TF-X / KAAN / Hürjet Turkish Fighter & Trainer Aircrafts News & Discussions

[wanglaokan]

F414 engine for KAAN had been stalled by USA.

 

[Indos]

F414 engine for KAAN had been stalled by USA.

Kaan doesnt use F414 but F110

 

[wanglaokan]

Kaan doesnt use F414 but F110

how Turkey is gonna deal with it? any backup engine?

 

[Indos]

how Turkey is gonna deal with it? any backup engine?

Basically it is something that pretty significant development in the negative way of course. For prototyping development, they still have F110 engines enough for I think 2 more prototypes as they bought 8 engines of F110 previously where 2 engines would likely be used for spares. (1 planes needs 2 engines).

But the development of testing prototypes should go beyond that, I mean flight test is there to get type certificate, so if some how they manage to build the same diameter and length and the same weight engine, they still need to spend some time with this engines to get the type certificate that is essential for mass production phase.

And how they can manage to build that engine fast enough is beyond my understanding, I would say just let time to answer that

 

[Deino]

...

JF-17's main issue was Chinese engine. That problem has been solved and its B version is flying with a WS-10 version. So Pakistan will get an engine with TOT regardless for it's future local platforms under PFX. So if this helps solve Pakistan and Turkey, two nation's problems, I think China won't mind it. This situation actually makes Turkish defense industry their client.

Pardon, but what B-version uses a WS-10 version? Surely not a JF-17!
And again No-one will get a ToT for an engine from Chin, not Pakistan and never ever Turkey!

Selling WS10C engines to Turkey is completely inconsistent with China's geostrategic interests, let alone the TOT issue.

China considers Pakistan a partner, supported it during the Indo-Pakistani War, and tacitly endorsed Pakistan's military alliance with Saudi Arabia because these actions serve the interests of both China and Pakistan.

While Pakistani netizens may be enthusiastic, Pakistani generals and senior officials will not be so arrogant as to disregard China's interests and export WS10C engines to Turkey unless Turkey offers China an offer it cannot refuse.

Indeed, CHINA WILL NOT SUPPLY ENGINES FOR KAAN TO TURKEY!

And as so often, I'll try again! Pakistan has as much say in the WS-10 as Germany does in the F-47 program!

So, to think Pakistan could do anything for selling WS-10 engines to Turkey is ridiculous!
And simply there is NOTHING Turkey could offer China could not refuse.

Also, Pakistan as a middleman - there's not even a need to discuss that - China will never ever supply through a middleman?

So again long story short: CHINA WILL NOT SUPPLY ENGINES FOR KAAN TO TURKEY!

 

[RajaBaja]

Pardon, but what B-version uses a WS-10 version? Surely not a JF-17!
And again No-one will get a ToT for an engine from Chin, not Pakistan and never ever Turkey!


Indeed, CHINA WILL NOT SUPPLY ENGINES FOR KAAN TO TURKEY!

And as so often, I'll try again! Pakistan has as much say in the WS-10 as Germany does in the F-47 program!

So, to think Pakistan could do anything for selling WS-10 engines to Turkey is ridiculous!
And simply there is NOTHING Turkey could offer China could not refuse.

Also, Pakistan as a middleman - there's not even a need to discuss that - China will never ever supply through a middleman?

So again long story short: CHINA WILL NOT SUPPLY ENGINES FOR KAAN TO TURKEY!

Andreas - Buddy, I think I might know a few details that aren't on "X" or other media platforms yet. To truly answer your and some other members questions about "Chin will not give TOT for an engine" and "PFX will never have a stealth outcome", I will have to use a "Time Machine" to fast forward to 2028 and show you the future. I don't have that time machine. If anyone has it, please take us into 2028.
Otherwise, we'll all just wait and watch the news to come on media as things happen. The strategy is already built and one builds a long term strategy after making sure it will get X,Y,Z from supplier A,B,C. If you read my posts, I keep mentioning 2028 year again and again.

The ONLY situation where Pakistan will NOT show further interest in Chinese engines is *IF* Turkiye gets its TF-35000 built and if PFX gets design and avionics input from the KAAN project into its PFX project and Turkiye offers Pakistan TOT instead.

Do note, we have over 200 engineers helping with the KAAN project for over 2 years now and also have few dozen senior engineers trained in China working on some projects also. So the bottom line is, the PFX project will have both long term goals met, 1: to produce a stealthy jet for the PAF and 2: An engine with TOT locally produced.

 

[MMM-E]

Basically it is something that pretty significant development in the negative way of course. For prototyping development, they still have F110 engines enough for I think 2 more prototypes as they bought 8 engines of F110 previously where 2 engines would likely be used for spares. (1 planes needs 2 engines).

More 3 prototypes will be produced in 2026
One prototype will be used in static tests, while the other prototypes will participate in flight tests.

Turkiye planned to produce 20 KAAN with American engine to be delivered to the Turkish Air Force in 2029 .... but Turkiye is awaiting approval from the US Congress for the F-110 Engines.


The TF-35000 indigenous turbofan Engine will be integrated into KAAN until 2032 and flight tests will begin with the domestic engine.

 

[MMM-E]

France
France used American F-404 Engine for RAFALE prototypes and RAFALE mass production started with French SNECMA M-88 Engine

Sweden
Sweden used American F-404 Engine for JAS-39 prototypes and JAS-39E/F use American F-404-GE-39E Engine

India
India used American F-404 Engine for TEJAS prototypes and TEJAS mass production started with American F-404 Engine

South Korea
S.Korea used American F-414 Engine for KF-21 prototypes and KF-21 mass production will start with American F-414 Engine

China
China used Russian AL-31 Engine for J-20 prototypes and indigenous WS-10 Engine used for J-20 mass production


TURKIYE
Turkiye used American F-110 Engine for KAAN prototypes and KAAN mass production will start with indigenous TF-35.000 Engine


Sweden , India , S.Korea supplies engines from the USA without any problems, but Turkiye, a NATO member has difficulty purchasing engines from the USA even for the production of 20 KAANs

 

[Ak01]

Andreas - Buddy, I think I might know a few details that aren't on "X" or other media platforms yet. To truly answer your and some other members questions about "Chin will not give TOT for an engine" and "PFX will never have a stealth outcome", I will have to use a "Time Machine" to fast forward to 2028 and show you the future. I don't have that time machine. If anyone has it, please take us into 2028.
Otherwise, we'll all just wait and watch the news to come on media as things happen. The strategy is already built and one builds a long term strategy after making sure it will get X,Y,Z from supplier A,B,C. If you read my posts, I keep mentioning 2028 year again and again.

The ONLY situation where Pakistan will NOT show further interest in Chinese engines is *IF* Turkiye gets its TF-35000 built and if PFX gets design and avionics input from the KAAN project into its PFX project and Turkiye offers Pakistan TOT instead.

Do note, we have over 200 engineers helping with the KAAN project for over 2 years now and also have few dozen senior engineers trained in China working on some projects also. So the bottom line is, the PFX project will have both long term goals met, 1: to produce a stealthy jet for the PAF and 2: An engine with TOT locally produced.

@RescueRanger


how long will you allow our friend here to derail threads with his inside shourshes on every matter under the sun?!

 

[RescueRanger]

@RescueRanger


how long will you allow our friend here to derail threads with his inside shourshes on every matter under the sun?!

I'll thread ban him brother. If he acts up in any other threads unnecessarily just report it.

 

[Deino]

Andreas - Buddy, I think I might know a few details that aren't on "X" or other media platforms yet. To truly answer your and some other members questions about "Chin will not give TOT for an engine" and "PFX will never have a stealth outcome", I will have to use a "Time Machine" to fast forward to 2028 and show you the future. I don't have that time machine. If anyone has it, please take us into 2028.
Otherwise, we'll all just wait and watch the news to come on media as things happen. The strategy is already built and one builds a long term strategy after making sure it will get X,Y,Z from supplier A,B,C. If you read my posts, I keep mentioning 2028 year again and again.

The ONLY situation where Pakistan will NOT show further interest in Chinese engines is *IF* Turkiye gets its TF-35000 built and if PFX gets design and avionics input from the KAAN project into its PFX project and Turkiye offers Pakistan TOT instead.

Do note, we have over 200 engineers helping with the KAAN project for over 2 years now and also have few dozen senior engineers trained in China working on some projects also. So the bottom line is, the PFX project will have both long term goals met, 1: to produce a stealthy jet for the PAF and 2: An engine with TOT locally produced.

My friend - and I‘m sorry since I don‘t know your name - I‘m well aware that I do not know everything and that there are things other - maybe like you - know better! But I think I have a pretty decent understanding on how China acts and at least by all i know know I rate this option not only unlikely but almost impossible.

Maybe we both should chat one day in person or at least via PM and I hope you can teach me a few things …

Otherwise yes, let‘S wait until 2028.

 

[hodor]

So again long story short: CHINA WILL NOT SUPPLY ENGINES FOR KAAN TO TURKEY!

It would be wrong to speak with certainty on this matter. I believe that China could provide us with engines

 

[Deino]

It would be wrong to speak with certainty on this matter. I believe that China could provide us with engines

Give me please ONE reason!

China has worked on its engine technology for decades, invested billions, and is now finally (almost) at its goal. There's simply no interest—even for billions of dollars— to deliver its latest high-end engines to a rather loosely connected but otherwise not particularly close country, namely Turkey. In fact it is exactly the opposite; it has NO interest in strengthening a potential future product on the export market.

And that's precisely the point; WHAT INTEREST or ADVANTAGE would China have?

Again, the answer is: None! It's not going to build a potential competitor—especially not with high-end engines—if it can simply sell more J-35s itself.

 

[Path-Finder]

defence comedy matrix has shattered Pakistan's 5th Gen dream!

 

[Trailer23]

Could we PLEASE-PLEASE-PLEASE keep JF-17 (which ever variant - including PFX) out of this Topic.

The Topic is Turkish-made Jets. Just 'cause its our own Pakistani Forum, doesn't mean we have to stick our stuff everywhere.

As for Chinese-made Engines...

Look, unless both Turkey & China come on a table to discuss things like an Engine, I see no reason to bring the WS-10 in the conversation unless its used for comparing between other Engines.