India is incomplete without Pakistan: Indian Prime Minister Atal Bihari Vajapayee

[Baibers_1260]

Curious if you understand classic Hindi, and the terms Khandit Bharat,
"दिन दूर नहीं खंडित भारत को पुणा अखंड बनायेगें । "
"Din door nahin khandit bharat ko puna akhand banayegen".
( Trans: The day is not far when partitioned India will be reconstituted into the Greater India).
What exactly did ABV mean ?

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[Baibers_1260]

Much ado about nothing. Vajpayee visited Minar-e-Pakistan as a gesture of recognizing Pakistani sovereignty and nationhood. You are twisting his poetry into all sorts of un-intended meaning.

Not boasting, but I am fairly fluent in classical Sanskritized Hindi so "twisting " Vajpayee's poetry is not my mission. In fact I asked our Indian friends to clarify. I intend to post the entire translation of his poem in Roman Hindi, Urdu, and English with the Sanskrit words translated to the best of my ability.

Meanwhile I am awaiting an answer to my post below.

Post in thread 'India is incomplete without Pakistan: Indian Prime Minister Atal Bihari Vajapayee'
https://defencepk.com/forums/thread...ster-atal-bihari-vajapayee.30031/post-1116699

 

[rishi7887]

An Indians understanding of geography, history and culture is purely religious in nature. These people are the most religious people in the world. Every aspect of their lives is dictated by religion.

That is so not true. A 2022 Gallup International Association survey reported that 18% of Indians did not believe in God, encompassing both atheists and agnostics. The issue across the sub continent is that while these countries are trying to get their literacy rates up, no one is really focusing on the quality of education and most importantly developing critical thinking skills. A lot of urban Indians who grew up during the 90s and went to good private schools are already religion agnostic. They are the ones who are fighting it out against BJP's Hindutva ideology.

 

[Starlord]

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[samsite84]

Curious if you understand classic Hindi, and the terms Khandit Bharat,
"दिन दूर नहीं खंडित भारत को पुणा अखंड बनायेगें । "
"Din door nahin khandit bharat ko puna akhand banayegen".
( Trans: The day is not far when partitioned India will be reconstituted into the Greater India).
What exactly did ABV mean ?

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I will point to @Watandar 's reply. You're focusing on the poem vs the person's actual actions. Also, there is no evidence of India seeking Akhand Bharat - no incursion in Nepal, Bhutan, Bangladesh or Myanman even when Indian Army is unmatched vs those countries... Its hard to have a rational debate/discussion on PDF, pls don't make it harder by clutching to strawman type arguments...

 

[Baibers_1260]

I will point to @Watandar 's reply. You're focusing on the poem vs the person's actual actions. Also, there is no evidence of India seeking Akhand Bharat - no incursion in Nepal, Bhutan, Bangladesh or Myanman even when Indian Army is unmatched vs those countries... Its hard to have a rational debate/discussion on PDF, pls don't make it harder by clutching to strawman type arguments...

I was simply asking what ABV meant, and that is not the only instance, and he is not the only Prime Minister, or Defence Minister to make such statements, either through literature or officially in speeches.
For the record, ABV mentions, Gilgit, Pakhtoonistan ( ? ) Dhaka, Lahore and other places in Pakistan, not Nepal, or Bhutan,
If you say ABV doesn't really mean what he writes, then I will take that statement with a liberal dose of salt.
I am at work right now but I will give a detailed translation of his poem with no further comments.

 

[Master Chief]

I will point to @Watandar 's reply. You're focusing on the poem vs the person's actual actions. Also, there is no evidence of India seeking Akhand Bharat - no incursion in Nepal, Bhutan, Bangladesh or Myanman even when Indian Army is unmatched vs those countries... Its hard to have a rational debate/discussion on PDF, pls don't make it harder by clutching to strawman type arguments...

Have you ever heard of a man called Chanakiya?

Hindutva knows Pakistan is its greatest threat, therefore it will be a natural enemy of Pakistan. No effort from Pakistan is required to achieve this relationship. A clash is inevitable. Pakistan will preserve its history and the legacy of the subcontinental islamic awam, including that of the Mughals. Hindutva defines this legacy as a bastard legacy.

Golwalkar knew this. Gandhi and Nehru knew this. Jinnah knew this.

Why do you not  appear to be cognisant?

 

[c14-Isotope]

It's a poem and he's talking about Pakistan Azaad Kashmir which we claim as ours till date. We have enough people, we don't want 300 million more of the world's most radicalised and the most useless human resource on the planet.

 

[Baibers_1260]

Have you ever heard of a man called Chanakiya?

Hindutva knows Pakistan is its greatest threat, therefore it will be a natural enemy of Pakistan. No effort from Pakistan is required to achieve this relationship. A clash is inevitable. Pakistan will preserve its history and the legacy of the subcontinental islamic awam, including that of the Mughals. Hindutva defines this legacy as a bastard legacy.

Golwalkar knew this. Gandhi and Nehru knew this. Jinnah knew this.

Why do you not  appear to be cognisant?

It's not just Hindutva zealots but also the so called "secular " intellectuals of the Indian society across all sections, professionals, politicians, academia, journalists, all of them are hostile to the very existence of Pakistan. Nehru was no "dove" when it came to the issue of Pakistan and in fact achieved the greatest success in nearly strangling the nascent state out of existence right after Partition and Independence.
The only Indian Prime Minister ( ironically] who recognized the futility of confronting Pakistan, was Indira Gandhi who after a victorious intervention in East Pakistan realized that , that "victory" was a "one shot " deal. India's armed forces had a lack luster performance in the Western Theater, and India accepted a UN resolution for a ceasefire unilaterally. Unless there were concessions India would have to live forever with a hostile potentially nuclear armed Pakistan, for the foreseeable future. Indira Gandhi therefore went the extra-mile, and just 7 months after India's victory and literally signed away Azad Kashmir to Pakistan, accepting the 1971 ceasefire line as the Line of Control; essentially a de-facto border that remains unchanged as of today, Indira Gandhi had hoped that freezing the Kashmir conflict would open up India's access across Afghanistan into Central Asia, a long cherished dream. Her assassination and the rise of Hindutva were inevitable in the political dynamics that drives India. The rest as they say is history.

 

[Baibers_1260]

It's a poem and he's talking about Pakistan Azaad Kashmir which we claim as ours till date. We have enough people, we don't want 300 million more of the world's most radicalised and the most useless human resource on the planet.

He talks about Lahore and Dhaka too . So i guess he had plans to somehow take the territory without the people.
Question:
Does India claim Azaad Kashmir with or without the "useless and most radicalized human resource" on the planet?
Additionally, the 150 million Indian Muslims.. are they classified as "the most radicalized useless resource " on the planet also?

 

[Master Chief]

It's a poem and he's talking about Pakistan Azaad Kashmir which we claim as ours till date. We have enough people, we don't want 300 million more of the world's most radicalised and the most useless human resource on the planet.

Of course you don't wish to absorb our population.

Do you think that we think that you're actually this mad?

You have hardly 15% Muslim composition at present - why on earth would you wish to increase that?

For this reasoning, you could have absorbed Bangladesh half a century ago but you did not. Obviously you have enough musulmans of your own under watch, occasionally rattling their cages once in a while, interrupting your meditations.

However you did need to exert control over Bangladesh, to stifle the innate desires of those people for self determination - in short, vassalisation was the preferred option.

After all, while quietly butchering and replacing the Muslims of Jammu was a viable option in 1947's "fog of war" but butchering and replacing the Muslims of Bangladesh in 1971 wasn't feasible, nor would it ever be possible in Pakistan henceforth. It is vassalisation or other subjugations of our nation - that would have occurred 10 times over if we did not have nukes and a strong militarised identity - that we need to resist.

 

[c14-Isotope]

He talks about Lahore and Dhaka too . So i guess he had plans to somehow take the territory without the people.
Question:
Does India claim Azaad Kashmir with or without the "useless and most radicalized human resource" on the planet?
Additionally, the 150 million Indian Muslims.. are they classified as "the most radicalized useless resource " on the planet also?

No
Maybe with, maybe without, who knows?
No, only Pakistanis

 

[Master Chief]

He talks about Lahore and Dhaka too . So i guess he had plans to somehow take the territory without the people.
Question:
Does India claim Azaad Kashmir with or without the "useless and most radicalized human resource" on the planet?
Additionally, the 150 million Indian Muslims.. are they classified as "the most radicalized useless resource " on the planet also?

Our friend @c14-Isotope let on far more than he intended to. Do go easy on him. He is new to this Chanakiya concept.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

An answer to those who say India has no imperialist ambitions:
To those who don't understand Hindi a detailed translation will be given,
Basically Atal Bihari Vajpayee said India's Independence is incomplete and he will reunite Pakistan back into India. and he mentions some provinces of Pakistan by name.

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Rediff On The NeT: Vajpayee issues fresh warning to Pakistan

Extract :

Flaying Pakistan for its continued interference in Kashmir, he remarked, "The fact is that the war is not for Kashmir but for the Pakistani psyche; and until they cease to think that Pakistan is incomplete without Kashmir, this will not come to an end."

Here, while he referred to his talks with Sharief during the course of his stay in Lahore, Vajpayee recalled, "I told the Pakistani prime minister to realise what would come out of this in case we also started thinking that India is incomplete without Pakistan.

F**K OFF india.

 

[hussain0216]

India is actually very stupid

India should write a book, "How to lose friends and not influence people"

India had natural advantages that it squandered out of its own stupidity and hubris



India is blocked to the west
Now blocked to the east

It's lucky it's got a large coastline and it's own behaviour has created deep resentment in multiple neighbouring states