Iranian Air Force (IRIAF/IRGC-ASF) | News and Discussions

[Hack-Hook]

North Korea has one with the runway inside the mountain.

Taiwan has the largest underground airbase in the world can fit over 120 fighters I believe.

China, Germany, Russia etc all have had hardened or nuclear proof underground airbases throughout various points in history.

The idea I had isn’t ‘new’ by any means.

the idea is not good and you knew why . its good only for protecting second strike capabilities.
the interceptor must be able to fly on notice and those base have serious problem on that.
also they are old and were built on the mind set of cold war era.
today's with the advancement of bunker buster and penetrating bombs and cruise missile , its very easy to destroy the exits at first attack and trap all the enemy air-force inside base .
don't tell me we must continue that again

this is your friend when dealing with this type of bases'

Joint Direct Attack Munition - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

only 30,000$ each launch platform practically any fixed wing airplane even Mig-29 and MQ-9 and certainly B-2, F-22, B-52 and not to forget F-16, F-15 and F-35 and you can add 10,000$ and get an extended range kit at that to the bomb and release the bomb 80km away instead of 26km away
by the way UAE, KSA, Jordan , Turkey, Kuwait, Pakistan, Egypt and the spoiled boy AKA Israel have them
also certain country produce its own version of the bomb called Spice
and if you have more money than you knew what to do with always there is the option of AGM-137, AGM-154, AGM-158 and SCALP-EG

 

[Mehdipersian]

the idea is not good and you knew why . its good only for protecting second strike capabilities.
the interceptor must be able to fly on notice and those base have serious problem on that.
also they are old and were built on the mind set of cold war era.
today's with the advancement of bunker buster and penetrating bombs and cruise missile , its very easy to destroy the exits at first attack and trap all the enemy air-force inside base .
don't tell me we must continue that again

this is your friend when dealing with this type of bases'

Joint Direct Attack Munition - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

only 30,000$ each launch platform practically any fixed wing airplane even Mig-29 and MQ-9 and certainly B-2, F-22, B-52 and not to forget F-16, F-15 and F-35 and you can add 10,000$ and get an extended range kit at that to the bomb and release the bomb 80km away instead of 26km away
by the way UAE, KSA, Jordan , Turkey, Kuwait, Pakistan, Egypt and the spoiled boy AKA Israel have them
also certain country produce its own version of the bomb called Spice
and if you have more money than you knew what to do with always there is the option of AGM-137, AGM-154, AGM-158 and SCALP-EG

Repairing entrances is easy, repairing fighter jets is difficult and impossible

 

[mulj]

I know what you mean, I feel the same exact way!

I'm sure you know this already; the Yugoslavian Serbs originally came up with Željava underground MiG-21 shelter base which wasn't really underground, more like inside a mountain on what's today the Bosnian/Croatian border.

View attachment 48574

The Serbian forces ended up destroying it while retreating at the end of '94 after NATO bombed the living daylights out of Yugoslavia. Brilliant idea but I would think potentially difficult logistically and probably costly, too.

For Iran it's probably a great thing because it'll save the fighters and if the runways get hit, at least those can be quickly repaired and put back into action whereas the fighters are a different story. And that one for the F-4 Phantoms looks like it's huge with many converging tunnels. And difficult to find.

I will reply about this later.

 

[Hack-Hook]

Repairing entrances is easy, repairing fighter jets is difficult and impossible

no you try to remove 20m of rock and we will talk also they can hit them again and again and as your fighters are trapped inside they technically own your sky
Swedish solution of dividing the air force in small group and distributing them all over the country is a lot better

 

[mulj]

I know what you mean, I feel the same exact way!

I'm sure you know this already; the Yugoslavian Serbs originally came up with Željava underground MiG-21 shelter base which wasn't really underground, more like inside a mountain on what's today the Bosnian/Croatian border.

View attachment 48574

The Serbian forces ended up destroying it while retreating at the end of '94 after NATO bombed the living daylights out of Yugoslavia. Brilliant idea but I would think potentially difficult logistically and probably costly, too.

This is not factual, they destroyed it at 92' while so called former yugoslav army retreated from areas in Bosnia where Bosniac population organized resistance and under general agreement, no NATO involved and there was not such thing as yugoslav serbs in official terminology and society norms.

For Iran it's probably a great thing because it'll save the fighters and if the runways get hit, at least those can be quickly repaired and put back into action whereas the fighters are a different story. And that one for the F-4 Phantoms looks like it's huge with many converging tunnels. And difficult to find.

On this part i will make correlation about this former yugoslav mega project. Facility was projected to host around 100 interceptors of MIG-21, purpose of that infrastructure and location itself was intended to deny air superiority to the southern NATO flank from Itàly in case of attack on yugoslavia, at that time that was official military doctrine to expect attack both from NATO and Warsaw pact forces.
About facility itself, cost was enormous and it is built to be fully autonomous with support of radar and radars/SAM installations on surrounding mountains as well as with normal airfield base nearby.
I think it was huge waste of money now when we have all historical information and it could not fullfil intended purposes efficiently in case of proper NATO attack.
Also, cost of the project was devastating, economic experts calculated that whole six republic capital cities in former yugoslavia could have been connected with proper highways network with money spent in that project.
For Iran i suppose it is in relative sense cheaper due advancement of construction equipment which decrease costs like that a lot and it could have certain tactical advantages in directions of potential air incursions, in that sense it has value, for them probably would be better to build several of those with hosting maximum one squadron placed for easier defence and combat longevity purposes.

 

[Mehdipersian]

no you try to remove 20m of rock and we will talk also they can hit them again and again and as your fighters are trapped inside they technically own your sky
Swedish solution of dividing the air force in small group and distributing them all over the country is a lot better

If the enemy can repeatedly attack the entrances of this base, it will be easier for him to completely destroy a normal base there.

 

[Hack-Hook]

If the enemy can repeatedly attack the entrances of this base, it will be easier for him to completely destroy a normal base there.

no the normal base won't be blocked and aircrafts can fly to intercept them.
also another problem with these underground bases is you are putting all your eggs in one basket , if you disperse your airforce , even if 2-3 basket fall the rest of your eggs are not broken


we have this

not many country have such valuable resource to use
if once we decided to rebuild or air-force ,this is the resource we must use we must have peace time and war time bases , instead of putting all aircraft in several big base , we must send aircraft to various active airfields we have and build a military wing there. we also must prepare those airfields that are inactive right now to be able host aircraft in war time and in all of them unlike Russia we must have protected hanger so a single cluster bomb don't destroy 10 of your aircraft .
majority of those airfields are close to roads and the road adjacent to the airfields must be strengthened to act as emergency runway

and believe me doing those is a lot cheaper than building two base like Oqab , you want it okay keep it but for strategic bombers not fighter and interceptors. but these airfields of very valuable resource that must be used

 

[mulj]

no the normal base won't be blocked and aircrafts can fly to intercept them.
also another problem with these underground bases is you are putting all your eggs in one basket , if you disperse your airforce , even if 2-3 basket fall the rest of your eggs are not broken


we have this

not many country have such valuable resource to use
if once we decided to rebuild or air-force ,this is the resource we must use we must have peace time and war time bases , instead of putting all aircraft in several big base , we must send aircraft to various active airfields we have and build a military wing there. we also must prepare those airfields that are inactive right now to be able host aircraft in war time and in all of them unlike Russia we must have protected hanger so a single cluster bomb don't destroy 10 of your aircraft .
majority of those airfields are close to roads and the road adjacent to the airfields must be strengthened to act as emergency runway

and believe me doing those is a lot cheaper than building two base like Oqab , you want it okay keep it but for strategic bombers not fighter and interceptors. but these airfields of very valuable resource that must be used

Another advantage of that approach is that if allowed it is better that SAM formation defend several air infrastructure assets then one.

 

[GoMig-21]

the idea is not good and you knew why . its good only for protecting second strike capabilities.
the interceptor must be able to fly on notice and those base have serious problem on that.
also they are old and were built on the mind set of cold war era.
today's with the advancement of bunker buster and penetrating bombs and cruise missile , its very easy to destroy the exits at first attack and trap all the enemy air-force inside base .

This is very true indeed. Even the bestest and greatestest SAM system builder and user in the history of air defense systems, the great RUSSIA itself isn't immune to getting its airbases hit, just this here. Belbek AB in the Ukraine where Russia parked some of its Su-35, MiG-29 even the precious MiG-31 and they got clobbered.





Granted Belbek doesn't have much strategic depth for either country, Russia or the Ukraine but still, the impact is tremendous and just goes to show that air bases are such important but vulnerable assets and not very easy to protect, even with the latest & greatest SAM systems which most are quite mobile and made to easy locate & relocate for this exact reason and it still got hit. Also granted the Russians have been sloppy but mostly complacent and this is the result.

 

[jauk]

the idea is not good and you knew why . its good only for protecting second strike capabilities.
the interceptor must be able to fly on notice and those base have serious problem on that.
also they are old and were built on the mind set of cold war era.
today's with the advancement of bunker buster and penetrating bombs and cruise missile , its very easy to destroy the exits at first attack and trap all the enemy air-force inside base .
don't tell me we must continue that again

this is your friend when dealing with this type of bases'

Joint Direct Attack Munition - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

only 30,000$ each launch platform practically any fixed wing airplane even Mig-29 and MQ-9 and certainly B-2, F-22, B-52 and not to forget F-16, F-15 and F-35 and you can add 10,000$ and get an extended range kit at that to the bomb and release the bomb 80km away instead of 26km away
by the way UAE, KSA, Jordan , Turkey, Kuwait, Pakistan, Egypt and the spoiled boy AKA Israel have them
also certain country produce its own version of the bomb called Spice
and if you have more money than you knew what to do with always there is the option of AGM-137, AGM-154, AGM-158 and SCALP-EG

Have you discussed your obviously correct concerns with those who’ve built these? Obviously they missed something you did not.

Back to reality, Iran is one of the top builders of underground construction material. Material that at enough depth nothing currently available can penetrate. Although Iran did not think of entrances like you said. Billions went poof!

 

[Flames In The Desert]

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[wudangmaster]

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Azarmehr on the Mehraein podcasts kept insisting that the AMs have a newer aesa...

 

[Immortals]

Azarmehr on the Mehraein podcasts kept insisting that the AMs have a newer aesa...

If Iran made an AESA for F-14 they would scream it off every rooftop and say it could detect UFOs and is superior to any other fighter jet radar in the world.

The fact Iran says nothing means the simple answer is the radar has had little modifications done to it other than to keep it maintained and functional

 

[AmirIGM]

It's a standard AWG-9 with maybe a few small upgrades. To make it an AESA they'd have to make basically an entire new radar set which would be a monumental task. This video shows the reality. There are some pictures of the cockpit out there on the internet too and it looks identical to a standard F-14A cockpit.

If it was up to me every one of those 58 or so airframes left (more than the reported Su-35 purchase!) would get new engines, glass cockpit, AESA, Phoenix replacement, and the best medium and short range missiles we could get from the Chinese or Russians. But I'm just a random F-14 nerd on the internet.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

So what is new on Iran Airforce , and Sukhoi project ?

Not much news about the Russian new planes or Iran's own local production