Operation Azm-e-Istehkam | آپریشن عزم استحکام

[FuturePAF]

so many lapses.. like the separate corridor which was given as goodwill gesture but ISKP used that.. also the compensation thing.. then the development thing.. overall, a great insight.

What I’m curious about is what it would cost to meet those promises broken,

and if we carried through with them (such as hospitals, and rebuilding compounds of people who lost their compounds as a result of past operations), along side new investments to build up a sustainable alternative cross border economy to smuggling.

I suspect it would be a lot but, possibly $5-10 billion, but would be the necessary bedrock to a political economy allowing the Pakistani state the leverage to end the TTP and BLA’s appeal.

I’m watching old SIGAR videos to try to get an estimate of how far development really flies to changing the dynamics on the ground, and how much is kinetic operations by police or the military; how much carrot and how much stick.

 

[FuturePAF]

@24:48 According to Moeed, senior retired officers he spoke to believe that the only way to end this war is to somehow use the afghan taliban to negotiate & make some sort of agreement with them.

faujeets can lay the blame on "taliban khan" all they want but it's clear that even within fauj there is a major division on how to resolve this issue.

Here is a thought that should be obvious for them, I would hope, perhaps they can bring back “taliban khan” if they believe him to be so well liked by the Talibs to negotiate a long term sustainable deal.

USING Khan for the sake of Pakistani national interests (and to reset the narrative that civilian supremacy is sacrosanct) are vital long term interests of the Pakistani state. Khan would be glad to be used, IMHO, if it were part of a greater set of reforms and development he can say he spearheaded. A good way to end his political career and had over the party to a new generation of leaders that come up in the course of a term of his party in office.

What are the downsides of bringing back Khan, for just one term, when opposite to him would increasingly be Trump in the US. Back date his government to February 2024, so that he is out of office in 5 years, in 2029, so Pakistan can elect leadership, in Febuary 2029 that would allow it to best deal with whomever is in office in the US. But this would mean giving his party at least a 2/3 majority to carry out serious reforms.

Extract solid concessions from the Afghans in mining and a trans-Afghan rail corridor, that must be completed in 2-3 years, to compensate for development and military spending we need to do to secure our western provinces and the trade.

Reign in Khan’s loose retaliatory rhetoric, and bring it to vague pro-democracy and institution supporting talk, such as letting the courts deal with any abuses over the past 2-3 years, only as per the law, independent of any potential desire for a vendetta.

If he really is “Taliban Khan” and he does get to govern with more than a 2/3 majority, then he can be reminded that the Afghan Talibs don’t keep harping about the republic of Afghanistan regime now that the old political class has been vanquished, so he too should move on and focus on the future, because he still has to govern and try to win re-election for his party in 2029.

 

[Lulldapull]

What a failed state. Born and bred mental slaves each and everyone of them. Each entity is backed by a foreign patron including the military. Failed banana republic full of despicable beings. I wasn’t a fan of IK before this sh*tshow but I am now. Begging small arms from the US to take on a rag tag insurgent group. If they have to beg for small arms for a nuisance like the TTP, what will they do if they have to fight an actual war against India?! Oh wait, their tanks don’t have enough fuel, and they prefer US weapons but don’t have a choice but to purchase Chinese made due to Westerner inability to sell theirs. This gold nugget was stated by Bajwa at the security conference in 2022 in front of the world.

Oh paee, thorra lihaz kar yaar. I used to be like you 20 years ago.......Now wes in an existential situation bro. I know what yous sayin.......

but keep in mind......we're down on our knees. Russia/ China/ Iran must intervene, vurna hum ne nahi bachna, I honestly don't think we'll make it.

Situ is dire brah.

 

[EugeneP]

Russia/ China/ Iran must intervene

And do what? Colonize Pakistan? Why don't you think of forming a union with Afghanistan and creating Afghakistan.

 

[Lulldapull]

And do what? Colonize Pakistan? Why don't you think of forming a union with Afghanistan and creating Afghakistan.

Oh paee Khuda da khauf kareen, what in da hell can afghani give us? Heroine? Chars? Low kwaltty AK? Tranny action? Jungli Talibunny khotay? Millions of illegal migrants? Qaatil dehshatgard log?

We have had enough of this bhai. 50 saal ho gey ne……

We done wid afghani yo!

 

[CPTPLANET]

Oh paee, thorra lihaz kar yaar. I used to be like you 20 years ago.......Now wes in an existential situation bro. I know what yous sayin.......

but keep in mind......we're down on our knees. Russia/ China/ Iran must intervene, vurna hum ne nahi bachna, I honestly don't think we'll make it.

Situ is dire brah.

Why should they intervene? Maybe the pakis in Pakistan should grow a bone. I can’t blame them though. I would’ve turned out the same way had not my dad moved to the US and worked 80 hours a week earning minimum wage in the 80s.

What will Iran China or Russia do? You’d need to kill this cowardice mentality.

If anyone wants to see a Greek tragedy, read up on Bangladesh war and the stupid strategy used by the Army and the politicians. They’re lazy and half ass do everything.

 

[CPTPLANET]

Oh paee Khuda da khauf kareen, what in da hell can afghani give us? Heroine? Chars? Low kwaltty AK? Tranny action? Jungli Talibunny khotay? Millions of illegal migrants? Qaatil dehshatgard log?

We have had enough of this bhai. 50 saal ho gey ne……

We done wid afghani yo!

They can give us honor which Pakistan severely lacks. Although the Talibunnies Islam is hardcore Pashtunwali code derived, something of it is needed in Pakistan to counter-balance the begharet liberal culture widespread in Pakistani cities.

 

[Lulldapull]

Why should they intervene? Maybe the pakis in Pakistan should grow a bone. I can’t blame them though. I would’ve turned out the same way had not my dad moved to the US and worked 80 hours a week earning minimum wage in the 80s.

What will Iran China or Russia do? You’d need to kill this cowardice mentality.

If anyone wants to see a Greek tragedy, read up on Bangladesh war and the stupid strategy used by the Army and the politicians. They’re lazy and half ass do everything.

Oh bhai Saadi qaum ne gharat ho Jana hae. Iran must institute a cultural reset in our country. They must keep providing us affordable oil and gas and Russia must fund big infrastructure (controversial ) projects so we bypass the western stranglehold on us. And China must keep helping us financially so we maintain our sovereignty.

Look bro, this is the need of the hour. I don’t see anything else on da horizon for da moment.

Don’t forget, to our east we got a $5 trillion dollar economy chugging along, and da moment west cuts a deal wid da irani’s, theys goin become a $2 trillion economy overnight.

Our hukumraan need to factor in this geopolitical situation and make decisions.

We gotta find our footing bro it’s not looking too flash right now.

 

[FuturePAF]

Oh bhai Saadi qaum ne gharat ho Jana hae. Iran must institute a cultural reset in our country. They must keep providing us affordable oil and gas and Russia must fund big infrastructure (controversial ) projects so we bypass the western stranglehold on us. And China must keep helping us financially so we maintain our sovereignty.

Look bro, this is the need of the hour. I don’t see anything else on da horizon for da moment.

Don’t forget, to our east we got a $5 trillion dollar economy chugging along, and da moment west cuts a deal wid da irani’s, theys goin become a $2 trillion economy overnight.

Our hukumraan need to factor in this geopolitical situation and make decisions.

We gotta find our footing bro it’s not looking too flash right now.

Your right that we have to factor in regional powers in our calculations, but the Russians and the Iranians are in deeper with India. These countries don’t trust us, and we shouldn’t trust them. Limited transactional deals, such as those that go along with China’s BRI make sense, but beyond that will cost the country more then it will benefit.

This is not to say Pakistan is well suited to jump in the US camp completely, it Pakistan needs to find its niche between China and the US.

What those to countries provide, we could do for ourselves if we just got a little better at taking care of our own business. Iran supplied 6 million liters a day (37,750 barrels of oil), worth about $3.3 million a day or about $1.2 billion in oil a year at the international market price, which is likely higher than it’s being sold at.

We have to move past “the need of the hour” and do real reforms to be able to grow our economy into the trillions of dollars a year a country of 250 million people should be at this point. The Iranians are not going to be a $2 trillion economy. They are going to be more international isolated, and so are the Russians. They are going deeper in the China bloc.

Western markets are still vital for most growth. They are still vital for china’s growth, so we should not downplay the importance of finding some kind of accommodation with the west, that doesn’t undermine our interests. That doesn’t mean bases or recognition of Israel, but it does mean being useful in facilitating trade to Central Asia and helping to build up the mining sector there. This will naturally be at the expense of Russian and Iranian influence, but it will help us find a symbiotic relationship to keep the afghans in check, especially if US, GCC, and Chinese companies are making a profit. We don’t directly antagonize any nation, but nor do we do direct major deals with Iran or Russia.

We have to study how India kept its relationship with Russia, especially in the US unipolar moment, the last 30 years, and build up enough leverage in the west to now be able to have its cake and eat it to; having robust relations with the west and Russia. It’s not all about China, but their economic progress is what attracts western companies and that attracts western governments to look favorably upon them.

 

[Lulldapull]

Your right that we have to factor in regional powers in our calculations, but the Russians and the Iranians are in deeper with India. These countries don’t trust us, and we shouldn’t trust them. Limited transactional deals, such as those that go along with China’s BRI make sense, but beyond that will cost the country more then it will benefit.

This is not to say Pakistan is well suited to jump in the US camp completely, it Pakistan needs to find its niche between China and the US.

What those to countries provide, we could do for ourselves if we just got a little better at taking care of our own business. Iran supplied 6 million liters a day (37,750 barrels of oil), worth about $3.3 million a day or about $1.2 billion in oil a year at the international market price, which is likely higher than it’s being sold at.

We have to move past “the need of the hour” and do real reforms to be able to grow our economy into the trillions of dollars a year a country of 250 million people should be at this point. The Iranians are not going to be a $2 trillion economy. They are going to be more international isolated, and so are the Russians. They are going deeper in the China bloc.

Western markets are still vital for most growth. They are still vital for china’s growth, so we should not downplay the importance of finding some kind of accommodation with the west, that doesn’t undermine our interests. That doesn’t mean bases or recognition of Israel, but it does mean being useful in facilitating trade to Central Asia and helping to build up the mining sector there. This will naturally be at the expense of Russian and Iranian influence, but it will help us find a symbiotic relationship to keep the afghans in check, especially if US, GCC, and Chinese companies are making a profit. We don’t directly antagonize any nation, but nor do we do direct major deals with Iran or Russia.

We gotta play all these powers surrounding us against each other. And negotiate the best deal for us…..in a way I’m glad we’ve worked out a deal wid dem irani’s to keep us afloat on cheap oil n gas. CPEC must be resurrected and made viable. Russian naal we must do that TAPI PAPI pipeline and do that railway going north and west to turkey via Iran.

When we got all this happening, western gubments will come over to negotiate too, but if we don’t do the ground work and put the infra in place, phir kuchh ne hona.

Then they will all realize wes incompetent, which is exactly the motivation here to pull ourselves out of this swamp.

 

[EugeneP]

Iran must institute a cultural reset in our country. They must keep providing us affordable oil and gas and Russia must fund big infrastructure (controversial) projects, so we bypass the western stranglehold on us. And China must keep helping us financially, so we maintain our sovereignty.

I know English is your second language, but you must understand the meaning of the word 'must'. Your list of demands has a ring of satire.

 

[Lulldapull]

I know English is your second language, but you must understand the meaning of the word 'must'. Your list of demands has a ring of satire.

Bro, when da Situ is dire, then satire turns into a choir no?

Yous got good people here too, who actually care about our country. Not everyone’s a peasant here, in case yous wuz wonderin.

 

[FuturePAF]

We gotta play all these powers surrounding us against each other. And negotiate the best deal for us…..in a way I’m glad we’ve worked out a deal wid dem irani’s to keep us afloat on cheap oil n gas. CPEC must be resurrected and made viable. Russian naal we must do that TAPI PAPI pipeline and do that railway going north and west to turkey via Iran.

When we got all this happening, western gubments will come over to negotiate too, but if we don’t do the ground work and put the infra in place, phir kuchh ne hona.

Then they will all realize wes incompetent, which is exactly the motivation here to pull ourselves out of this swamp.

Iran and Russia won’t spend the big bucks until we spend equally, as in the case with the pipeline between Iran and Pakistan.

None of these countries are giving free rides. So first we have to determine where we can raise funding from, our own local taxpayers, FDI from the diaspora, or what foreign country is willing to invest under the circumstances.

We don’t have many options to play one country off another, if we ourselves don’t have the ground realities set first.

Genuine domestic political harmony and control of the security situation leading to increase tax revenue and FDI from the diaspora are the first steps to domestic growth, upon which we can attract foreign investment and cooperation. When we see who is willing to cooperate after those reforms, then we can see which way we can go.

Our own local investors are running away, so we need to stop the bleeding first before looking for a transfusion.

 

[Dalit]

What a failed state. Born and bred mental slaves each and everyone of them. Each entity is backed by a foreign patron including the military. Failed banana republic full of despicable beings. I wasn’t a fan of IK before this sh*tshow but I am now. Begging small arms from the US to take on a rag tag insurgent group. If they have to beg for small arms for a nuisance like the TTP, what will they do if they have to fight an actual war against India?! Oh wait, their tanks don’t have enough fuel, and they prefer US weapons but don’t have a choice but to purchase Chinese made due to Westerner inability to sell theirs. This gold nugget was stated by Bajwa at the security conference in 2022 in front of the world.

It is really hard to believe that this army that projects itself as a saviour of Pakistan and a nuclear capable power is requesting for small arms to fight TTP/Taliban in Afghanistan.

 

[Mrc]

@24:48 According to Moeed, senior retired officers he spoke to believe that the only way to end this war is to somehow use the afghan taliban to negotiate & make some sort of agreement with them.

faujeets can lay the blame on "taliban khan" all they want but it's clear that even within fauj there is a major division on how to resolve this issue.

Who told you that