Ex-Singapore Diplomat analysis on Pakistan with Pakistani journalists

[Hopefully Pessimistic]

So we've got people denying the feudal reality of Pakistan and unable to see what actual consequences it has on society and economy, others pretending it's all a lie and then some saying nothing the man says can be true cause one of his parent is Indian.

Amazing, a people coping about their own issues will never fix them

 

[omegalamba7xl9]

Some CHUTIYA so called professor just got famous by using Pakistan name, now the cow pee drinkers will flock around him like he is the new version of Einstein... Lol
Someone should've asked
Is drinking cow urine and eating cow dung are signs of shinning??? Lol... Professor knows PAKISTAN is always ready to stick it deep in his MOTHERLAND, hence the pain....

 

[c14-Isotope]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[El Sidd]

Stolen land?

Yes, it is nothing but stolen land.

Oh. By the way, talking about culture, we still have a much better culture than India. You guys thrives on exploring divisive religious and racial lines. My country probably has the best racial and religious harmony in the world, which you guys can never achieve in a thousand years.

Oppressive laws and systemic exploitation mixed with a smuggler's paradise is not culture. It's a dying ageing population needing immigration.

@El Sidd . Welcome to becoming an Indian.

These Poreans don't know how to use a website and aim to comment upon countries as big as Pakistan.

 

[PK781]

So we've got people denying the feudal reality of Pakistan and unable to see what actual consequences it has on society and economy, others pretending it's all a lie and then some saying nothing the man says can be true cause one of his parent is Indian.

Amazing, a people coping about their own issues will never fix them

Sir , hath houla rakho thora jya...

Our people cannot make the change they want, because somehow we're stuck in this "sensitive security situation" since forever with many hostile foreign countries as well as domestic feudal lords both suppressing our people.
If/when given the proper environment and opportunity, our people can do the same as other nations.
But if we're kept poor, illiterate/jahil,unemployed, lack of water/health/jobs etc then this happens.
the maintained status quo by the ghq/estb is not helping at all....

 

[Goenitz]

It goes back to what I said - if the hostile corner's existing or lack thereof do not impact how they live or don't live - what is the actual motivation?

I mean it depends. If I am worried about my self-esteem, I would back off way earlier. Essentially, there is no fear (from the public) which can threaten the elite.
It can be other motivations/incentive, like recognition, admiration, freedom to roam, etc. (depending on how high up on the Pyramid they want to be).

And you are being selective in that analogy - if I have nothing to do with the military - but am still a middle class individual "enjoying" a "routine" in G-11 or some place in Lahore or Multan or even Peshawar.

Essentially, any powerful family, constrained in a bubble. It would be like a jail, otherwise.
I can freely go around from Multan till Lahore to Attock, AJK, and GB. Other than that, I am afraid of decoits, street/highway robbers (more than the former areas), TTP, BLA, etc.
If people (elite's children) have resources, they want to explore, travel, etc.
Now, to make a micro environment: gyms, resorts, clubs, etc, or arranging escorts to reach these locations needs finance.
One thing has to give in.

EVERY OTHER ASPECT BESIDES ETHNIC OR RELIGIOUS HATRED HAS HAD NO LASTING IMPACT ON MOVING THIS KUTTA QAUM.

Story of the sub-continent. In India, people also won't protest about inflation, E20 fuel, female security as much as about Mandir, paracheen Baharat, hindu-muslim, seena k jawan, etc. Cricket also.

 

[Oscar]

I mean it depends. If I am worried about my self-esteem, I would back off way earlier. Essentially, there is no fear (from the public) which can threaten the elite.
It can be other motivations/incentive, like recognition, admiration, freedom to roam, etc. (depending on how high up on the Pyramid they want to be).

Essentially, any powerful family, constrained in a bubble. It would be like a jail, otherwise.
I can freely go around from Multan till Lahore to Attock, AJK, and GB. Other than that, I am afraid of decoits, street/highway robbers (more than the former areas), TTP, BLA, etc.
If people (elite's children) have resources, they want to explore, travel, etc.
Now, to make a micro environment: gyms, resorts, clubs, etc, or arranging escorts to reach these locations needs finance.
One thing has to give in.

Story of the sub-continent. In India, people also won't protest about inflation, E20 fuel, female security as much as about Mandir, paracheen Baharat, hindu-muslim, seena k jawan, etc. Cricket also.

You answered yourself - when the pyramid is already at the bottom rung - what else is there to motivate it.
Then there is a exit clause - those that want more than the bubbles and can afford it - exit Pakistan.

 

[Hopefully Pessimistic]

Sir , hath houla rakho thora jya...

Our people cannot make the change they want, because somehow we're stuck in this "sensitive security situation" since forever with many hostile foreign countries as well as domestic feudal lords both suppressing our people.
If/when given the proper environment and opportunity, our people can do the same as other nations.
But if we're kept poor, illiterate/jahil,unemployed, lack of water/health/jobs etc then this happens.
the maintained status quo by the ghq/estb is not helping at all....

100% we can thrive. My criticism should never be seen as believing we are incapable, it is criticism of structures that supress our potential which is why reform is neccessary. This is why criticism is neccessary to create that environment.

And of course the regional environment has been negative overall but domestically we haven't done nearly enough to how much we could have. Why do we allow feudalism to prevail still today which is one of our major bottlenecks, why rely on religious extremism for legitimacy? Thats something we've allowed.

 

[Goenitz]

You answered yourself - when the pyramid is already at the bottom rung - what else is there to motivate it.
Then there is a exit clause - those that want more than the bubbles and can afford it - exit Pakistan.

hmhm... Either some realisation should occur (to care more about reputation and acceptance than control or power grab), or it will be an expensive job like maintaining NATO forces in Afghanistan (still, the surroundings will not be that hostile).

 

[bafxet]

One of the most fundamental reasons is that even up to now, we haven't been able to evolve a system of governance.

Then, our burucracy is incompetent. It has become dysfunctional by succumbing to political pressure and rampant corruption. Economy Judiciary, Education, and Healthcare are in a state of shambles

It may be weird, but Pakistan is fortunate to have a neighbor like India and unfortunately to have a neighbor like Afghanistan.

See chasing India, we did wonders like we became a neuclear power.

On the other hand, Afghanistan gave us fundamentalism, guns, drugs, and miltancy.

 

[Oscar]

One of the most fundamental reasons is that even up to now, we haven't been able to evolve a system of governance.

Then, our burucracy is incompetent. It has become dysfunctional by succumbing to political pressure and rampant corruption. Economy Judiciary, Education, and Healthcare are in a state of shambles

It may be weird, but Pakistan is fortunate to have a neighbor like India and unfortunately to have a neighbor like Afghanistan.

See chasing India, we did wonders like we became a neuclear power.

On the other hand, Afghanistan gave us fundamentalism, guns, drugs, and miltancy.

Kabul prior to the Soviet invasion was more developed than any city in Pakistan - it was actually a vacation spot for most of KP compared to any Pakistani offerring.

The issue isn't India or Afghanistan - it is the by product of the overall elitist led movement that was in Pakistan and loss of your founding father with his primary vision for the future unlike India that led to the usual elites taking over.

 

[mythbuster]

Kabul prior to the Soviet invasion was more developed than any city in Pakistan - it was actually a vacation spot for most of KP compared to any Pakistani offerring.

The issue isn't India or Afghanistan - it is the by product of the overall elitist led movement that was in Pakistan and loss of your founding father with his primary vision for the future unlike India that led to the usual elites taking over.

I am not sure if it's elite take over that caused all the problems, rather I would say it's the destruction of the elite that led us to the path to hell .

 

[Oscar]

I am not sure if it's elite take over that caused all the problems, rather I would say it's the destruction of the elite that led us to the path to hell .

There was no destruction of the elite - its basically changing faces but the system remains the same.

Bhutto nationalization replaced one group with an eventual other group. The migrants from India were slowly replaced by Punjabis and Sindhis BUT the overall systemic structure remains the same.

 

[mythbuster]

There was no destruction of the elite - its basically changing faces but the system remains the same.

Bhutto nationalization replaced one group with an eventual other group. The migrants from India were slowly replaced by Punjabis and Sindhis BUT the overall systemic structure remains the same.

We have to define what actually an elite is , right now the definition is too vague or you can say even non existent.