Indian Air Force News and Discussions ll

[CallSignMaverick]

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[Ak01]

Eight years after being scrapped by the Bharatiya Janata Party-led (BJP-led) Union government in 2016, it has re-emerged as a $40 billion acquisition for 114 aircraft, rendering it roughly four times the cost of the original plan, despite involving fewer fighters and a far less defined industrial framework. This excludes additional costs such as weapons packages, infrastructure, and training support, industry officials said.

So 40bn just fly away, not the procurement cost? $350 million per aircraft... they've lost their minds! I'd probably expect to add another 5-10 billion depending on the extensiveness of the spares, support and weapons packages... India is basically funding FCAS. Madness.

 

[CallSignMaverick]

This excludes additional costs such as weapons packages, infrastructure, and training support, industry officials said.

Nah, previous report stated $8-9 billion or something worth weapons, to be "made in India" of course, are included in the project. HAMMER is already being "made" here, next is likely SCALP. Not really good in the long run but certain things are beyond the myopic lens of MoD.

Final cost is not yet decided, and negotiations haven't happened yet. ₹3.25 lakh crore is less than $35bn, even if accounting for depreciation.

 

[Yasser76]

Nah, previous report stated $8-9 billion or something worth weapons, to be "made in India" of course, are included in the project. HAMMER is already being "made" here, next is likely SCALP. Not really good in the long run but certain things are beyond the myopic lens of MoD.

Final cost is not yet decided, and negotiations haven't happened yet. ₹3.25 lakh crore is less than $35bn, even if accounting for depreciation.

So Rahul Bhedi a seasoned defence reporter is wrong and anon multiplke ID giy on PDF is right?

Nah

 

[Yasser76]

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"mega indigenous"

F**k me...

 

[Ak01]

Nah, previous report stated $8-9 billion or something worth weapons, to be "made in India" of course, are included in the project. HAMMER is already being "made" here, next is likely SCALP. Not really good in the long run but certain things are beyond the myopic lens of MoD.

Final cost is not yet decided, and negotiations haven't happened yet. ₹3.25 lakh crore is less than $35bn, even if accounting for depreciation.

thats still an eye-watering number, its clear everything about this deal is unclear, but wow this is an insane deal.

just to contextualise this all, the entire development cost of the Rafale was 25bn eur adjusted for inflation.

then, 20bn for the 280 aircraft for the french air force.

Insanity really, i cant help but wonder if India would have been better off just going the J-16 route and developing new engines for the flankers and continue to build them under license with new avionics and systems etc. Its what i wish the PAF did with the mirage.

 

[CallSignMaverick]

thats still an eye-watering number, its clear everything about this deal is unclear, but wow this is an insane deal.

just to contextualise this all, the entire development cost of the Rafale was 25bn eur adjusted for inflation.

then, 20bn for the 280 aircraft for the french air force.

Insanity really, i cant help but wonder if India would have been better off just going the J-16 route and developing new engines for the flankers and continue to build them under license with new avionics and systems etc. Its what i wish the PAF did with the mirage.

The cost involved setting up a separate final assembly line, and it is expected to get expensive if supply chains are shifted. Which is why all the jets made in India, despite localisation, ended up being costlier than the ones made by the Russians, or even the French/Brits.

I too think we should've exploited the Flanker more but i think IAF wants to move on from it because of outdated tech and design and lack of domestic powerplants. Al-31F isn't really as reliable as western engines in terms of MTBO, MTBF, engine life or thrust to weight ratio. And super sukhoi project itself is stalled so no point buying new flankers when all the sensor and weapons package is still a ppt file.

Rafale or even Tejas at least on paper have better and reliable engines and better airframe lives. So it also makes sense to have fewer of what's more available than have more of what's less available, maybe. Coz aircrafts with poor availability rates can probably become sitting ducks for ground strikes.

 

[Khanviletey]

India’s on-again, off-again aerial tanker saga edges closer to an end​

Jan 26, 2026

This photo shows an IAI Multi-Mission Tanker Transport in service with the Colombian Air Force. India hopes to obtain six such tanker aircraft. (IAI)

The Indian Air Force is currently on its fifth attempt to obtain air-to-air refueling aircraft, but it is now closer than ever to procuring these desperately needed force-multiplying assets.

The Defence Acquisition Council cleared a potential acquisition of six second-hand Boeing 767 commercial aircraft that will be converted into tankers by Israel Aerospace Industries (IAI).

This step is called acceptance of necessity, and the deal is expected to be worth around $1 billion. A cost negotiation committee was established on Jan. 1 to finalize the price.

Once the price tag has been negotiated, the deal will be handed to the Cabinet Committee on Security for final approval before contract signing. According to some reports, this could occur as soon as March, with delivery of the first tanker sought from 2030.

IAI will manufacture the refueling modules in India, and India’s Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) is set to receive some work as well as part of IAI’s offset requirements.

Instead of buying a top-draw tanker like the Airbus A330 Multi-Role Tanker Transport (MRTT), the IAF has pragmatically concluded that converting older aircraft is more cost-effective.

If everything goes according to plan, this choice will end India’s nearly 20-year search for additional aerial tankers.

In this long-running saga, the IAF first issued a request for proposals for six tankers in 2006, in which the A330 MRTT was shortlisted, before the effort was cancelled in 2010. The same selection-cancellation process occurred when tenders were floated in 2010 and 2018.

In the meantime, the Indian Air Force’s tanker fleet comprising six Ilyushin Il-78MKI aircraft acquired from Uzbekistan in 2003-2004, is running on fumes. A decade ago, the serviceability rate of the Il-78MKI was at just 49% due to parts shortages.

Last year, the Indian Air Force decided to lease a single Boeing KC-135 Stratotanker from Metrea to fill gaps. However, flown by American crews, these aircraft would not be available during a time of conflict when they are most needed.

Aerial tankers are vital for extending the reach of Indian fighter jets, such as for overseas deployments, as well as giving them longer legs over home territory.

India’s air service is also struggling to induct the fighter jets that it needs. It currently possesses just 29 squadrons instead of the 42.5 it is authorized to have.

The IAI Multi-Mission Tanker Transport being eyed by India is already operated by Colombia, which received one unit in 2010.

I thought that the mighty and very very rich Indians against flying (IAF) buy real American purpose built Boeing 767 tankers or airbus based purpose built tankers ? Why buy bad the Suzuki cultus of tankers with converted 767 with Israeli help instead

 

[LX1111]

The cost involved setting up a separate final assembly line, and it is expected to get expensive if supply chains are shifted. Which is why all the jets made in India, despite localisation, ended up being costlier than the ones made by the Russians, or even the French/Brits.

I too think we should've exploited the Flanker more but i think IAF wants to move on from it because of outdated tech and design and lack of domestic powerplants. Al-31F isn't really as reliable as western engines in terms of MTBO, MTBF, engine life or thrust to weight ratio. And super sukhoi project itself is stalled so no point buying new flankers when all the sensor and weapons package is still a ppt file.

Rafale or even Tejas at least on paper have better and reliable engines and better airframe lives. So it also makes sense to have fewer of what's more available than have more of what's less available, maybe. Coz aircrafts with poor availability rates can probably become sitting ducks for ground strikes.

M88It's not a good engine. France's technical level is clearly inferior to that of the UK and the US. The poor design of the compressor of the M88 engine is well known. The French use a very high turbine inlet temperature to ensure the engine can maintain a T/W ratio above 8.
The cost is that the overall engine life will not be as good as many people imagine Western engines to be.

 

[CallSignMaverick]

France's technical level is clearly inferior to that of the UK and the US.

In terms of? France is one of the biggest supply chain origin for gas turbines, Safran or CFM is not some newbie.

The poor design of the compressor of the M88 engine is well known.

Okay, but as per whom? Do share a neutral source.

The cost is that the overall engine life will not be as good as many people imagine Western engines to be.

The metallurgy is certainly better than the Russian engines currently being license-made here.

 

[LX1111]

In terms of? France is one of the biggest supply chain origin for gas turbines, Safran or CFM is not some newbie.

Okay, but as per whom? Do share a neutral source.

The metallurgy is certainly better than the Russian engines currently being license-made here.

CFMIt is a product of the cooperation between Snecma and GE, like the LECP series of engines, GE is responsible for core components such as high-pressure compressors, combustion chambers, and high-pressure turbines.
Safran is mainly responsibleLow-pressure compressor, low-pressure turbine carbon fiber frame, these are not particularly high-tech areas.
So The CFM series and LECP series are actually American technology-led aero-engines.

 

[peacemaker99]

They are junk battered airframes and original inferior engines
Mechanical radars and older Amaraams

Block A/B mostly

18 block 52 is the only half decent falcon in your inventory
I bet the other fifty or so are low sortie rate to perserve fatigued airframes
Some of them are second hand used from Jordan I hear

Bar your 20 J10c or 30 new Block 3 thunders it's obselete fleet

The su30mki is only two decades old newer airframes
Far more powerful engines
Pesa radar
Now adding Astra bvrs and R37 bvrs
Completely different age and capability
Your spinning false narritive

Our Mki starting arriving 2005

Your falcons are junk from 1980s or 1990s

Arent many of their f16 second hand from jordanian air force and stuff? So they already retired after a full life and then re entered service. This machine exists because PAF ran campaigns to make them look mythical i think. Military vslue, is nearly nothing now in comparison to other competent air forces

 

[LX1111]

Okay, but as per whom? Do share a neutral source.

Okay, but as per whom? Do share a neutral source

I'm not an engine major.I have read many Chinese articles about these engines. Come to learn about the M88.
In fact, there is a very simple comparison: the French used third-generation nickel-based superalloys and advanced processes like powder metallurgy turbine disks. The resulting engine is almost identical to the F404-400.（Military thrust 49KN, afterburner thrust 71KN）
The F404 engine is made of second-generation nickel-based superalloy.Old engine

 

[peacemaker99]

thats still an eye-watering number, its clear everything about this deal is unclear, but wow this is an insane deal.

just to contextualise this all, the entire development cost of the Rafale was 25bn eur adjusted for inflation.

then, 20bn for the 280 aircraft for the french air force.

Insanity really, i cant help but wonder if India would have been better off just going the J-16 route and developing new engines for the flankers and continue to build them under license with new avionics and systems etc. Its what i wish the PAF did with the mirage.

Total life cycle cost.

 

[LX1111]

The metallurgy is certainly better than the Russian engines currently being license-made here.

Is there a big difference? Russia has fourth-generation high-temperature alloys：N4 and VZhM8
France has fourth: MC-NG