic attacktechniques loaded

• Simultaneous multiple threat jamming
• Wide Frequency and Spatial Coverage
• Integrated Digital Receiver Technique Generator
• Digital RF Memory Architecture

even Turkish UCAVs equipped with electronic warfare pods


Also AKINCI UCAV will gain the capability to perform stand-off jamming with ASELSAN’s ASOJ-234U Electronic Warfare Pod. ASOJ-234U incorporates radar and communication electronic support and attack capabilities in a single pod.


Turkish military technologies have the ability and power to compete with all other countries in the Eastern Mediterranean, including France and Israel.

 

[MMM-E]

MARLIN unmanned Vessel became the first unmanned surface object with electronic warfare capability in the world

The Turkish Navy showed the MARLIN as a game-changer in naval warfare
at a NATO Exercise held in Portugal in 2022

 

[FuturePAF]

Turkish Warships dont use foreign systems ..... full of indigenous Systems from CMS to Radars

Only USA , Turkiye , The UK and France use their own Systems and Weapons on their Warships in NATO

ADVENT - Network Supported Data Integrated Combat Management System​

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

https://www.havelsan.com/en/solutions/advent-combat-management-system

Also Turkiye is now one of top Countries in NATO with great Electronic Warfare technologies

Libya in 2020 , Turkish KORAL Radar Electronic Warfare System show up as horizontal noise as it is jamming frequencies with the digital signal of the EMPAR Radar on board Italian HORİZON class Destroyer
View attachment 142268
View attachment 142271


4 HAVASOJ airborne stand off jammer Aircraft to enter the service soon to jam and paralyze enemy Radars and communications systems from 400 km away
View attachment 142260

Aselsan ANTIDOT-2U Electronic Warfare Pod
The system operates fully autonomously. It can suppress and deceiveall radars of Warships and the Air Defense Systems with the electronic attacktechniques loaded

• Simultaneous multiple threat jamming
• Wide Frequency and Spatial Coverage
• Integrated Digital Receiver Technique Generator
• Digital RF Memory Architecture
View attachment 142266
even Turkish UCAVs equipped with electronic warfare pods
View attachment 142267

Also AKINCI UCAV will gain the capability to perform stand-off jamming with ASELSAN’s ASOJ-234U Electronic Warfare Pod. ASOJ-234U incorporates radar and communication electronic support and attack capabilities in a single pod.
View attachment 142265

Turkish military technologies have the ability and power to compete with all other countries in the Eastern Mediterranean, including France and Israel.

I’m not talking offense, but defense. The Greeks will (or hire someone to) penetrate Turkish networks. Just a heads up that that is a major focus of their current strategy.

 

[Foinikas]

I’m not talking offense, but defense. The Greeks will (or hire someone to) penetrate Turkish networks. Just a heads up that that is a major focus of their current strategy.

How will we do that?

 

[FuturePAF]

How will we do that?

I’m just referencing what the Rand analyst said Greece would do. We’ll have to see how Greece attempts it, and who they hire.

 

[MMM-E]

Summary: Greeks going for A2AD, lots of modern anti ship missiles, spread throughout the island chains. Also the Greeks will splurge on modernizing their old systems, to have enough good enough mass alongside modern equipment in a major arms buying spree.

I’m just referencing what the Rand analyst said Greece would do.

The Rand analyst is dreaming ..
Turkiye forms the strongest A2AD capability in the region

GREECE
Greece can deploy only EXOCET anti-ship Missile ... nothing else

TURKIYE
on the other hand , Turkish Missile/guided munition technology is the best in the region to turn enemy naval fleet into scrap of metal in a day

400+ HARPOON and SLAM-ER Missiles

ATMACA , SOM , CAKIR , IHA-230 , TOLUN-IIR , KUZGUN-TJ , KGK-82 IHA , EREN , MAM-T IIR , ALPAGUT , KEMANKES , SUPER LIGHTNING

Also 300-ER air launched supersonic Ballistic Missile
Also supersonic anti-ship Missile and hypersonic anti-ship Ballistic Missile on the way


and never forget about that ,
there is no Greek Island in the Eastern Mediterranean except Crete


Turkiye will use Unmanned Combat Vessels and STM-500 mini attack Submarines in the Aegean for strategic superiority

MARLIN armed wih KUZGUN , CAKIR Missiles and Torpedos



Turkish UCAV Fleet
And of course , Turkish UCAV fleet makes the development of an A2/AD zone in the Eastern Mediterranean

Hellenic Navy can not survive against Turkish UCAVs
( Turkiye has over 300 UCAVs armed with long range missiles/guided munitions )




RESULT = With access for Turkiye’s credible maritime combat power vastly improved between 2015 and 2025 ...... the final aspect of Turkish regional strategy is coming with the new military projects how an expanded eastern Mediterranean A2/AD envelope could be established in the very near future

Only TAYFUN hypersonic anti-ship Ballistic Missile will be enough to create a surface naval A2/AD zone in the eastern Mediterraean


And TF-2000 class Destroyers will have up to a 250+ km antiair range

 

[Foinikas]

GREECE
Greece can deploy only EXOCET anti-ship Missile ... nothing else

Nah,we also have SCALP-EG and soon MdCN

TURKIYE
on the other hand , Turkish Missile/guided munition technology is the best in the region to turn enemy naval fleet into scrap of metal in a day

400+ HARPOON and SLAM-ER Missiles

ATMACA , SOM , CAKIR , IHA-230 , TOLUN-IIR , KUZGUN-TJ , KGK-82 IHA , EREN , MAM-T IIR , ALPAGUT , KEMANKES , SUPER LIGHTNING

Also 300-ER air launched supersonic Ballistic Missile
Also supersonic anti-ship Missile and hypersonic anti-ship Ballistic Missile on the way

Brochure Army?

and never forget about that ,
there is no Greek Island in the Eastern Mediterranean except Crete

That's not true

And of course , Turkish UCAV fleet makes the development of an A2/AD zone in the Eastern Mediterranean

Makes the development? Meaning it doesn't yet have enough A2/AD?

Hellenic Navy can not survive against Turkish UCAVs
( Turkiye has over 300 UCAVs armed with long range missiles/guided munitions )

Can Turkish UCAVs survive the Greek Air Force?

And TF-2000 class Destroyers will have up to a 250+ km antiair range

Will....some day. Maybe.

RESULT = With access for Turkiye’s credible maritime combat power vastly improved between 2015 and 2025 ...... the final aspect of Turkish regional strategy is coming with the new military projects how an expanded eastern Mediterranean A2/AD envelope could be established in the very near future

You see now @FuturePAF Turkey is an undefeated regional superpower with weapons nobody else thinks of making and nobody can defeat. Maybe Americans,but if you ask him he will tell you that even an entire US aircraft carrier group cannot defeat Turkiye in their territory.

 

[FuturePAF]

Nah,we also have SCALP-EG and soon MdCN


Brochure Army?


That's not true

View attachment 142621


View attachment 142622


Makes the development? Meaning it doesn't yet have enough A2/AD?


Can Turkish UCAVs survive the Greek Air Force?


Will....some day. Maybe.



You see now @FuturePAF Turkey is an undefeated regional superpower with weapons nobody else thinks of making and nobody can defeat. Maybe Americans,but if you ask him he will tell you that even an entire US aircraft carrier group cannot defeat Turkiye in their territory.

Türkiye is shaping its neighborhood and waiting for the opportunity to advance its agenda (while the world looks at the Mediterranean Syria, Türkiye is making serious moves into Central Asia via Trump helping to resolve Armenia-Azerbaijan connectivity, and making possible the Middle corridor project, hopefully soon to be linked to India ocean waters via the Afghan Pak rail link to Uzbekistan).

Sure, there is bravado, but you have to say the Turks have been making significant military and economic progress. Luckily both Greece and Türkiye are in NATO and so skirmishes between the two are hardly likely to lead to any major clash.

Most of their tech is about self reliance, export deals, and protecting economic activity. Fears of a Neo-ottoman movement are overblown. The Turks, IMHO, are driving national development with these projects that build up the national spirit of the country (but supported with smart export deals and demonstrations of their tech in small wars).

 

[Foinikas]

Fears of a Neo-ottoman movement are overblown.

Not quite,there is a neo-ottoman agenda going on for some 10 years now,slowly getting more influence in the Middle-East,Balkans and Africa. Bases here and there,intervening in various countries. These are all imperial ambitions.

Sure, there is bravado, but you have to say the Turks have been making significant military and economic progress.

Bravado? The guy must be getting off by repeating the same long lists of superweapons and dreaming of an invincible Turkey with an unbeatable army. The narrative is so high in ultranationalistic dillusions,I'm seriously thinking he might actually be jerking off to all that,somehow

 

[Oublious]

Not quite,there is a neo-ottoman agenda going on for some 10 years now,slowly getting more influence in the Middle-East,Balkans and Africa. Bases here and there,intervening in various countries. These are all imperial ambitions.


Bravado? The guy must be getting off by repeating the same long lists of superweapons and dreaming of an invincible Turkey with an unbeatable army. The narrative is so high in ultranationalistic dillusions,I'm seriously thinking he might actually be jerking off to all that,somehow

Ther is hellenism going on in the agean sea. Our neighbour Greece thinks they can forcly push ther dream on the agean sea. No hellenism...