Pakistan Air Force | News & Discussions

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[Vkdindian1]

Gradually the numbers are inching up. Each day comes with a new number.
Started with 4 on 7th May.
It has reached 8 now. Great going.

I do blame the IAF for this too. Had they declared the exact losses, probably this wouldn’t have happened.

Corollary- These numbers would still keep going up claiming that IAF hasn’t accepted the correct figure of losses.

 

[Watandar]

But this magazine article still didn't answer the most important question, where is Shivangi Singh ?

 

[Tariq Habib Afridi]

JF-17C actually has quite a cool solution for its onboard ecm suite

View attachment 147478
View attachment 147479

Do you notice something? On a block 3, the inboard LEF's are different colours...

Do you know why?

They both house a pair of AESA clusters, the LEFs are designed not to interfere with their operation.

Now, im 99.99999% sure these are where the JF-17s integral ECM suite antennas are placed. I lost the image and i will find it again, but PAC actually published a graphic showing AESA clusters in the LEF but nobody noticed.

But yeah, the JF-17C carries an AESA based ECM suite in the leading edge of the wing. A very cool solution i will say.

View attachment 147480
As seen here- integrated into the LEFs.

I think you are the first to observe this. no one in my knowledge has observed this before. indeed a very smart solution if it really has ECM suite in the LEF.

By the way the issue is not only with space but also with engine power of JF17C. Very limited ECM suite can be installed? but Thanks for this observation

 

[Tariq Habib Afridi]

China purchased four to six S-400 air defense systems. One system equals one air defense battalion (compared to a regiment in Russia).

China's actual test results:
The S-400 air defense system is characterized by its long detection range. However, its radar resolution is relatively poor, and its anti-interference capabilities are relatively weak. In other words, it can detect targets at great distances, but it cannot distinguish their types.

China's HQ-9 series air defense systems have a much shorter detection range than the S-400. However, their radar resolution is stronger, and their anti-interference capabilities are even better. In other words, once detected, they can accurately determine the target's type.

Because China faced significant threats at the time and its own HQ-9 production capacity was insufficient, it purchased the S-400 from Russia for key area air defense. However, actual testing results were unsatisfactory. Subsequently, China deployed all S-400 air defense systems to low-threat areas. The HQ-9 was responsible for air defense in high-threat areas.

Some analysts believe that China was attracted by the interceptor missiles of the S-400 air defense system. ------ Its interceptor missiles are indeed quite good. But its radar and analysis systems are terrible. Russia's electronics and information technology sectors have stagnated for years.

Objectively speaking, the S-400 is stronger than the HQ-9, but the S-400 is prone to misjudgment. The HQ-9 has a much higher cost-effectiveness.

========================================

For Pakistan, purchasing Chinese air defense systems is a better option. If Pakistan wants to research the S-400 system, it can go directly to China. Alternatively, it can communicate directly with its Chinese counterparts.

If Pakistan truly wants to purchase used S-400s, it can try to negotiate with China. After all, the S-400s in China's possession are of little value. We only need to retain one or two for research and as a simulated enemy force.

What about the newer HQ-9C? isn't that at par with S400 in range now?

 

[CallSignMaverick]

One word WHEREISSHIVANGISINGH

That makes it 2 confirmed Rafale kills. Other kill evidence will be released slowly to inflict 10 times more humiliation on India.

As for PAF losses. No one outside Godi media believes in indian propaganda other then few sold out western so called defenj analysts.

"10 timj more hyumiliyeshun to indeeyah" I think that'll happen when IAF releases some more videos of drone attacks and satellite imagery...

Say hi to SU30 pilot inspecting SU30 wreckage.
View attachment 147437

Good good, now Heron Mk-2 is a Flanker, good progress.

 

[Hayabusa]

Gradually the numbers are inching up. Each day comes with a new number.
Started with 4 on 7th May.
It has reached 8 now. Great going.

I do blame the IAF for this too. Had they declared the exact losses, probably this wouldn’t have happened.

Corollary- These numbers would still keep going up claiming that IAF hasn’t accepted the correct figure of losses.

The number is currently finalized as 7. At least based on the magazine and Pakistan's POV. 8 if you include the UAV. You can't compare it during the time of conflict where the fog of war existed. Once things start clearing up, it can be determined from there.

 

[Pradotlc]

This is probably a very dumb question,but what if Turkey and Russia came to an agreement to sell the S-400s to Pakistan? Would India be able to block that sale? Would it be of little importance to Pakistan since,supposedly Indians have it as well?

It isn’t needed for two reasons

- Chinese have provided us with a similar system although not as capable as S400 but at the rate China military tech is improving it might surpass it in a few years

- Turk have s400 and Qatar have rafales and PAF has links to both of them . Knowing PAF pretty sure they had a “peek” at them .. which why none of these system did anything useful against us..

if you know how an enemy weapon ticks you can always counter them no matter how superior they are.

 

[ThoroughPro]

Gradually the numbers are inching up. Each day comes with a new number.
Started with 4 on 7th May.
It has reached 8 now. Great going.

I do blame the IAF for this too. Had they declared the exact losses, probably this wouldn’t have happened.

Corollary- These numbers would still keep going up claiming that IAF hasn’t accepted the correct figure of losses.

not like waking up three months after the conflict and claim 6 jets, one SAB2000 and 15 F16, and that too by the chief of your Air Force.

 

[Oscar]

Gradually the numbers are inching up. Each day comes with a new number.
Started with 4 on 7th May.
It has reached 8 now. Great going.

I do blame the IAF for this too. Had they declared the exact losses, probably this wouldn’t have happened.

Corollary- These numbers would still keep going up claiming that IAF hasn’t accepted the correct figure of losses.

Let's assume the middle ground with statements from CDS and Swamy as likely losses(earliest possible testimony from people rightly in the know) then 5 jets is the call.
My guess is that there is definitely more than one Rafale, the other two claims by PAF are based on tracks disappearing but considering LoC and terrain just bugging out at low level is likely to make your track disappear.

However, part of the PL-15s two way DL is that it sends a ping back when it detonates due to prox fuze(with self destruct being a different packet) which is why the PAF had awarded it as a kill.

Prox fuze detonation is a high indicator of a kill but it can also indicate the aircraft perhaps survived to get back home. Perhaps not in a condition to show flyable yet but it is possible it could emerge again.

There is also the likelihood that much like the AIM-120C kill award on MKi a detonation did happen and like the MKi the Rafale made it back to a base but whether it landed safely or not is another matter. The MKi claim was moved based on supposed HUMINT by PAF to a made it controllably to base but crashed on landing attempt(While Conjecture if true those IAF pilots should be ideally recognized even if privately for their attempt to bring a jet back).
Bear in mind the 120C just sends a signal of prox fuze into the blind while the PL-15 to my limited understanding transmits it to the launching aircraft via the two-way DL.

There is another angle to it - the IAF may have had causalities(not losses) in the way of overstressed airframes(although that is an impossibility with FBW aircraft like the Rafale that would not allow it) or more likely airframes are being repurposed for serial number changes.
That assumes that the IAF chief is being strong handed to show Modi in a positive light no matter what.
At this point, the PAF can continue claiming ten and unless the IAF shows the Rafale's (if doesn't have 36 then it is a problem for the Chief) for count then it contradicts its own people earlier and sets up further embarrassment on serial spoof accusations.
Alan Warnes has written a biased article, but his intro did make a fair point.

Both the PAF and IAF pilots are highly trained and professional - but if the leadership places its faith totally in technology instead of training and tactics - results like this are inevitable.

 

[CallSignMaverick]

not like waking up three months after the conflict and claim 6 jets, one SAB2000 and 15 F16, and that too by the chief of your Air Force.

One can argue that as well, but then DGAO mentioned "we've downed their aircrafts as well but being ascertained", and on 10th PC it was also mentioned enemy faced losses in the air. ACM just mentioned that during an annual event where he got the chance to speak. He showed some new pics/videos too.

While 3 months later, we have seen another Rafale kill claim coming from PAF.

 

[Oscar]

not like waking up three months after the conflict and claim 6 jets, one SAB2000 and 15 F16, and that too by the chief of your Air Force.

Imagine what it does to you from your character perspective, from the stress of possibly some serious life threats by the BJP hit squad or the political nutjobs they breed in the IAF. What impact it has to the character and feelings of those IAF pilots and planners who rightly did execute some great textbook attacks on the 10th. To the smart western command AD folks who kept their radars off and only let their gunners pick off the PAF's half baked YIHA Attacks.

To the S-400 operators who kept the line all the way until they were forced to withdraw.
A total slap in the face to all professionals.

Imagine if in the Falkands war, the Argentinian pilots who kept a brave effort regardless of being outgunned via the AIM-9L and better training hear claims their roland sams which were taken out early shot down 5 harriers and a vulcan.

 

[flyingorca]

"10 timj more hyumiliyeshun to indeeyah" I think that'll happen when IAF releases some more videos of drone attacks and satellite imagery...

Good good, now Heron Mk-2 is a Flanker, good progress.

Hahaha so cute.
Btw, will Indian satellite imagery look something like this to prove the Hanger had bunch of F16 hiding?




But little do these low IQ Indian military fanbois know that each PAF fighter jet has its own HAS.

 

[Oscar]

One can argue that as well, but then DGAO mentioned "we've downed their aircrafts as well but being ascertained", and on 10th PC it was also mentioned enemy faced losses in the air. ACM just mentioned that during an annual event where he got the chance to speak. He showed some new pics/videos too.

While 3 months later, we have seen another Rafale kill claim coming from PAF.

Great - bring pictures. After all, there is so much imagery available everywhere. Simple fact is you didnt do squat then, S-400s tried but could not get a thing and your airforce basically was grounded for anything other than extreme low level efforts even under S-400 cover.
ACM did not show anything substantial or videos.
You simply cannot hide a the wreckage of a lumbering turboprop ANYWHERE in the world even in the remote areas of Ukraine let alone the sprawling urban rural areas of Pakistan where this alleged kill took place.

YOU are a pathological liar anyway so your entire presence on this forum is useless. But what is sad is that the IAF has some very very good officers and professionals whose entire orgnaization's professionalism was Antyesti'ed since BS Dhanoa for political purposed.


Please get the F out of this thread. We have NOTHING TO DISCUSS WITH YOUR KIND.

 

[Xestan]

There seems to be little information about how a CM-400AKG tracks its target. Does it rely on INS guidance, anti-radiation or something else?

Because if it's not anti-radiation, are there less chances of it hitting the radar system of S-400? Because it's a mobile system. Can someone shed some light on this aspect.