Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

[Meengla]

NY Times main page. Tells you who has gained more. And Israelis are already spinning this as 'Treaty of Versailles'. Haha!

 

[ghazi52]

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[ShapurII]

Before the war did the U.S. provide sanctions waivers for the sale of Iranian oil and petrochemicals to every country in the world, including for related logistics and banking services? Obviously not. China bought some oil from us anyway but with these sanctions waivers we can sell oil to anyone. And you think the specific reference to waivers for banking services doesn’t mean anything?

I'm surprised that you don't see it. The US is using our own oil to fill the world's strategic reserves in case that they want to attack Iran again in the future.
The US also issued sanction waivers for purchasing our oil during the war. How is this any different?

Didn't Scott Bessent say that the US was using our own oil against our blockade of the Strait of Hormuz? How is this different now?

There is now a framework that makes such transfers possible, based upon steps that Iran can agree to achieve. That is an important step forward for Iran's economy to revive itself in a gradual manner.

What framework? No sanctions will be lifted before the final deal. Iran is still not connected to the SWIFT banking system.

 

[Ali_Baba]

Once UN sanctions are removed on Iran, Pakistan Iran trade will increase, we will build the pipeline, I only hope it be Iran Pakistan China pipeline, Gwadar and Chahabar must be connected to CPEC, bring Iran on board one road belt. Once all this is done, there is nothing that can stop China Pakistan Iran alliance.

It would be interesting to see if a pipeline for oil and gas can go via Pakistan to China ?

 

[ghazi52]

The 14-point US-Iran peace plan, annotated​

Zachary B. Wolf, Abbas Al Lawati, Lou Robinson, Annette Choi

Photo Illustration by Jason Lancaster/CNN/Getty Images

The memorandum of understanding, MOU, between the US and Iran aims to expand on the ceasefire and get traffic flowing through the Strait of Hormuz.

But at less than 800 words in English, the 14-point outline leaves a lot of details for later, including the touchy subject of Iran’s nuclear program. But it does promise Iran a lot of money – by lifting sanctions so Iran can sell its oil to the world, but also potentially giving Iran access to billions in frozen assets and $300 billion in financing.

The Trump administration is a great fan of multipoint agreements. The agreement that sought to end hostilities in the Gaza strip was a 20-point plan, and the administration’s unrealized plan to end Russia’s war on Ukraine was a 28-point plan.

It’s worth going line by line through the draft agreement, which was read out by a senior Trump administration official in a call with reporters.

1....

https://www.cnn.com/2026/06/17/politics/us-iran-memo-annotated-intl-vis?Date=20260617&Profile=CNN&utm_content=1781733134&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter

 

[BHAN85]

I think you are wrong to assume that the Iran war is over. It is not over in my opinion. It is far from over. If anything, it has just started in my opinion.

Remember that it took the US, Europe, Turkey and Arab countries 13 years and 8 months to finally defeat Syria. The fall of Syria didn't happen overnight. Assad initially won the war, didn't he? The same goes for Saddam's Iraq. The First Persian Gulf War happened in 1991, Saddam was overthrown in 2003.

Anyway, it's too early to judge what will happen. We need to wait for at least another 60 days before we call it a victory for Iran.

As of now, none of the sides have lost or gained anything of significance yet. This is merely an extension of the ceasefire for 60 days in my opinion. If anything, both sides are getting ready for longer war in my opinion:

1. This ceasefire enables the US and other countries to refill their strategic reserves for the next round of war.
2. This ceasefire allows Iran to empty its oil storage tankers for the next round of war and get some temporary relief for the second round.

I agree

To say now Iran war is over is like say Ukraine war was over when Putin met Trump in Alaska months ago.

Yeah, USA is pacting with Iran, like they did with Russia, but war is not over.

USA will remove 20% refuelers airplanes from Israeli Ben Gurion airport, it means they keep 80%, for what?

And USA pressured G7 days ago to send warships to Hormuz.

So basically USA is creating a scenario where Israel will have the opportunity of drag Europe towards Iran war, through false flags attacks in Hormuz strait.

USA is happy bringing chaos to allies, they instigate war, and then leave the problems to others, they did in Ukraine/Russia/Europe and they repeated the treason scheme in Israel/Iran/GCC.

 

[VCheng]

What framework?

The MoU.

No sanctions will be lifted before the final deal.

Incorrect. Point 10 makes waivers available immediately.

Iran is still not connected to the SWIFT banking system.

That can happen much later in this process if it gets to that point. It is still too early to ask for it.

 

[TAC]

Sir, what we have thus far is a transcript of what officials of both Iran and USA read to media reporters. For example, just look at the order of the two countries at the very beginning: they are different depending on who transcribed them.

I agree that there is no doubt as to the framework described in the MoU has been agreed upon by both countries, and that it is great step in stopping the war. But all the key details and issues regarding the stepwise implementation of every agreed upon will be negotiated in the next 60 days.

Without going into details at this point, as a preview, please note that in the reported document, many significant terms are only implied. Who are the "allies"? Yes, Israel is easy to guess, but what about the Iranian allies? If any of these allies stage an attack, what will happen to the agreement? Who will be "regional partners" putting up the $300 billion investments and under what terms and conditions? What will be mechanism of enforcement of the "applicable international law" after "discussion with Oman and other littoral States" after the initial 60 period for transit of the SoH? How is the "proximity of Iran" defined as, beyond which US forces will withdraw after 30 days?

Obviously, there is still much to be clarified over the next 60 days that will greatly affect the outcome of what has been described.

The best thing that has been made clear thus far is that both sides have agreed to change the adversarial nature of their relationship resulting in direct conflict into a defined transactional relationship where mutually agreed upon steps lead to stepwise improvements.

As I previously mentioned, both sides have to be able to sell this framework to their respective internal audiences. In the meantime, there is cessation of hostilities, opening of transit, and a commitment to finalize the real details.

That is all good, thus far, for both sides.

And at risk of yet more ire from @Musings , some things may still take some time to understand. I will patiently wait and see. Of course, anyone wishing to rush to judgement prematurely is most welcome to do so, freely.

Of course there is lots of detail to emerge / evolve as time goes by - but to say that the US did not achieve anything under this MOU that it didn’t already have in the Obama accord, to say that US was forced to back off from further military action, was forced to now ignore the wishes of the genocidal Israeli’s upon who’s wishes they started this war, to say that Iran made huge gains compared to what it had before the war - is not premature any way shape or form and not dependent on the details you are pinning your hopes on to salvage something for the US.
Even in the best case scenario from a US perspective, assuming all the details go in the US’s favour what will the US gain that it didn’t have under the Obama Accord??
Sorry but you are now avoiding that important and fundamental question by muddying the waters via ‘details’ yet to emerge. I’ve made it simple by assuming all those details you mention go in US’s favour, now please answer the question.

 

[VCheng]

It would be interesting to see if a pipeline for oil and gas can go via Pakistan to China ?

The engineering and cost-benefit analysis for such a project across earthquake-prone mountains and the potential for an ecologic disaster into the main water supply of Pakistan is what will be more interesting.

 

[ghazi52]

Trump’s Iran agreement may be a dud, but he’s getting what he wants​

Analysis by Stephen Collinson
CNN

President Donald Trump arrives at Paris Orly airport in Orly, France, on June 17.
Evelyn Hockstein/Reuters

Donald Trump insisted last month that he didn’t think about Americans’ finances when negotiating with Iran.

He’s clearly changed his mind.

“I didn’t want to see economic catastrophe. If you kept this going, that could have happened,” Trump said Wednesday, in seeking to explain what critics see as a deeply flawed agreement to end the war.

Trump’s comment, in France, was a revealing moment. It shows how, under political pressure, he often grasps for short-term advantage over the long-term strategic grind. And it underscores his reverence for the wisdom of the markets, which he said were “more brilliant” than any of his advisers “other than me, of course.”

But Trump’s embrace of a peace plan that one Republican senator warned had Ronald Reagan “rolling over in his grave” risks weakening the US position going into critical 60-day talks that could define Iran’s nuclear destiny.

The agreement, designed to pave the way to those meetings, seems to cede almost all US leverage and hands Iran billions of dollars in revenues up front by waiving sanctions. It may therefore dent Trump’s self-conjured mystique as the world’s great dealmaker — which lifted him from reality TV to the White House.

 

[Ali_Baba]

Those who said words about Pakistan led mediation process and said that Qatar has taken over the process should see this picture.

This Picture of Pak PM holding the signed Islamabad MoU has just ONE other signatory besides the two parties, and that is Pakistan and not any other country.

View attachment 202143

It was a team effort, and Qatar helped a lot given how much more "experience" they have in these types of negotiations than Pakistan. This would have been a very good learning experience for the diplomatic services of Pakistan for sure( they do need to clamp down on the leaks of the talks though). Pakistan had all the connections, esp China and the USA and Iran to make this happen and it is not involved in any of the "tribal politics and egos and historical baggage" of the middle east.

There was literally no other country that is positioned as well to do this.,

 

[VCheng]

Even in the best case scenario from a US perspective, assuming all the details go in the US’s favour what will the US gain that it didn’t have under the Obama Accord?

What is new now is the stepwise enforcement and verification mechanisms that Iran must follow to avoid an economic meltdown and the resultant social upheaval.

 

[ShapurII]

I agree

To say now Iran war is over is like say Ukraine war was over when Putin met Trump in Alaska months ago.

Yeah, USA is pacting with Iran, like they did with Russia, but war is not over.

USA will remove 20% refuelers airplanes from Israeli Ben Gurion airport, it means they keep 80%, for what?

And USA pressured G7 days ago to send warships to Hormuz.

So basically USA is creating a scenario where Israel will have the opportunity of drag Europe towards Iran war, through false flags attacks in Hormuz strait.

USA is happy bringing chaos to allies, they instigate war, and then leave the problems to others, they did in Ukraine/Russia/Europe and they repeated the treason scheme in Israel/Iran/GCC.

I agree. This "memorandum of understanding" is just an extended ceasefire for countries to refill their strategic oil reserves to prevent an economic crash when the next round of war happens.

The MoU.

The MoU is not a framework. Nothing is final there. Everything has been left open to interpretation so far. Even the $300 billion that is cited very often has been left wide open to interpretation. Nothing of significance has been agreed upon, except for meeting again to finalize a deal in 60 days. Even that is not certain because the parties of this MoU can extend this 60 day period mutually.

Per Trump's own words: "No, it's not final. It's a memorandum of understanding. And if I don't like it, we will go back to shooting at them, dropping bombs on their head".

Incorrect. Point 10 makes waivers available immediately.

Nope, not incorrect. The waiver allows other countries to buy our oil, but the money will not be transferred to Iran, or be sent to Iran as cash. It will be used as credit lines to import goods. So, nope. Nothing has changed. We already had such an arrangement with the Chinese.

That can happen much later in this process if it gets to that point. It is still too early to ask for it.

And this proves my point.

 

[Ali_Baba]

Hopefully Iranians will remember this backstabbing.

I wouldn't bet on that, the Iranians have a real "soft" spot for India and I don't see that changing. Hopefully things get better between Pakistan and Iran, that itself is worth it esp given how removal of Iranian sanctions will lead to the economic growth of Iran and being a neighbor, Pakistan can pick up more 2-way bilateral trade.

 

[FuturePAF]

NY Times main page. Tells you who has gained more. And Israelis are already spinning this as 'Treaty of Versailles'. Haha!

View attachment 202146

France 24 also comparing it to the Treaty of Versailles. I’m not sure they want to say the French got Heir Drumpf to sign famous for start the villain arch that will cause blowback in 2 decades.

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