J-31 to be inducted soon| Pilot training reportedly in progress

[Michael]

I think you totally misunderstood my post … I never said, there will only be one prototype - in fact if you look at all other comparable Chinese fighter projects, there have been at least 6 or more - the point is only, at the moment we have at best four J-35 and only one J-31 prototype confirmed by now. As such I full agree with you there will be more until it receives its certification, but to assume there are already more J-31 prototypes - even more so with the first one flying only since last year is a claims for which we we have no proof.

In essence to claim there are already more now based on nothing and then to conclude it is ready for service in Pakistan soon can only be wrong!
I have friends, who are monitoring SAC almost 24/7 and there not more prototypes known, which would suggest more than those known already and lesser that LRIP was already initiated.
Hey, even the flight test phase from the first prototype to service entry of the J-20 was exceptionally short (less than 7 years), so we should give the J-35 and even more so the J-31 with being 2 years later at least a similar period of testing which would still be quick and result in a service realistically by around 2028, but surely not in late 2025 in Pakistan .

Based on the publicly available information:The research on the J20 and FC31 was initiated simultaneously. Due to the J20 winning the competition and receiving funding support from the PLA, its research progressed quickly. The FC31 failed in the competition, and in order not to abandon the aircraft, the SAC raised funds independently to continue its development, but it is clear that it cannot match the J20's development speed.

According to PLA practice, when new technology is first applied, it undergoes many, many tests, so the initial phase is always very slow. Once these technologies are corrected and confirmed, large-scale rapid production begins and is transplanted to similar equipment.

The PLA Navy's 052 series destroyers were initially built very slowly with a few different small models. By the time of the 052D type, the technology had matured, and large-scale production began. By the time of the 055 type, the first batch directly included 8 ships.

The J10A had a certain scale of production. With the J10B, which used many new technologies, the production scale was only in the dozens. With the J10C, large-scale production began.

Such examples can be easily found in the development of PLA military equipment. Many pieces of equipment are only known to the public after they have already been in service. For example, the carrier-based hypersonic anti-ship missile YJ21 was first known to exist through live-fire videos on the 055 destroyer.

The current J31 incorporates many mature technologies from the J20. It is fully capable of proceeding to large-scale production. The biggest obstacle is the WS19 engine. Is this engine reliable? Can the factory produce it on a large scale? Whether SAC is willing to shift its factory capacity to the J31 depends on order demand.

I have some understanding of the 624 Research Institute. Judging from the perspective of today’s Chinese, their work efficiency is quite low. This has led to a slower progress for the WS19. I suppose it might be due to insufficient funding from AECC!

If the PAF orders dozens of J31s and has a higher delivery priority than the PLAAF, it is possible that the PAF could receive the first batch of J31s by the end of next year. Of course, this is just my guess. It mainly depends on the results of negotiations between the PAF, SAC, and PLAAF.

 

[Michael]

My English level is very poor. All of my statements on the PDF were published after being translated by machine.

I do not know if these translations accurately express my true thoughts.

If they cause any misunderstanding, I sincerely apologize.

 

[Taimoor]

So no idea what equipment it has, what are it's specs, how far it has been tested or anything to be honest, but already people just want to assume that "it will be very close to the F-35 if not better".

I can already see the Pakistani fanboys announcing that is better than F-35 is all respects if and when it enters PAF service.

Not sure how people are comparing to F35, which is single engine. J31 is more closer to F22. Certainly higher specs then F35.

 

[Taimoor]

The current J31 incorporates many mature technologies from the J20. It is fully capable of proceeding to large-scale production

This is it.

My understanding is, even JF17 blk3 and J10Cs borrow tech from J20.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

Based on the publicly available information:

The research on the J20 and FC31 was initiated simultaneously. Due to the J20 winning the competition and receiving funding support from the PLA, its research progressed quickly. The FC31 failed in the competition, and in order not to abandon the aircraft, the SAC raised funds independently to continue its development, but it is clear that it cannot match the J20's development speed.

According to PLA practice, when new technology is first applied, it undergoes many, many tests, so the initial phase is always very slow. Once these technologies are corrected and confirmed, large-scale rapid production begins and is transplanted to similar equipment.

The PLA Navy's 052 series destroyers were initially built very slowly with a few different small models. By the time of the 052D type, the technology had matured, and large-scale production began. By the time of the 055 type, the first batch directly included 8 ships.

The J10A had a certain scale of production. With the J10B, which used many new technologies, the production scale was only in the dozens. With the J10C, large-scale production began.

Such examples can be easily found in the development of PLA military equipment. Many pieces of equipment are only known to the public after they have already been in service. For example, the carrier-based hypersonic anti-ship missile YJ21 was first known to exist through live-fire videos on the 055 destroyer.

The current J31 incorporates many mature technologies from the J20. It is fully capable of proceeading to large-scale production. The biggest obstacle is the WS19 engine. Is this engine reliable? Can the factory produce it on a large scale? Whether SAC is willing to shift its factory capacity to the J31 m m o B v b b m.. depends on order demand.

I have some understanding of the 624 Research Institute. Judging from the perspective of today’s Chinese, their work efficiency is quite low. This has led to a slower progress for the WS19. I suppose it might be due to insufficient funding from AECC!

If the PAF orders dozens of J31s and has a higher delivery priority than the PLAAF, it is possible that the PAF could receive the first batch of J31s by the end of next year. Of course, this is just my guess. It mainly depends on the results of negotiations between the PAF, SAC, and PLAAF.

No FC31/J31 was not the competitor to J20 but SAC put tri-plane design with stealth features similar to Su-57 as a competitor of J20 not FC31/J31, so correct your information brother

 

[Zarvan]

So no idea what equipment it has, what are it's specs, how far it has been tested or anything to be honest, but already people just want to assume that "it will be very close to the F-35 if not better".

I can already see the Pakistani fanboys announcing that is better than F-35 is all respects if and when it enters PAF service.

It could be better than F-35 it could be equal, or it could be slightly less. What I know is Pakistan doesn't go for anything until and unless they are sure of the quality. Z-10 ME is also not here because we are looking for something to get right then we would induct it. When it comes it would be a beast for sure and a true 5th Generation Fighter Jet. PAF doesn't compromise on those things. Now my assumption that it would come soon like in two years is based on the fact that Air Chief announced that we are going for these. Air Chief doesn't say these things until they are coming soon.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

Not sure how people are comparing to F35, which is single engine. J31 is more closer to F22. Certainly higher specs then F35.

In weight and engine thrust class J31 closer to F35 than f22, J31 uses 2 medium class engine with combine thrust of single f-135 engine on F35, f22 is bigger than J31 and have high thrust class engine compared to J31s medium thrust class engine and also F-22 fits in the category of heavy 5th gen jets like J20 and Su-57 whereas J31 fits in the category of medium class 5th gen jets like F35/KF21 and Indian upcoming medium weight 5th gen jet AMCA

So J31 is not comparable to F-22 but F35 but I agree J31 is more oriented toward air superiority than F35

 

[Taimoor]

In weight and engine thrust class J31 closer to F35 than f22, J31 uses 2 medium class engine with combine thrust of single f-135 engine on F35, f22 is bigger than J31 and have high thrust class engine compared to J31s medium thrust class engine and also F-22 fits in the category of heavy 5th gen jets like J20 and Su-57 whereas J31 fits in the category of medium class 5th gen jets like F35/KF21 and Indian upcoming medium weight 5th gen jet AMCA

So J31 is not comparable to F-22 but F35 but I agree J31 is more oriented toward air superiority than F35

In all other specs, apart from what you mentioned, J31 is superior to F35. It sits some where between f35 and F22, but closer to F22 then F35. So this comparison with F35 is rather silly.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

In all other specs, apart from what you mentioned, J31 is superior to F35. It sits some where between f35 and F22, but closer to F22 then F35. So this comparison with F35 is rather silly.

And how do you know it's superior to F35? And closer to F22 then F35? J31 is long way to go to be matured , its still in testing phase, no one knows its capability right now, you're just speculating

 

[Taimoor]

And how do you know it's superior to F35? And closer to F22 then F35? J31 is long way to go to be matured , its still in testing phase, no one knows its capability right now, you're just speculating

J31:

• Length: 17.3 m (56 ft 9 in)
• Wingspan: 11.5 m (37 ft 9 in)
• Height: 4.8 m (15 ft 9 in)
• Wing area: 50 m2 (540 sq ft) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenyang_FC-31#cite_note-zhihu-72"><span>[</span>72<span>]</span></a>
• Max takeoff weight: 28,000 kg (61,729 lb) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenyang_FC-31#cite_note-fisher_2016-11-09-73"><span>[</span>73<span>]</span></a>
• Powerplant: 2 × WS-13 afterburning turbofans, 56.75 kN (12,760 lbf) thrust each dry, 87.2 kN (19,600 lbf) with afterburner

Performance

• Maximum speed:Mach 1.8 at high altitude
  • Mach 1.14 (1,400 km/h, 870 mph) at sea level
• Combat range: 1,200 km (750 mi, 650 nmi) on internal fuel, or 1,900 kilometres (1,200 mi) with aerial refueling
• Service ceiling: 16,000 m (52,000 ft)

F35:

• Length: 51.4 ft (15.7 m)
• Wingspan: 35 ft (11 m)
• Height: 14.4 ft (4.4 m)
• Wing area: 460 sq ft (43 m2)
• Aspect ratio: 2.66
• Empty weight: 29,300 lb (13,290 kg)
• Gross weight: 49,540 lb (22,471 kg)
• Max takeoff weight: 65,918 lb (29,900 kg) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-35_Lightning_II#cite_note-486"><span>[</span>470<span>]</span></a>
• Fuel capacity: 18,250 lb (8,278 kg) internal
• Powerplant: 1 × Pratt & Whitney F135-PW-100 afterburning turbofan, 28,000 lbf (125 kN) thrust dry, 43,000 lbf (191 kN) with afterburner

Performance

• Maximum speed:Mach 1.6 at high altitude
  • Mach 1.06, 700 knots (806 mph; 1,296 km/h) at sea level
• Range: 1,500 nmi (1,700 mi, 2,800 km)
• Combat range:669 nmi (770 mi, 1,239 km) interdiction mission (air-to-surface) on internal fuel
  • 760 nmi (870 mi; 1,410 km), air-to-air configuration on internal fuel<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-35_Lightning_II#cite_note-Gary_North_Vice_President_Lockheed_Martin_–_Presentation_to_Israel_(2016)-487"><span>[</span>471<span>]</span></a>
• Service ceiling: 50,000 ft (15,000 m)

I am sure you can tell? Length, wingspan, height, wingarea, max speed, ceiling....... I mean even physical specs are higher then F35. And yes, there is a lot unknown about j31 but what is not unknow that its a much bigger aircraft. Its a educated guess, that it will be much higher spec then F35. And since its a brand new plan, then the question should be , can it equal or even outstrip F22 when it comes to tech. Personally, I am more inclined towards F22 as the benchmark for J31 then F35.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

J31:

• Length: 17.3 m (56 ft 9 in)
• Wingspan: 11.5 m (37 ft 9 in)
• Height: 4.8 m (15 ft 9 in)
• Wing area: 50 m2 (540 sq ft) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenyang_FC-31#cite_note-zhihu-72"><span>[</span>72<span>]</span></a>
• Max takeoff weight: 28,000 kg (61,729 lb) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenyang_FC-31#cite_note-fisher_2016-11-09-73"><span>[</span>73<span>]</span></a>
• Powerplant: 2 × WS-13 afterburning turbofans, 56.75 kN (12,760 lbf) thrust each dry, 87.2 kN (19,600 lbf) with afterburner

Performance

• Maximum speed:Mach 1.8 at high altitude
  • Mach 1.14 (1,400 km/h, 870 mph) at sea level
• Combat range: 1,200 km (750 mi, 650 nmi) on internal fuel, or 1,900 kilometres (1,200 mi) with aerial refueling
• Service ceiling: 16,000 m (52,000 ft)

F35:

• Length: 51.4 ft (15.7 m)
• Wingspan: 35 ft (11 m)
• Height: 14.4 ft (4.4 m)
• Wing area: 460 sq ft (43 m2)
• Aspect ratio: 2.66
• Empty weight: 29,300 lb (13,290 kg)
• Gross weight: 49,540 lb (22,471 kg)
• Max takeoff weight: 65,918 lb (29,900 kg) <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-35_Lightning_II#cite_note-486"><span>[</span>470<span>]</span></a>
• Fuel capacity: 18,250 lb (8,278 kg) internal
• Powerplant: 1 × Pratt & Whitney F135-PW-100 afterburning turbofan, 28,000 lbf (125 kN) thrust dry, 43,000 lbf (191 kN) with afterburner

Performance

• Maximum speed:Mach 1.6 at high altitude
  • Mach 1.06, 700 knots (806 mph; 1,296 km/h) at sea level
• Range: 1,500 nmi (1,700 mi, 2,800 km)
• Combat range:669 nmi (770 mi, 1,239 km) interdiction mission (air-to-surface) on internal fuel
  • 760 nmi (870 mi; 1,410 km), air-to-air configuration on internal fuel<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockh...ed_Martin_–_Presentation_to_Israel_(2016)-487"><span>[</span>471<span>]</span></a>
• Service ceiling: 50,000 ft (15,000 m)

I am sure you can tell? Length, wingspan, height, wingarea, max speed, ceiling....... I mean even physical specs are higher in F35. And yes, there is a lot unknown about j31 but what is not unknow that its a much bigger aircraft. Its a educated guess, that it will be much higher spec then F35. And since its a brand new plan, then the question should be , can it equal or even outstrip F22 when it comes to tech. Personally, I am more inclined towards F22 as the benchmark for J31 then F35.

Thats prove my point that J31 closer to F35 then F-22

You read the specs of both jets before posting? Its almost a match few differences don't matter much

F-22 can supercruise and reach higher altitude ( 65,000 feet) top speed is higher then both jets whereas both jets has lower specs then F-22 in every senses

Size wise F-22 lot bigger than both jets, difference between F35 and J31 is minimal ( 51 feet F35) vs (56 feet J31)
Same goes to other specs of both jets (F35/J31)


Thanks to proving my point that J31 is closer then F35 then F-22

And last J31 yet to show the capability of supercruise like F22 has probably it never have supercruise or limited supercruise capability like F35 has with current or upcoming WS19 engine

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

PAF should shove its assets up its arse if can't use 'em to protect civilians and soldier from kunis. Stop hyping this bs.

Stop blabbering and don't bring politics in every threads you're reported to being off topic

 

[Michael]

No FC31/J31 was not the competitor to J20 but SAC put tri-plane design with stealth features similar to Su-57 as a competitor of J20 not FC31/J31, so correct your information brother

I just took a closer look. As you said, it's me who has a memory error.

CAC bidding scheme code name "威龙"; The SAC bidding scheme is codenamed "雪鸮".

In the end, CAC's proposal was successful, and PLAAF was awarded the "J20" designation and received a PLA grant. After the successful first flight in 2011, it developed rapidly. Today, a large number of PLAAF equipment is used.

SAC's design thinking has been greatly influenced by its long-term cooperation with the Sukhoi Design Bureau. "雪鸮" was affected by the Su-37. This is a big gap with PLAAF's analysis of future wars, which ultimately led to the failure of the "雪鸮" program. After the failure of SAC, in order to ensure the future survival of the enterprise, the original plan was reversed and a new plan was redesigned - "鹘鹰", which was planned to be used for export under the code name FC-31. The first flight was successful in 2012.

Then, after the success of its first flight, the FC-31 has been slow for many years for a number of reasons. It was only in recent years that the PLA Navy intervened, and the FC-31 was reborn. The development direction of J31 (Air Force Version) / J35 (Navy Version) was finalized. At the same time, CAC has transferred a large number of mature advanced technologies operating on the J20 to SAC for use in this aircraft, accelerating its development progress.


Left is "雪鸮", Right is "威龙"

 

[Taimoor]

Thats prove my point that J31 closer to F35 then F-22

You read the specs of both jets before posting? Its almost a match few differences don't matter much

F-22 can supercruise and reach higher altitude ( 65,000 feet) top speed is higher then both jets whereas both jets has lower specs then F-22 in every senses

Size wise F-22 lot bigger than both jets, difference between F35 and J31 is minimal ( 51 feet F35) vs (56 feet J31)
Same goes to other specs of both jets (F35/J31)


Thanks to proving my point that J31 is closer then F35 then F-22

And last J31 yet to show the capability of supercruise like F22 has probably it never have supercruise or limited supercruise capability like F35 has with current or upcoming WS19 engine

On many specs, J31 is better then F35. I already shown you few. Put it this way, you dont want to face J31 in F35, J31 will look you first and shot you first thanks to edge in speed and ceiling, and perhaps better A2A weapons. You rather be in F22.

Comparing to F35 doesnt make sense as J31 sits between F22 and F35. Thats why I was careful on using term "benchmark". You dont want to benchmark with something which is lower in hierarchy.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

On many specs, J31 is better then F35. I already shown you few. Put it this way, you dont want to face J31 in F35, J31 will look you first and shot you first thanks to edge in speed and ceiling, and perhaps better A2A weapons. You rather be in F22.

Comparing to F35 doesnt make sense as J31 sits between F22 and F35. Thats why I was careful on using term "benchmark". You dont want to benchmark with something which is lower in hierarchy.

Lol, so F35 doesn't have the capability to LOOK YOU FIRST SHOOT YOU FIRST LOL
YOU'RE QUOTING 4TH GEN FIGHTER JET TERMS WHERE COLD WAR WAS IN ITS HIGHEST (LATE 60S AND EARLY 70S)

EVERY FIGHTER JET IS DESIGN AND DEVELOP ON THAT PHILOSOPHY SINCE LATE 60S AND EARLY 70S

AND CAN I POST THE SPECIFICATIONS OF F-22 KIDDOS?

AND WHY CHINA NEEDS ANOTHER 5TH GEN PURE AIR SUPERIORITY JETS IF THEY HAVE J20 IN THEIR ARSENAL, THINK ABOUT IT KIDDOS