Bangladesh Air Force

[LeonBlack08]

Those programs should be cancelled or revised at least. Let me explain why I think so.

In some way, they were kind of like BAL's mega development projects that shows some visible modernization, but not exactly what we need. I mean, yes we do need advanced new generation fighters and frigates ultimately, but not now. There are prerequisites lacking that are imperative to utilize said fighters and frigates to their intended roles within national defense strategy.

First, there are limited funds, hence it should be allocated based on priority need. Both fighter and frigate programs combined were projected to cost $5-5.5 billions at least. ($3 billions for Eurfighter and $2.5 billions for the frigates)

And I can guarantee you, given the state of forex right now we simply won't afford that much USD to spend on defense procurement in next 2/3 years. Yet, the armed force modernization already been delayed too long. So, what do we do?

Realistically, perhaps around $2 billions fund can allocated within short term. And those prerequisites I mentioned previously are, first and foremost long range high altitude air and missile defense system. (AMD)

Otherwise, if we spend huge sum of $3 billions on super expensive 16x Eurofighters. Yet most of those are destroyed on the ground by intensive enemy missile strikes of all kinds, specially BMs in the early hours of the conflict before they make to the fight in the sky, imagine how tremendous the moral and the capability loss it would be. And that huge sum of money would be wasted. Like this-

https://twitter.com/x/status/1807855178386694413

Hence, it would be much more adequate to procure at least 2x batteries of fully BMD capable long range AD system. SAMP/T NG from Italy or France is the right choice as we won't afford MIM-104 patriot. Two batteries would cost around $1 billions.

And obviously, those are not just about protecting air bases where future expensive fighters will be housed. Long range high altitude AMD systems is much more than that. It provides protection to ground formations against enemy air and missile threats. Its protective air bubbles is more capable of keeping enemy air assets at bay compared to traditional fighter interceptors. How?

Well, 16x Eurfighters maybe able to take on 32x IAF jets leveraging its qualitative advantage if they makes it to the fight in the sky, (Which it won't if there isn't any AMD system protecting them on the ground to begin with) but then IAF has far more assets to throw at our 16x Eurofighters and they will simply overwhelm them in the end.

On the other hand, hit to kill capable AMD system can withstand intense enemy air and missile strikes until the last interceptor. (specially ballistic missiles, which are a huge threat and can't be shot down by fighter jets) We saw how well system like Patriot and SAMP/T is performing in Ukraine. Fending of intense air raids and keeping mighty Russian air force from gaining air superiority.

In a nutshell, modern AMD provides more bang for the bucks compared to expensive fighter jets. And as of now simply we can't afford both. So, it is clear which one we need to prioritize.

One could argue, unlike AMD systems, fighter jets provide offensive capabilities to destroy enemy formation and air assets on the ground. It is true, however, 16x Eurofighters are too few and would be eliminated by IAF long before they could do any of it at scale.

On the other hand, we can leave the offensive capabilities to army's long range operational and strategic artillery capabilities and invest more in it. System like TRG-300 GMLRS and Khan tactical ballistic missiles batteries when despersed are much more survivable and hard to find and kill. Those would be much efficient and offer persistent and greater volume of firepower compare to what 16x can potentially carry. We saw that with HIMARS and ATACMS's outstanding performance in Ukraine.

And given the proximity of IAF Eastern command's air bases to our geography, it is the most optimized solution. Also, I believe Myanmar can be deterred with our long range surface to surface fires.

And frankly, in the long run we should look to procure BVR capable stealth UCAV instead of traditional super expensive 4.5th fighters. The only advantage Eurfighter has over something like Baykar Kızılelma, is higher payload and longer range. Both are relevant if we are planning to bomb Delhi, but we aren't. Also, keep in mind that we are never going to match IAF in one to one.

Our main goal is to prevent enemy air superiority. Given its stealth advantage, Kızılelma is better fit for the role as we have a very small airspace to defend. Also, we can procure 3x of it for the cost of a single Eurofighters. And unlike Eurofighters those have much smaller logistical footprint and can potentially be operated from highways. Reducing the risk of being destroyed at ground.

As for the navy, we should allocate $1 billion to modern AIP submarine procurement instead of the frigate program. @LeonBlack08 @Joe Shearer

Absolutely agree.

Multi layered SAMs of quality and quantity are the first priority. Without effective SAMs, no point buying EFT. We can never match Indian assets head to head, so the best we can do is create effective deterrent to discourage any overly enthusiastic war fanatic across the border. As @Joe Shearer dada aptly put it as poisoned shrimp strategy.

Everyone knows this is the most effective strategy to defend an invasion and this is why we have not seen acquisition of any mid and long range SAMs, just token short range FM 90s. It has been intentionally left weakened by the BAL regime.

Also agree with enhancing land offensive capabilities by bolstering missile and drone arsenal, which can be mass produced locally and cost effectively. We just need to see the example of Israel- Hezbollah. That's the modern day blue print for a smaller country defending against a regional power. Focus on force multipliers. Cheaper yet high impact solutions. So again I agree that we should eventually move towards Turkish/Chinese UCAVs, when those platforms are fully operational and battle tested.

We will still need some manned fighters because we do have to fight a different war, a more conventional war, with the Burmese if it ever comes to that. Burmese also have strategic depth and we do need to be able to get into their airspace, long range missiles alone won't work effectively. Russia has demonstrated how effective dumb bombs can be with a relatively inexpensive guidance kit to be converted to glide bombs and accurately destroy enemy installation compared to BMs alone, which are far more expensive and not value for money in a prolonged war. We will need a potent fighter platform to effectively execute a similar strategy.

The other very important reason we will need conventional jets is for redundancy. What if the UCAVs are hacked? We can never guarantee a hack proof system. That is why we will always need a mix of manned and unmanned aerial assets to defend the airspace.

 

[LeonBlack08]

I don't know if you guys were following this, but there are some good news regarding BAF's air and missile defense capability development.

This is from the article 'ENHANCEMENT OF AIR DEFENCE CAPABILITY OF BANGLADESH THROUGH UTILIZATION OF BANGABANDHU SATELLITE' published in Armed Forces Division journal.

"Should the AD assets of Bangladesh Army and Navy be integrated with BAF AD assets? Officer Commanding ADOC opined that considering the threat, capabilities of own system and geography of Bangladesh, all the AD elements of Bangladesh should be integrated in to a single network. Director of DNW&EE also expressed similar opinion of integrating all AD assets. Integration of all AD assets, specially the naval assets, will also facilitate Air Defence Identification Zone (ADIZ) implementation process. Survey results found strong consensus among the participants of three services that all the AD assets should be integrated into a single network. The mode of the response was ‘Strongly Agree’. Kruskal- Wallis test also reinforced the finding statistically.

Current State of Integration Basing on the primary data this study found that BAF initiated project for AD system integration will connect all the BAF sensors to ADOC through fiber optic/microwave link. BN initiated project will integrate naval AD assets Maritime Operation Center by TDL. BAF initiated project has the capability of future expansion that means this project has the prospect of connecting all AD assets of Bangladesh to create an integrated AD system for Bangladesh provided suitable communication means are utilized.

Multi-Vendor Equipment: Recent procurement plan of BAF indicates that in near future, few Western origin sensors are likely to enter BAF’s inventory. Latest Naval sensors are of Western origin and can support digital data. Quantum share of the Army sensors are from China. Equipment from multiple vendors differ in terms of interface, communication protocol which pose significant challenges for integration.

Mitigation for Multi-Vendor Equipment: It is expected that, BAF initiated project for AD integration will support multiple protocols that means the system will have the capability to equipment from different manufactures. However, interfacing with specific sensor would require befitting interfacing equipment which may be sourced from vendors."

---

Remember, Proper integration within service and between services is crucial to the operational success of Air and Missile defense. Integration maximizes the capabilities of individual systems and compensate for its vulnerabilities by combining different sensors, interceptors and decision makers into a single network enabled redundant architecture. Each system having access to the combined air picture allows Early Warning, better readiness, and efficient engagement of threats.

Now get this, BAF's integrared air and missile defense project mentioned in the article has finally come to fruition.

When I saw it at display at MHD-2024, i thought it was some sort of simulator. I had a hard time believing what was in front of my eyes. BAF having a comprehensive air defense system integration?! Sounded too good to be true. But after rereading this old article, I realized, woah, this is legit! Also, there was an MoD report that mentioned AD system integration. But didn't clarify the scope of it.


As mentioned in the article, 'BAF initiated project for AD integration will support multiple protocols that means the system will have the capability to equipment from different manufactures.' that means BAF's new Air Defence system integration can integrate all types of sensors in BAF inventory. Including–

2x Thales GM403 GaN based AESA radars.

1x RAT-31DL AESA radar

1x (potentially 6x) Leonardo Kronos Land AESA radar.

2x REL-4 AESA radar.

1x JH-16 AESA.

https://mod.portal.gov.bd/sites/default/files/files/mod.portal.gov.bd/page/7afd70bc_7a61_41e6_9437_c38258a525e8/Air_Force.pdf

Thales vend des radars high-tech au Bangladesh

Le groupe électronique a vendu deux radars à longue portée Ground Master 400 (plus de 450 km de portée) au Bangladesh.

www.latribune.fr

Bangladesh orders Leonardo’s high-tech air surveillance radar

www.leonardo.com

Also, any future air defense system purchased for BAF can be integrated with Artemis's Air Defence system integration.

Not only that, Army's recent Re-evaluation of Local Warning Radar (LWR) notice suggest that they are also planning for broader inter-service integration. Which is actually great.

(Notice how it's talking about Bangladesh Air defence network. Not Army AD network)

I hope they get Aselsan's new gen ALP radar which meets all the criteria. (+ Has additional capabilities that could be valuable for the Army)

One could think what we are supposed to do with so many radars without air defense missiles.

The answer is Passive Air and Missile Defense

Passive Air and Missile Defense techniques are crucial to the survivability of friendly formations and critical assets. Apart from the real possibility of existing active AMD systems being overwhelmed due to focused and saturated attack by the enemy, most Armed forces around the world often lack sufficient numbers of AMD systems to provide active protection to all of its formations. Speically when it comes to BMD and C-RAM. And for Bangladesh Armed forces, it lacks any type of active BMD or C-RAM capability as of now. Hence for Army, passive AMD is the only measure to preserve and protect its formations against these threats. Additionally, its AD capability against air breathing targets is significantly insufficient. Thus, making Passive AMD indispensable across the spectrum.

Passive Air and Missile Defense measures includes–

Detection and Early Warning. Timely detection and warning of air and missile threats provide reaction time to friendly forces to seek shelter or take appropriate actions.(JP 3-01) Specifically when it comes to BMD, long range land based sensors detects the threat when it appears on the horizon, tracks it and calculate the point of impact, subsequently generates alarms. Timely dissemination of these warnings require robust, secure and fast automated communication systems.

Bangladesh army is yet to have any long range sensing capability of its own to detect and track air and missile threats at ranges. Though, Local Warning Radar aquisiton initiative is set to change that. As mentioned above, BAF operates variety of long range state of art AESA sensors. That includes, 2x GM403, 1x RAT 31LD, 2x REL-4, 1x JH-16 & 1x JY-11B. These system are capable of effectively tracking air and missile threats at ranges. Proper Inter-service AMD system integration would enable Army to leverage these sensors to boost its early warning capability.

@Bengal71 @LeonBlack08 @AbuShalehRumi @Oscar @Joe Shearer

This is a great development, extremely critical to ensuring that effective multi layered AD system we were talking about. Thanks for sharing!

 

[UKBengali]

MRCA and 6 next generation frigates are out of question for next 2-3 years due to poor economy and so the focus should be on other systems that meet pressing needs while being affordable.

BD will have to ditch getting rapidly obsolette 4+ gen fighters and should set it's sights on Chinese J-31 and Turkey's next generation fighter for procurement in the 2030s, when they are avaiable and also as BD economy hopefully is rich enough to afford them.

So as suggested for a while both by others and myself, the most effective procurements right now and within BD's limited resources is both more TRG-300 Tiger MLRS and also an effective MRSAM system.

I don't think that SAMP-T is affordable in the numbers required as it will come to some 1 billion US dollars per piece. This is the price that BD will have to pay in order to account for profit for French/Italian manufacturer.

To make a difference then BD will have to purchase at least 3-4 units in order to protect vital civilian populations, military and economic targets as well. 3-4 billion US dollars is not what BD can afford anytime soon.

So it would be better for BD to go for a MRSAM network and the best would be something from Turkey like Hisar o which is just about medium range at 40km. It can in time order even more longer range Turkish SAM systems as they are available and BD's budget allows.

This procurement could come to some 1 billion US dollars now and BD will be able to find the money and concentrate on defending against Myanmar.

It needs to forget about "defending" from India for the time being in terms of air-defence as that is well outside its limited budgetary capabilities.

 

[AbuShalehRumi]

Those aren't Ballistic missile defense capable yet. BMD is indispensable for us.

We can buy and integrate Aster NT missiles in Turkish layered AD systems for BM interception. Both of them maintain NATO standards for interoperability. No?

SAMP/T NG is the best in this regard.

I think Turkish Sipar AD system (which has similar approach like EuroSam SAMP/T NG) is much better for us. Turkey just doesn't have ABM interceptor missile yet...

 

[Afif]

Absolutely agree.

Multi layered SAMs of quality and quantity are the first priority. Without effective SAMs, no point buying EFT. We can never match Indian assets head to head, so the best we can do is create effective deterrent to discourage any overly enthusiastic war fanatic across the border. As @Joe Shearer dada aptly put it as poisoned shrimp strategy.

Everyone knows this is the most effective strategy to defend an invasion and this is why we have not seen acquisition of any mid and long range SAMs, just token short range FM 90s. It has been intentionally left weakened by the BAL regime.

Also agree with enhancing land offensive capabilities by bolstering missile and drone arsenal, which can be mass produced locally and cost effectively. We just need to see the example of Israel- Hezbollah. That's the modern day blue print for a smaller country defending against a regional power. Focus on force multipliers. Cheaper yet high impact solutions. So again I agree that we should eventually move towards Turkish/Chinese UCAVs, when those platforms are fully operational and battle tested.

We will still need some manned fighters because we do have to fight a different war, a more conventional war, with the Burmese if it ever comes to that. Burmese also have strategic depth and we do need to be able to get into their airspace, long range missiles alone won't work effectively. Russia has demonstrated how effective dumb bombs can be with a relatively inexpensive guidance kit to be converted to glide bombs and accurately destroy enemy installation compared to BMs alone, which are far more expensive and not value for money in a prolonged war. We will need a potent fighter platform to effectively execute a similar strategy.

The other very important reason we will need conventional jets is for redundancy. What if the UCAVs are hacked? We can never guarantee a hack proof system. That is why we will always need a mix of manned and unmanned aerial assets to defend the airspace.

Well, I agree that eventually we would need manned fighter. But no, modern AI driven UCAV won't be hacked the same way we saw what Iran did with RQ-170. I could go into details later.

But for converting dumb bomb with precision guidance kit, there was a domestic project for that with the help of Chinese. Don't know what happened to it.

 

[Oscar]

I don't know if you guys were following this, but there are some good news regarding BAF's air and missile defense capability development.

This is from the article 'ENHANCEMENT OF AIR DEFENCE CAPABILITY OF BANGLADESH THROUGH UTILIZATION OF BANGABANDHU SATELLITE' published in Armed Forces Division journal.

"Should the AD assets of Bangladesh Army and Navy be integrated with BAF AD assets? Officer Commanding ADOC opined that considering the threat, capabilities of own system and geography of Bangladesh, all the AD elements of Bangladesh should be integrated in to a single network. Director of DNW&EE also expressed similar opinion of integrating all AD assets. Integration of all AD assets, specially the naval assets, will also facilitate Air Defence Identification Zone (ADIZ) implementation process. Survey results found strong consensus among the participants of three services that all the AD assets should be integrated into a single network. The mode of the response was ‘Strongly Agree’. Kruskal- Wallis test also reinforced the finding statistically.

Current State of Integration Basing on the primary data this study found that BAF initiated project for AD system integration will connect all the BAF sensors to ADOC through fiber optic/microwave link. BN initiated project will integrate naval AD assets Maritime Operation Center by TDL. BAF initiated project has the capability of future expansion that means this project has the prospect of connecting all AD assets of Bangladesh to create an integrated AD system for Bangladesh provided suitable communication means are utilized.

Multi-Vendor Equipment: Recent procurement plan of BAF indicates that in near future, few Western origin sensors are likely to enter BAF’s inventory. Latest Naval sensors are of Western origin and can support digital data. Quantum share of the Army sensors are from China. Equipment from multiple vendors differ in terms of interface, communication protocol which pose significant challenges for integration.

Mitigation for Multi-Vendor Equipment: It is expected that, BAF initiated project for AD integration will support multiple protocols that means the system will have the capability to equipment from different manufactures. However, interfacing with specific sensor would require befitting interfacing equipment which may be sourced from vendors."

---

Remember, Proper integration within service and between services is crucial to the operational success of Air and Missile defense. Integration maximizes the capabilities of individual systems and compensate for its vulnerabilities by combining different sensors, interceptors and decision makers into a single network enabled redundant architecture. Each system having access to the combined air picture allows Early Warning, better readiness, and efficient engagement of threats.

Now get this, BAF's integrared air and missile defense project mentioned in the article has finally come to fruition.

When I saw it at display at MHD-2024, i thought it was some sort of simulator. I had a hard time believing what was in front of my eyes. BAF having a comprehensive air defense system integration?! Sounded too good to be true. But after rereading this old article, I realized, woah, this is legit! Also, there was an MoD report that mentioned AD system integration. But didn't clarify the scope of it.


As mentioned in the article, 'BAF initiated project for AD integration will support multiple protocols that means the system will have the capability to equipment from different manufactures.' that means BAF's new Air Defence system integration can integrate all types of sensors in BAF inventory. Including–

2x Thales GM403 GaN based AESA radars.

1x RAT-31DL AESA radar

1x (potentially 6x) Leonardo Kronos Land AESA radar.

2x REL-4 AESA radar.

1x JH-16 AESA.

https://mod.portal.gov.bd/sites/default/files/files/mod.portal.gov.bd/page/7afd70bc_7a61_41e6_9437_c38258a525e8/Air_Force.pdf

Thales vend des radars high-tech au Bangladesh

Le groupe électronique a vendu deux radars à longue portée Ground Master 400 (plus de 450 km de portée) au Bangladesh.

www.latribune.fr

Bangladesh orders Leonardo’s high-tech air surveillance radar

www.leonardo.com

Also, any future air defense system purchased for BAF can be integrated with Artemis's Air Defence system integration.

Not only that, Army's recent Re-evaluation of Local Warning Radar (LWR) notice suggest that they are also planning for broader inter-service integration. Which is actually great.

(Notice how it's talking about Bangladesh Air defence network. Not Army AD network)

I hope they get Aselsan's new gen ALP radar which meets all the criteria. (+ Has additional capabilities that could be valuable for the Army)

One could think what we are supposed to do with so many radars without air defense missiles.

The answer is Passive Air and Missile Defense

Passive Air and Missile Defense techniques are crucial to the survivability of friendly formations and critical assets. Apart from the real possibility of existing active AMD systems being overwhelmed due to focused and saturated attack by the enemy, most Armed forces around the world often lack sufficient numbers of AMD systems to provide active protection to all of its formations. Speically when it comes to BMD and C-RAM. And for Bangladesh Armed forces, it lacks any type of active BMD or C-RAM capability as of now. Hence for Army, passive AMD is the only measure to preserve and protect its formations against these threats. Additionally, its AD capability against air breathing targets is significantly insufficient. Thus, making Passive AMD indispensable across the spectrum.

Passive Air and Missile Defense measures includes–

Detection and Early Warning. Timely detection and warning of air and missile threats provide reaction time to friendly forces to seek shelter or take appropriate actions.(JP 3-01) Specifically when it comes to BMD, long range land based sensors detects the threat when it appears on the horizon, tracks it and calculate the point of impact, subsequently generates alarms. Timely dissemination of these warnings require robust, secure and fast automated communication systems.

Bangladesh army is yet to have any long range sensing capability of its own to detect and track air and missile threats at ranges. Though, Local Warning Radar aquisiton initiative is set to change that. As mentioned above, BAF operates variety of long range state of art AESA sensors. That includes, 2x GM403, 1x RAT 31LD, 2x REL-4, 1x JH-16 & 1x JY-11B. These system are capable of effectively tracking air and missile threats at ranges. Proper Inter-service AMD system integration would enable Army to leverage these sensors to boost its early warning capability.

@Bengal71 @LeonBlack08 @AbuShalehRumi @Oscar @Joe Shearer

Is Artemis the Bangladesh ADA net?

 

[Afif]

Is Artemis the Bangladesh ADA net?

It's the name of the company that developed the system integration for BAF. Artemis Defense Technologies, UK.

 

[Oscar]

It's the name of the company that developed the system integration for BAF. Artemis Defense Technologies, UK.

What the BD equivalent and infra on the overall AD net?

It’s more a case of budget but at the end the ideal approach is the Swede one for BD - disperse the heck out of everything and have infra to rotate everything at multiple locations.

When everything is on the move - even with constant surveillance there is enough foliage and other natural camo to hide things around.

 

[LeonBlack08]

But for converting dumb bomb with precision guidance kit, there was a domestic project for that with the help of Chinese. Don't know what happened to it.

I think there a project to use Rocketsan's TEBER kits to convert dumb bombs in BAF.

Edit: The following reports Chinese LS-6 winged guidance kit as well.

TEBER Guidance Kit Boards Bangladeshi F-7 Fighters | TURDEF

Bangladesh has exhibited ROKETSAN’s TEBER laser + GPS guidance kit for Mk-81 and Mk-82 GPBs, set to be used on Chinese-made F-7BGI fighter jets.

turdef.com

 

[Afif]

What the BD equivalent and infra on the overall AD net?

So, radar systems like GM403, Kronos Land, REL-4M and JH-16B are mobile integrated through data links and fiber optics as of now. Those should be able to move around on short notice theoretically. However, as we know it is important to conduct regular exercise and training simulating such techniques and procedures. I don't know if they do it.

And more crucially, BAF needs clear and well defined warfigthing doctrine first. We don't seem to have that yet. Something like Army's doctrine command is desperately needed to institutionalize doctrinal development in BAF. It is still a painful weakness.

 

[ghazi52]

 

[Oscar]

So, radar systems like GM403, Kronos Land, REL-4M and JH-16B are mobile integrated through data links and fiber optics as of now. Those should be able to move around on short notice theoretically. However, as we know it is important to conduct regular exercise and training simulating such techniques and procedures. I don't know if they do it.

And more crucially, BAF needs clear and well defined warfigthing doctrine first. We don't seem to have that yet. Something like Army's doctrine command is desperately needed to institutionalize doctrinal development in BAF. It is still a painful weakness.

It is interesting that this is case since for what its worth the foundations of the BAF were some of the finest PAF had to offer and the culture still stems from the USAF hammering in of safety and exceptionalism.

 

[ghazi52]

 

[ghazi52]

 

[AbuShalehRumi]

.
Does this OSINT X handle has credibility?