Iranian Air Force (IRIAF/IRGC-ASF) | News and Discussions

[Ali_Baba]

“Interested” ≠ “Actual Purchase”

For enterprises, what they need is real orders, not "interest" in the form of publicity. If many customers are just watching and not actually buying, there is no need for them to continue waiting. ------ Waiting means that the production line is idle.

The best decision for CAC is to resolve the J-10 issue as soon as possible and then focus on the development and production of higher-level fighter jets.

BTW. I don't think Pakistan can afford to buy 80 J-10CE.

China will need an exportable fighter that it is happy to sell and that countries can also afford to buy as part of exerting its influence abroad. Fighters jets that will serve a country for 30-40 years buys influence for that same time too. The J-35AE while exportable, may be simply too expensive for a lot of countries, so the J10CE maybe around longer than you think. Twin engines, and a stealth cloak to maintain makes that platform a lot more expensive to purchase and then maintain and operate. Countries will need something that sits between the J-35AE and JF17C interms of capabilities, and that is where the J10CE fits in.

 

[Hack-Hook]

The biggest question for the IRIAF is how it is going to reorganise itself going forward to be capable and credible airforce?

There is only one way . Send the pilots to the country that is supposed to deliver the aircraft to Iran to be trained . Meanwhile build fortified shelter for those fighters around various airbases in the country and rebuild the airdefence but this time don't cheap out

After the training of those pilots end , they fly the airplane back to iran

 

[Michael]

Matter of time. 20 delivered. 20 on order. 50% .
J-10CE in production S.No. 205 and 206. Don't underestimate the PAF

Who are the owners of these new J-10CEs? There is no definite news at the moment. We still need to wait and see.
There are many speculations on Chinese social media, but not including PAF. We don't think these new toys are made for PAF.

I don't underestimate PAF. But 80 J-10CEs are indeed too much for Pakistan. It is completely beyond the scope of what Pakistan can afford.

China will need an exportable fighter that it is happy to sell and that countries can also afford to buy as part of exerting its influence abroad. Fighters jets that will serve a country for 30-40 years buys influence for that same time too. The J-35AE while exportable, may be simply too expensive for a lot of countries, so the J10CE maybe around longer than you think. Countries will need something that sits between the J-35AE and JF17C interms of capabilities, and that is where the J10CE fits in.

The J-10C/J-10CE has been around for many years, and so far it has only one foreign customer, the PAF, and the number is very low.

Based on market analysis, even if the J-10CE's export situation improves to a certain extent, it will still not have a large sales volume. At least, it is not enough to support a production line.

The price CATIC offered to Pakistan was comparable to the price the PLAAF paid for its own version. CATIC made almost no profit. However, Pakistan leaked the complete transaction list, which prevented CATIC from raising the price. As a result, no matter how many J-10CEs were sold, CATIC's profit was very low.

Therefore, we might as well shut down the production line decisively and concentrate on the research, development and production of higher-level fighter jets. After the production line is closed, if there are still customers who want to buy J-10CE, we can completely modify it with the PLAAF's own version of J-10C. 300+ J-10C, this is a very large number.

 

[Fatman17]

Who are the owners of these new J-10CEs? There is no definite news at the moment. We still need to wait and see.
There are many speculations on Chinese social media, but not including PAF. We don't think these new toys are made for PAF.

I don't underestimate PAF. But 80 J-10CEs are indeed too much for Pakistan. It is completely beyond the scope of what Pakistan can afford.

The J-10C/J-10CE has been around for many years, and so far it has only one foreign customer, the PAF, and the number is very low.

Based on market analysis, even if the J-10CE's export situation improves to a certain extent, it will still not have a large sales volume. At least, it is not enough to support a production line.

The price CATIC offered to Pakistan was comparable to the price the PLAAF paid for its own version. CATIC made almost no profit. However, Pakistan leaked the complete transaction list, which prevented CATIC from raising the price. As a result, no matter how many J-10CEs were sold, CATIC's profit was very low.

Therefore, we might as well shut down the production line decisively and concentrate on the research, development and production of higher-level fighter jets. After the production line is closed, if there are still customers who want to buy J-10CE, we can completely modify it with the PLAAF's own version of J-10C. 300+ J-10C, this is a very large number.

Pure speculation on your part.

 

[Sami_1]

Iran's priority remains developing its air defense and missile capabilities, followed by the Iranian Air Force, as they have the quickest impact in any future war.


The J-10 is important even to the Chinese Air Force. There is always a fighter called a workhorse and tactical fighter, such as the F-16/J-10.
Even if China could produce an aircraft like the J-35A at a low cost, it would still be a fourth-generation fighter that carries out a longer and greater number of sorties per day than fifth-generation fighters. Therefore, all countries seeking to acquire 200 tactical fighters and a smaller number of heavy fighters are the basis, other than trainer aircraft and light fighters.


Perhaps the best example would be the South Korean Air Force, which represents such a scenario, or Japan.
It would be naive to consider fighters like the J-10C as outdated and unfit for the future, despite the aircraft's potential for growth, whether in improving its combat capabilities or equipment. China is working to equip it with PL-17 missiles and the next generation of WVR missiles, as well as more advanced targeting and jamming silos, and even improving its airframe. Although the overall and external design of the aircraft has been stabilized, the process of improving its radar and jamming capabilities and integrating munitions such as missiles is still ongoing. Cruise and hypersonic missiles will be one of the development tools, so Iran has shifted to a number of J-10C aircraft from the Chinese Air Force or assembly lines. China may expand production lines according to international orders. Fourth-generation fighters, such as the Rafale and Eurofighter Typhoon, will remain in production until 2035, even with the introduction of sixth-generation fighters. Iran's future move toward fighters like the J-35 or SU-57 will be natural. There is a point that everyone has not noticed: the Egyptian SU-35 fighters, which some said would be supplied to Iran and sometimes to Algeria, have not been delivered. Rather, Algeria receives them directly from Russian production lines, while Iran will not receive anything. There are quick solutions that Iran can implement, such as developing Iranian MIG-29 fighters with Chinese and North Korean support, and the same applies to SU-24 bombers, with the rapid acquisition of Chinese fighters.

 

[Khorasan Black Flags]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

@Persian Gulf your ideas ?

 

[Persian Gulf]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

@Persian Gulf your ideas ?

first priority is internal security and coherent strategy otherwise all the equipment in the world means nothing

second is any jets and air defences we can buy, particularly AWACS to cover blind spots due to terrain

Su-35 is slightly better than J-10 for our purposes but I don't have aversion to Chinese jets at all, if we can get J-10 then we should do it immediately, having less reliance on Russia alone is a good enough reason for me

 

[Deino]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

@Persian Gulf your ideas ?

And alone since the NationalInterst reports it is can only be wrong! They are the worst site to report on military matters ... all what matters for them are "clicks"

 

[Khorasan Black Flags]

first priority is internal security and coherent strategy otherwise all the equipment in the world means nothing

second is any jets and air defences we can buy, particularly AWACS to cover blind spots due to terrain

Su-35 is slightly better than J-10 for our purposes but I don't have aversion to Chinese jets at all, if we can get J-10 then we should do it immediately, having less reliance on Russia alone is a good enough reason for me

Well said

 

[Tariq Habib Afridi]

In the early days, there were indeed rumors that CATIC had marketed the J-10A (export code FC-20) to Iran and Pakistan. But in the end, neither Iran nor Pakistan bought it. The J-10A was discontinued in 2014.

At present, the PLAAF's procurement of J-10C is saturated. CAC no longer produces J-10C. The production line only produces J-10CE.

There are rumors that if there are no large orders for J-10CE in the next two years, CAC may completely shut down the J-10 full series production line in 2028 and completely terminate the project. ------ The J-10CE production line in Guizhou also belongs to CAC.

CAC currently has no interest in the J-10 series fighters, and terminating the project is in line with CAC's development strategy.
We do not rule out that the J-10CE production line may be sold as a package.

The potential availability of the J-10CE production line presents a strategic opportunity for Pakistan to acquire this capability as a comprehensive package. Pakistan should prioritize securing this deal, whether through financing arrangements or other means, as it is critical for bolstering its defense industry. By acquiring the production line, Pakistan could manufacture over 200 J-10CE aircraft domestically, incorporating its own modifications to meet specific operational requirements. Furthermore, with China's consent and potential collaboration, Pakistan could explore exporting these aircraft to other nations, generating economic benefits and strengthening defense ties. This move aligns with Pakistan's long-term goals of enhancing self-reliance in defense manufacturing and expanding its role in the global arms market.

 

[Nuffle]

Iran needs to sort out its internal politics first so that there is only "one" airforce and not two, which is presently split between the IRFC-AF and the Iranian Airforce. This duplication itself costs money and makes no logical sense. Collapse one into the other so that there is a single unified command and force for aerial defence. Then work on making that the best it can be.

Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps Aerospace Force - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Islamic Republic of Iran Air Force - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

You touched on a point that almost no one raises.

The inter-service feud, Artesh and Sepah.

This is very bad for both combat capabilities and budget.

Intense rivalry and competition for areas of influence, resources, equipment and missions between Artesh and the IRGC should not be happening, this makes Iran's military modernization more complicated and complex. Iran has a very broad and comprehensive development pipeline in several Sepah projects, while Artesh suffers from a lack of modernization, especially its IRIAF air force.

The lack of coordination between the two military services is another chronic problem, hence the need for unification and the elimination of duplication of tasks, eliminating internal disputes between services.

 

[alireza]

View attachment 132441
You touched on a point that almost no one raises.

The inter-service feud, Artesh and Sepah.

This is very bad for both combat capabilities and budget.

Intense rivalry and competition for areas of influence, resources, equipment and missions between Artesh and the IRGC should not be happening, this makes Iran's military modernization more complicated and complex. Iran has a very broad and comprehensive development pipeline in several Sepah projects, while Artesh suffers from a lack of modernization, especially its IRIAF air force.

The lack of coordination between the two military services is another chronic problem, hence the need for unification and the elimination of duplication of tasks, eliminating internal disputes between services.

Combining the ground forces of Sepah and Artesh would never happen. They are run very differently.
However, consolidating the Air Defense and Air Forces of both would make most sense and be the easiest amongst all the branches.

 

[Wudangmaster2]

Combining the ground forces of Sepah and Artesh would never happen. They are run very differently.
However, consolidating the Air Defense and Air Forces of both would make most sense and be the easiest amongst all the branches.

How about the navies? In terms of doctrine, etc

 

[alireza]

Iran is not getting the J10CE.
China would not risk sanctions and backlash from USA, Europe, Israel and Arab nations over such a sale.
Even if the sale were to happen, China wants cash. Iran wants to barter oil. China doesn't prefer that.

Most realistic scenario short term for Iran is to upgrade the 22-24 Mig 29's they have to Mig29M2 so that they can aid in protecting the capital region (Tehran area). Maybe even get more models if Russia would sell them second hand ones. 48 Mig 29M2's would be helpful to patrol Tehran and parts of Iran's western borders. These need to be armed with the R77.
If they can get the Yak130M instead of the base Yak130, that would be a plus. Replace the F7, Mirage F1, and aging F5's with the Yak130M. The R-73 on the Yak130 and Mig 29 has a max range of about 30 km. Iran needs the RVV-MD which is an upgraded export model of the R73 with 40 km range. Replace all the R73's Iran has with the upgraded model RVV-MD.
Upgrade the Sukhio 24 as well to the M2 version if Russia allows.
IRGC air force should retire the Sukhio 22 and the budget that was used maintaining that garbage fleet should just be allocated to the Sukhio 24's at least.

Now Iran's jet fleet can look more like this
Mig 29M2
Yak 130M
Sukhio 24M2
F14
F4

This is way better than current status quo with all these different planes and supply lines. The Yak130M replacing all the F7, Mirage F1, and F5 provides Iran with suitable training platform and light combat jet. It will also prepare Iranian pilots for the Su35 if it ever comes lol.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Any sale from China to Iran should be proportional to Sale of F16 fleet to Taiwan

Weapon Supply from USA/France to Taiwan
USA has provided 150 F16 C/D to Taiwan
French have provided additional 40 Mirage 2000 for Taiwan

Weapon Supply from China/Russia to Iran
So based on this figure , China should be ok to provided 100 J10C to Iran
Russia should provide 30 Sukhoi 30 Jets to Iran

From a very balanced approach China/Russia should be able to act in a responsible manner to protect their National Interest