HAL LCA Tejas: Updates, News & Discussions

[SiliconBit (silicon0000)]

Because the Brazilians have themselves stated that they're evaluating the Tejas. Lol. They're free to evaluate and negotiate with whosoever they wish to. It could be Lockheed for the F-16V, Dassault for the Rafale or even the Chinese for the J-10. That is their prerogative, as is their budget for the purchase.

One simple logic for having at least 2 different fighter types in service is to de risk one's fighter fleet. In the event that you have just 1 type in service and the country selling it to you decides to sanction you for whatever reason, you'll find you have no fighters left to fly.

You guys are acting as if someone on this forum is making up these articles. Even earlier, when the Brazilian Air Force chief himself stated that they were looking at the Tejas Mk1A, people on this forum were going nuts stating why would the Brazilians do that and mocking the Tejas. Despite the claim being made by the Brazilian Air Force chief himself!

Fact is that the Tejas is the closest modern 4th gen fighter in the F-5 class, apart from the JF-17. All other light fighters are essentially trainers modified to become fighters.

Tejas Mk1 is in service, and there's a contract for 83 in hand and another for 97 to come soon. That's 180 Tejas Mk1As on contract for HAL to deliver. So it's obvious that this is a type that will be in production for quite some time and will be supported for many years to come.

But the Tejas Mk1A is more modern and flies with an American engine that to an Air Force that has only flown Western fighters, is definitely more desirable than flying with a Russian RD-93 engine or a Chinese engine that is still in it's early years.

And it's also a fact that the Tejas Mk2 is now on course for prototype production and is almost guaranteed to enter IAF service. So it is for the Brazilians to take a call as to whether the Tejas Mk1A or Tejas Mk2 meet their needs and their timelines as well as their budget.

Dear I'm not making a judgment about whether Brazil will acquire Tejas or not. That's not my intention. I am in for an open discussion here. You mentioned that Brazil has requirements for two types of jets: Gripen and an "X" jet, which could be Tejas or another aircraft, even a 5th-generation fighter. While Brazil is open to evaluating various aircraft, they must have specific criteria. If diversification is the primary goal, both Tejas and Gripen rely on US engines, potentially exposing Brazil to sanctions/issues/delays etc. So In short, What I want to know is:

• What specific capabilities is Brazil seeking to add to its arsenal?
• How different aircraft, including Tejas, compare in terms of these capabilities.

 

[MirageBlue]

Dear I'm not making a judgment about whether Brazil will acquire Tejas or not. That's not my intention. I am in for an open discussion here. You mentioned that Brazil has requirements for two types of jets: Gripen and an "X" jet, which could be Tejas or another aircraft, even a 5th-generation fighter. While Brazil is open to evaluating various aircraft, they must have specific criteria. If diversification is the primary goal, both Tejas and Gripen rely on US engines, potentially exposing Brazil to sanctions/issues/delays etc. So In short, What I want to know is:

• What specific capabilities is Brazil seeking to add to its arsenal?
• How different aircraft, including Tejas, compare in terms of these capabilities.

Yes it could be whatever fighter the Brazilians think fits their requirements and budget.

I think budget is a key issue which will make 5th gen fighters a little hard to acquire and at least currently the situation in Latin America doesn't warrant spending billions on buying even 24 of any 5th gen fighter. For e.g. F-35. Even 24 of them will cost around $4 billion at least with infra, training, etc.

I don't see any point in debating on their requirements when we don't know which other types they are evaluating.

I know they were looking at second hand F-16s from the US many months ago, but I am not certain where those discussions have gone.

Besides, that probably should be done on another thread. This thread is to discuss Tejas specific topics.

 

[kmc_chacko]

Tejas Mk2 engines are to be produced in India itself.

As for Tejas Mk1A, GE will begin deliveries of the F-404 whenever their supply chain bottleneck is addressed.

F-404 is already delayed by 6 months, and it will be another 6 months to see whether they will fulfil their commitment and do you think procurement of Mk2 engine will be done smoothly considering the fact that engine for AMCA will be joint venture with France.

 

[Deino]

I really think you aren't half as smart as you think you are.

Saab has already proven it can deliver is it? Because they're European and their PR is strong?

Fact - the first Gripen E entered Brazilian service in 2022, a full 8 years after the deal was signed for 36 Gripen E/Fs in October 2014. The first F-39E was delivered to the Brazilians in December 2021, a full 7 years after the deal was signed.

So apparently Saab can "deliver" despite the fact that the first Gripen E first flew in FAB colors literally 5 years after contract signature?? Despite the fact that now, not even a single Gripen F will be assembled in Brazil but instead they've amended the contract so that all Gripen F's will be assembled at Linkoping?

The Saab Gripen E contract was signed by Brazil in 2014 and then a full 5 years later they had first flight. And now, even 10 years later it has not fully reached FOC. In fact it had it's first international exercise in 2024.

And to date, only 9 Gripen Es have been delivered, a full 10 years after the contract was signed! 27 more need to be delivered, all behind schedule.

Brazil's Gripen assembly line can apparently produce a total of 8 Gripen E/Fs per year. But of course, there hasn't yet been a single Gripen E rolled out of that assembly line.

HAL managed to fly the first Tejas Mk1A 38 months after contract signature instead of 36 months as per the contract they signed. A delay of 2 months. The issues with the GE F-404 engine are not HAL's fault, but entirely GE and it's supply chain related. Even as we speak, HAL is continuing to manufacture and assemble Tejas Mk1As, but they can't be delivered pending the F-404 engines from GE's side.

But then when is as anti Indian as you are, facts don't matter, simply rehashing and remixing your biases is all you do.

Fact is this- the Brazilians and Indians are discussing. YOU don't need to like it, it doesn't need to make any sense to YOU. Because you aren't someone who is any way involved with this discussion/negotiation between the Brazilians and Indians.

If the Brazilians find it doesn't suit their interests, they'll not go ahead with a deal. That is their prerogative. Why're you acting like this is some personal insult to you that they're in discussions?

No one is making up these articles on talks/discussions between the parties. It's happening, whether you like it or not.

Well, no offence, but if would reply in the same way like you, I could reply "You aren't half as dumb as I you thought!" ... well, but I do not!

You totally intentionally mis-read my post: NOT Brazil can deliver was my point, but Saab could, if the contract would have been signed that way. Yes, the delays with the Brazilian production (more an assmbly) line are true but not the point!

My point was, even before the Brazilian contract was signed, the regular Gripen was a mature system in service with a functioning production line in Sweden ... and now to HAL! The IAF is still waiting for the type it really wants and needs and HAL cannot meet even the own deliveries. The fact that the Mk.1A managed to fly "so early" after contract signature is more a contract related issue than a proof for Indian's or HAL's effectiveness in producing modern fighters on time.

And finally ... I really don't care if the are negotiation or not and in case they gt that unlikely contract, then it's fine. The point is however you and some others are already portraying these negotiations as a done deal and break-thru as if HAL is the same league like Saab is since decades ...

As such, let's deliver first the first Mk.1As in numbers and THEN talk ...

Tejas Mk2 engines are to be produced in India itself.

...

And here we go again: claiming something as a fact even if it isn't a signed deal yet!

 

[RealDeal]

India should market Teja as a target aircraft which other countries can use to test their 5th generation aircrafts and bvr missiles, it will get dozens of orders.

 

[Yasser76]

December now coming up, so safe to say not a single MK1A Tejas delivery will occur in 2024?

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

December now coming up, so safe to say not a single MK1A Tejas delivery will occur in 2024?

1st time - its not mistake of HAL

 

[Yasser76]

1st time - its not mistake of HAL

Were there any deliveires in 2023?

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

Were there any deliveires in 2023?

only Mk1 is delivered , total 32

but i believe airframe and other body part intregations—HAL is already working for Mk1a planes

once engine starts getting delivered, delivery of HAl mk1a will be in fast pace

Tejas Mk1A project: Engine delay forces defence firm to invoke contingency plan

To keep the production on track, HAL has opted for Category B engines, which are adequate for pre-delivery flight tests and ensure the aircraft remains in a flyable condition.

www.indiatoday.in

 

[Yasser76]

only Mk1 is delivered , total 32

but i believe airframe and other body part intregations—HAL is already working for Mk1a planes

once engine starts getting delivered, delivery of HAl mk1a will be in fast pace

Tejas Mk1A project: Engine delay forces defence firm to invoke contingency plan

To keep the production on track, HAL has opted for Category B engines, which are adequate for pre-delivery flight tests and ensure the aircraft remains in a flyable condition.

www.indiatoday.in

My point stands.

Not a single aircraft (MK1 or MK1A) as been delivered to the IAF in over 2 years.

Blame who you want, GE, HAL, IAF etc. The fact is a fact. Placing blame of foreigners means you will never learn to improve.

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

My point stands.

Not a single aircraft (MK1 or MK1A) as been delivered to the IAF in over 2 years.

Blame who you want, GE, HAL, IAF etc. The fact is a fact. Placing blame of foreigners means you will never learn to improve.

only 2-3 nations (US, france, Russia and might can now add china) only not depend on others.

Rest all countries depend on others; it does not mean they are not capable or improving; even China was importing engines and is still importing engines by today....

 

[Yasser76]

only 2-3 nations (US, france, Russia and might can now add china) only not depend on others.

Rest all countries depend on others; it does not mean they are not capable or improving; even China was importing engines and is still importing engines by today....

Name me one aircraft project in the history of mankind that had its first flight 24 years ago and 24 years later could not deliver a single aircraft to a user in a 24 month period (irrespective of who they depended on). See my point? This project is so so f**ked that it is hard to get ones head around just how screwed up things have become....

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

Name me one aircraft project in the history of mankind that had its first flight 24 years ago and 24 years later could not deliver a single aircraft to a user in a 24 month period (irrespective of who they depended on). See my point? This project is so so f**ked that it is hard to get ones head around just how screwed up things have become....

Hal Tejas is already flying....

I am not trolling that by saying , jf block 2 flying after 17 years of 1st fly by base aircraft ...

There is different between upgraded version and based version.... Even f16 block 70, fly after 30 years once based version was fly

Similar way - hal Tejas Mk1a is a upgraded version.

 

[Yasser76]

Hal Tejas is already flying....

I am not trolling that by saying , jf block 2 flying after 17 years of 1st fly by base aircraft ...

There is different between upgraded version and based version.... Even f16 block 70, fly after 30 years once based version was fly

Similar way - hal Tejas Mk1a is a upgraded version.

You missed the point, either deliberately or by ignorance. No project in history has got 25 years old and cannot deliver plans in a two year period. None. HAL Tejas is a world record breaker on this count.

 

[Raj-Hindustani]

You missed the point, either deliberately or by ignorance. No project in history has got 25 years old and cannot deliver plans in a two year period. None. HAL Tejas is a world record breaker on this count.

You deliberately trolling as I already said, Hal Tejas mk1 is already inducted and flying.

There is delayed on for upgraded version " Hal Tejas mk1a" now. And upgraded version testing started within past 2 years