Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

[tsunset]

 

[ShapurII]

Don't want to offend Iranian members but if the mullahs who are in charge of Iran are same as other mullahs around the world, then the problem is clear, they just use religion as a propaganda tool, to hype the people up and just because they use strong powerful slogans doesnt mean its the reality on the ground, it maybe possible Iran is not as strong as it claims.

The change Iran needs is to allow an independent nationalist army to rise, an army who believes in professionalism, realism and merit based, it can be a mixture of Iranian revolutionary ideology plus Iran Persian nationalism but they must first protect Iran and then slowly rise as a power, working along with neighbouring nations. Let the Iranians revolutionary run the government but army matters must be 100% based on merit. Iran must also change their foreign policy, they need good relations on government to government level, leave this militia agenda, it's proven that it doesn't work. Somehow Iran needs to find ways to align its policy with China Pakistan Turkey Azerbaijan and slowly build up an alliance, it shouldn't be about attacking others but purely to defend own territory from foreign invasions and attacks. Iran cannot do this alone, and i don't think anyone else can too. Iran also must stop making big threats to world powers, this all has been used against Iran, this policy is good for domestic audience, for international politics and relations it's not good.

When Iran pacifies the Arab world, and Usa then slowly Iran can build up its military on modern standards, buying from China Pakistan and Turkey, aswell as building domestic industry. In the future I can see Iran Pakistan Turkey Azerbaijan, Qatar collaborating on military weapons production, will save billions for everyone.

The truth has to be told, even if it's offensive.

I don't intend to offend you, but you guys can have your delusions about Turkey and Republic of Azerbaijan, and it is really unfortunate that you cannot see it the way it is, but do not expect us to believe in your delusions. There can be no alliance between Iran, Turkey and Republic of Azerbaijan under current circumstances. China and Pakistan are different. There is a lot of room for expansion of ties, but time will tell.

I agree with the rest of your post, but nothing can be done now. It is too late. We cannot make fundamental changes to our armed forces during a 20-year planned existential war. First, we need to survive this and then we can talk about future.

 

[ShapurII]

A German analyst claims that Ali Larijani said that Israel wanted to bomb the Supreme National Security Council (SNSC) and Trump held them back.

Is that true?

As far as I know Larijani indeed said that Israel wanted to bomb the SNSC, but not that Trump held them back.

I just checked the interview again. This is what he says verbatim:

Larijani: They had discovered the location of the SNSC session and wanted to decapitate all of them with bombardment but they failed.
Their plan was like this: On this day, the heads of the state and other influential figures will be eliminated and then they will move on to the Supreme Leader and finish off Iran.

 

[Liquidator]

I just checked the interview again. This is what he says verbatim:

Larijani: They had discovered the location of the SNSC session and wanted to decapitate all of them with bombardment but they failed.
Their plan was like this: On this day, the heads of the state and other influential figures will be eliminated and then they will move on to the Supreme Leader and finish off Iran.

Iran is fighting a rabid dog.

This isn't the time for decency. For it to win, it needs to play dirty.

 

[ShapurII]

Iran is fighting a rabid dog.

This isn't the time for decency. For it to win, it needs to play dirty.

We need nuclear weapons to fight dirty.
I highly doubt that any positive development about nuclear weapons would happen before mid-August, unless we get North Korea to sell us a few warheads.

 

[vizier]

For minimal deterrence radioactive material that can be installed to ballistic missiles is enough. Iridium, Cobalt60, uranium(you can claim depleted uranium like israel used on your sites to penetrate bunkers). They wont use nukes on you with rising casualties that way to not to make israel the next chernobyl.

 

[Nuffle]

Nuclear or no nuclear NATO will fight these countries when the time is right.

NATO has a secretive WW3 ROAD map project where allies and foe are identified. They are obsessed with winning WW3 and shaping a new world order again one that will last much longer this time then 100 years like last time.

The first punch will come thru Russia in Eastern Europe which will then open a land corridor to China and Iran will also go maybe even before to be honest Iran is kind of irrelevant for them in the larger picture but still they may go before Russia.

North Korea also..

When all these players are gone they will try to turn on some of their allies..

Some people were saying this country is next or that which is entirely wrong. Iran will be nothing more then exercise which will just be exercise but Russia is 100% next. NATO will simply trick Russia and punch right thru Russia and caught the Russians in sleep. The Chinese can´t fancy NATO fighting them but they are mistaken as NATO will likely want to reduce their populaation by 90% and pacify them into a toothless nation that can be tolerated in the next world order stage.

This is happening within the next 2-3 decades and Syria will be the one country that are 100% lock that will fight side by side with NATO which explains why Sharaa is becoming important US ally. Syria is basically defacto NATO now.

If Russia and China let Iran fall, NATO deserves to win, because in this game, they seem to play better.

 

[ShapurII]

For minimal deterrence radioactive material that can be installed to ballistic missiles is enough. Iridium, Cobalt60, uranium(you can claim depleted uranium like israel used on your sites to penetrate bunkers)

Dirty bombs are absolutely useless for state actors. Not only they are absolutely useless, but it is in fact the worst idea by far.

 

[Liquidator]

We need nuclear weapons to fight dirty.
I highly doubt that any positive development about nuclear weapons would happen before mid-August, unless we get North Korea to sell us a few warheads.

Israel showed everyone 2 things:

- it's actually not that hard to cripple Iran. Day 1 demonstrated that. Iran was unable to retaliate instantly. Shocking.

- Israel cannot do it alone. This gave Iran time to regroup. But....Israel demonstrated that as long as they do the leg work....only a little direct assistance would be needed. Just a few sorties and a few stealth bombing runs every now and again would be sufficient.

I fear for Iran if their strategy is to just sit there and wait to get attacked because if they attack first "it will look bad"....the west don't care about "looking bad"....long term we need to aspire to such an ability. It will take time but it begins with a shift in attitude. The west will do what they want with or without an excuse. They'll just make one up if needed.



Today....they've stopped bothering making it up. They just do it.

 

[vizier]

Dirty bombs are absolutely useless for state actors. Not only they are absolutely useless, but it is in fact the worst idea by far.

Exploding them on the ground is useless contaminating an area of several buildings. Exploding them as dust particles at 3000m altitude would have a higher radius area radiation effect depending on the weight of the warhead.

 

[ShapurII]

Israel showed everyone 2 things:

- it's actually not that hard to cripple Iran. Day 1 demonstrated that. Iran was unable to retaliate instantly. Shocking.

- Israel cannot do it alone. This gave Iran time to regroup. But....Israel demonstrated that as long as they do the leg work....only a little direct assistance would be needed. Just a few sorties and a few stealth bombing runs every now and again would be sufficient.

I fear for Iran of their strategy is to just sit there and wait to get attacked because if they attack first "it will look bad"....the west don't care about "looking bad"....long term we need to aspire to such an ability. It will take time but it begins with a shift in attitude.

I think one has to understand that contrary to what people think, the West doesn't really care much about the state of Israel.

The West are the same people that killed millions of Jews in the Holocaust. If you look at white supremacists, their ideal world is the world where Muslims and Jews fight each other until they eventually annihilate each other.

We need nuclear deterrence not to target Israel, but to control the scale of the conflict and prevent our enemy from moving the escalation ladder step by step. Let's not forget that their end game is break down Iran into pieces, through regime change or not.

 

[ShapurII]

Exploding them on the ground is useless contaminating an area of several buildings. Exploding them as dust particles at 3000m altitude would have a higher radius area radiation effect.

It's still absolutely useless because it doesn't destroy the enemy's strategic infrastructure. Dirty bombs are good for terrorist groups, but not for a state actor because the offending state will achieve nothing of strategic value, but justifies nuclear retaliation. And Israel has over 200 nuclear warheads. So, it is by far, the worst idea. Israel will retaliate by wiping off our major population centers and industrial cities, making us unable to fight back after that.

The purpose of nuclear weapons is not to kill as many as you can, but it is to completely cripple your enemy's ability to fight back. There are alternative ways to kill thousands of people, with contamination that can be even worse. Chemical and biological weapons sometimes can be equally as difficult to clean up, sometimes even more difficult.

 

[vizier]

It's still absolutely useless because it doesn't destroy the enemy's strategic infrastructure. Dirty bombs are good for terrorist groups, but not for a state actor because the offending state will achieve nothing of strategic value, but justifies nuclear retaliation. And Israel has over 200 nuclear warheads. So, it is by far, the worst idea.

The purpose of nuclear weapons is not to kill as many as you can, but it is to completely cripple your enemy's ability to fight back. There are alternative ways to kill thousands of people, with contamination that can be even worse. Chemical and biological weapons sometimes can be equally as difficult to clean up, sometimes even more difficult.

It can only be used as a deterrent measure. First strike is a bad idea with them but it keeps them not using nukes if you dont have nukes as a deterrent.

israel would be inhabitable and that is totally unaccaptable for their zionist ideology and occult groups. So they wont be using nukes even Usa soldiers are killed in a conventional conflict. protecting from chems and bio weapons is easier and wont have long term contamination effect unlike radioactive dust which still pollutes chernobyl area till today.

 

[ShapurII]

It can only be used as a deterrent measure. First strike is a bad idea with them but it keeps them not using nukes if you dont have nukes as a deterrent.

israel would be inhabitable and that is totally unaccaptable for their zionist ideology and occult groups. So they wont be using nukes even Usa soldiers are killed in a conventional conflict. protecting from chems and bio weapons is easier and wont have long term contamination effect unlike radioactive dust which still pollutes chernobyl area till today.

That's my point exactly, it won't give Iran deterrence because it won't destroy Israel's ability to fight back, but it will in fact allow them to hit Iran with strategic nukes and finish the war faster.

Some biological weapons are extremely effective as weapons of mass destruction, even more so than dirty bombs.

 

[vizier]

That's my point exactly, it won't give Iran deterrence because it won't destroy Israel's ability to fight back, but it will in fact allow them to hit Iran with strategic nukes and finish the war faster.

Some biological weapons are extremely effective as weapons of mass destruction, even more so than dirty bombs.

Radioactive warheads are a stop gap measure to stop enemy from using nukes on you for example if you hit a carrier or a warship usa can immediately use nukes on you depending on casualties. After you get nukes you wont need them.