JF-17 PFX program

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Attaining basic Engine from China , TOT should be priority which can serve the JF17 and future needs, 100% local production

After operating JF17 for 15+ years , we should be building own Engines at least for JF17 Program and J10C

The Engine for J35 could be discussed for rebuilding setup in future

As for retirement of F7 and Mirage , combination of J10C and J35 is no brainier. KAAN platform is also promising option

We need to go beyond old excuse , we lack "something" , China is just across the border , and we have good ties with China
Unsure why there is lack of expediting the attainment of basic Engine (Licence Production , we are flying 150+ units so discussion of TOT should be top on agenda)

Attaining the full production setup for J10C could replace the Mirage rebuild factory 100% , a decent 4th Generation craft

 

[Ali_Baba]

enthusiasm in the Thunder is on the down, not up.

The future is stealth, priorities change. JF17 has served Pakistan fantastically well.

Ultimately, AHQ never saw the JF-17 as anything more than an A-5 and F-7P replacement. That is it. If AHQ had a bit more faith in China's industry in the early 1990s, they would've tried buying a share in the J-10 program rather than asking CAC to design a simpler, cheaper design in Super-7.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but you have to solve for the problems you have at the time, and with what you have got. The fact that PAF, as of now could only afford 20 units, tells you that cash has been and always be a problem for the PAF.

But now that we DO have that faith, we're willing to get J-35AE minus any real operational maturity (a massive and arguably unwise leap).

The systems on the J-35AE have a lot of maturity built in from the work done on the J10/JF17C/J20 series. China has a massive industry where the maturity is not "just" baked into the end product, but all of the components in the supply chain itself, where those products are being used on multiple different platforms already.

The fact that the PAF couldn't even trust the JF-17B to be a LIFT speaks volumes about how AHQ views this fighter. They're looking for an exit ramp and it's obvious for everyone to see if they look past the X accounts.

Lets see what PFX is all about, before we sign the death rites on the JF17. I reckon there is a little more life left in her. PAF will get stealth platforms, but it is currently a long way away from replacing the Mirages, and the last of the F7s.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Cringe when someone says , F7 and Mirages, that we are still flying these

 

[FuturePAF]

sorry but this is all fantasy la la land.

Yes it’s a wish list

 

[FuturePAF]

... But it is a small plane
All that a la carte require a more powerful engine at least 10% better in specs and more fuel capacity.
More fuel means larger wet wings...so a different design.
One option, chuck the gun+ammo, that may give 600-900 lbs.
So a conventional pfx/thunder b4 is indispensable.

You can't make VW Golf to carry 8 passengers.

That would be a good evaluation to make, if the gun if not seemed necessary, perhaps removing it in favor of upgrading other components would be best.

 

[Ali Yusuf]

View attachment 150681


I took this photo at Dubai airshow in 2021.

Read the JF-17B3 specifications.

The JF-17 has a length of 7ft.

dont forget the bifurcated intake for optional engine performance!!!

being at riat/etc has no weight behind it, we're globally retarded.

Yes, the specs certainly were that back in 2021.
The situation changed, it seems, when RD-93MA started becoming available, and the newer Block-IIIs apparently started getting equipped with the engine.

Source

 

[FuturePAF]

If an ordinary Pakistani military fan were to make such remarks, it would be perfectly normal. However, as a "Think Tank: Consultant," such remarks are inappropriate and will only damage your credibility.

Pakistan lacks the capacity to build "the entire defense industry." Even if Saudi Arabia's funding were multiplied tenfold and given to Pakistan, the situation would remain the same.

Pakistan lacks the desire to build "the entire defense industry." Even some Pakistani members of the PDF who dream of such a goal are unwilling to put in the slightest effort toward this "dream."

If anyone attempts to refute or criticize this view, please first understand what "the entire defense industry" means.
Chinese people often say: "Anything that can be solved with money is not a problem." ------ The real problems in this world have nothing to do with money.

Pakistan's adversaries have exactly the same capabilities as Pakistan in this regard. The two countries are evenly matched.

This is an even more unrealistic dream.

I know the way I made such a broad statement sounds absurdly ambitious, if not downright fantasy talk. The goal is not to rebuild the “entire defense industry” but a substantial qualitative core. We clearly need a goal, an ambitious one at that, to expand the vision of what we hope to accomplish. We need a grander vision if we are to justify building out more modern manufacturing facilities and training engineers to a higher degree. Yes, without a vision, ten fold more funding won’t do much. So I’m calling for the nation to shift its vision, to make defense cooperation and civilian industrial cooperation a real focus, such as what the full CPEC plan was suppose to be. This is more about Pakistan reforming itself and getting serious with the opportunity it has. So this is in part a renewal of a call to focus on the economy to mutually support the defense industry.



Our defense industry needs to be more capable, so we can be a better bridge between our partners, as well as to generate spin off products for local civilian consumption. Shipbuilding leading to building fishing trawlers, MRAPs leading to building better trucks for rugged terrain. One technology, for example, which is standard in aerospace, is carbon fiber based manufacturing, which can have many applications in the defense industry as well as civilian industry, if our economy was large enough to absorb more modern products. The investments will have to be large but the long term payoffs will include improved productivity.the Saudis maybe willing to invest in these new capabilities if we have a sound plan, to make the investments sustainable on the military and civilian side.

We are grateful and recognize how much we owe China to our defense development, and don’t want to down play that cooperation in any bit, but want to be more capable partners ourselves, so we can move to more advanced projects together.

My new push is based on the recent Saudi-Pak agreement. We have to capitalize on this moment to advance what products can be made and what technologies can be adopted, quicker.

 

[Ak01]

Yes, the specs certainly were that back in 2021.
The situation changed, it seems, when RD-93MA started becoming available, and the newer Block-IIIs apparently started getting equipped with the engine.

Source

this is not a source. I have seen PAC's actual datasheets for prospective customers.

Its an RD93- Moral of the story is dont trust expo display boards

 

[gamaji]

Yes, the specs certainly were that back in 2021.
The situation changed, it seems, when RD-93MA started becoming available, and the newer Block-IIIs apparently started getting equipped with the engine.

Source

It's the national interests that dictate the state policies rather than 'requests' from a customer.

'Russia’s refusal to bow to Indian demands also signals that Moscow no longer views New Delhi as an exclusive partner, but rather as one among several competing customers in an arms market increasingly dominated by Chinese and Middle Eastern buyers.'

 

[FuturePAF]

Attaining basic Engine from China , TOT should be priority which can serve the JF17 and future needs, 100% local production

After operating JF17 for 15+ years , we should be building own Engines at least for JF17 Program and J10C

The Engine for J35 could be discussed for rebuilding setup in future

As for retirement of F7 and Mirage , combination of J10C and J35 is no brainier. KAAN platform is also promising option

We need to go beyond old excuse , we lack "something" , China is just across the border , and we have good ties with China
Unsure why there is lack of expediting the attainment of basic Engine (Licence Production , we are flying 150+ units so discussion of TOT should be top on agenda)

Attaining the full production setup for J10C could replace the Mirage rebuild factory 100% , a decent 4th Generation craft

The only thing with this is there isn’t a basic engine anymore. We need a relatively modern engine, and that will require a political authorization from the Chinese side to allow the transfer of tech.

 

[Ali Yusuf]

this is not a source. I have seen PAC's actual datasheets for prospective customers.

Its an RD93- Moral of the story is dont trust expo display boards

Have you ever been to Area-51, Nevada, USA?

 

[Ak01]

Have you ever been to Area-51, Nevada, USA?

im currently there right now

 

[Ali Yusuf]

im currently there right now

Figures. All the best.

 

[Samurai]

The reporter in this video says "Kuch logon ne isko over exaggerate bhi kar dia." and then goes on to exaggerate the details himself like he sits daily with PAC R&D PFX project boys. He calls the aircraft as "Super Stealth 5th Generation" which is named as JF-17 Block 4 in the title of the video and also calls it PFX Alpha or JF-17 T. The reason he called it T is because according to him Turkish company ASELSAN also has a stake in it in terms with radar. He goes on to further claim that according to his "sources" JF-17 Block 4 will have Chinese WS-15 engine which is going to be a change from previously planned WS-13. He further claims that this jet will carry BVR missiles greater in range than PL-15 and says its stealth capabilities will be better than "F-16". He gives final verdict that this plane will be flying by PAF soon in 2027 and this plane already has export customers ready to buy it.

Ironically there is a disclaimer at the bottom of the video that says the views and opinions expressed in this video are only of the creator and do not reflect the official policy from any company.

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[Ak01]

The reporter in this video says "Kuch logon ne isko over exaggerate bhi kar dia." and then goes on to exaggerate the details himself like he sits daily with PAC R&D PFX project boys. He calls the aircraft as "Super Stealth 5th Generation" which is named as JF-17 Block 4 in the title of the video and also calls it PFX Alpha or JF-17 T. The reason he called it T is because according to him Turkish company ASELSAN also has a stake in it in terms with radar. He goes on to further claim that according to his "sources" JF-17 Block 4 will have Chinese WS-15 engine which is going to be a change from previously planned WS-13. He further claims that this jet will carry BVR missiles greater in range than PL-15 and says its stealth capabilities will be better than "F-16". He gives final verdict that this plane will be flying by PAF soon in 2027 and this plane already has export customers ready to buy it.

Ironically there is a disclaimer at the bottom of the video that says the views and opinions expressed in this video are only of the creator and do not reflect the official policy from any company.

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

lol wait and watch twitter abuzz... Maybe our rajay babay will claim that this is his inside source next