PAF F-16 | Discussions

[Night Memory]

ah yes, everyone should forget their own interests and focus on ours amirite?

China, and the Turks do the same BTW. Why was the PAF only allowed to buy PL-15's with J-10s?

Why *should* the us help a competitor's sale?

I love how you throw shade on Chinese while refuse to acknowledge the fact that Americans are thousands time more untrustworthy than Chinese when it comes to our military support. As if wheat and soybeans were not enough, China has actively supported Pakistan and is the best partner we have ever had. Its seriously cringe how you keep on trying to make the J-10 acquisition controversial while America left our airforce to the dogs for decades and didnt even bother offering us a V upgrade until their F-16s are basically technologically junk.

 

[Ak01]

Cheapest thing to induct are additional JF-17 Block 3s. Why are you so heavily insistent on F-16s?

Sorry if facts hurt your feelings. But cheap in cost could end up very expensive in capability.


Why am I insistent on the F-16? Find me another fighter the PAF has a history of excellence, tactics development, experience and in depth knowledge of.

 

[Ak01]

I love how you throw shade on Chinese while refuse to acknowledge the fact that Americans are thousands time more untrustworthy than Chinese when it comes to our military support. As if wheat and soybeans were not enough, China has actively supported Pakistan and is the best partner we have ever had. Its seriously cringe how you keep on trying to make the J-10 acquisition controversial while America left our airforce to the dogs for decades and didnt even bother offering us a V upgrade until their F-16s are basically technologically junk.

It is not my fault your comprehension abilities are not up to par.

 

[hnn]

If Türkiye gets back in the F-35 program and also purchases the Eurofighter as well as gets an American upgrade of its F-16s, while continuing with the Ozgur and KAAN programs, does this indicate they will have F-16 airframes on hand to get the Ozgur upgrade and eventually have enough life in them to be worthwhile (for the PAF) to sell onto Pakistan, if cleared by the US?

Would the PAF want second hand Turkish F-16s with GE engines?

In theory, PAF most definitely would be interested in it simply because Turkish MGB and OFP would allow integration of Chinese and Indigenous Weapons on the F-16. The logistal burden that would come with the GE engines would be a fair trade off in this scenario. Ozgur 2 would be a better choice than Ozgur 1 IMO (because the former would have more service life in them being Block 40/50)

However, IRL, this is a mere theoretical possibility as for it come true a number of diplomatic and then logistical variables need to be favorable.

Put simply, US won't allow it, mainly because they'll loose the leverage on our operations and the power imbalance it'll create b/w Pakistan and India directly and indirectly (with more access to F-16 subsystems Pakistan's own aircraft programs will improve).

 

[Night Memory]

lets be fair lol.

the reason the PAF was not given harpoons because the worry of us strapping nukes into them was there.

We did this to ourself.

The PN has access to harpoons...why? because they know we cant use P3's to strike indian cities lol.

So we did this to ourselves by wanting to have the capability to nuke indian cities while they already have the ability? Thought Americans followed the concept of keeping the balance. You are the best unpaid lawyer of US MIC on this forum. You will defend literally any and everything.

 

[Night Memory]

Sorry if facts hurt your feelings. But cheap in cost could end up very expensive in capability.


Why am I insistent on the F-16? Find me another fighter the PAF has a history of excellence, tactics development, experience and in depth knowledge of.

Your whole argument about F-16s being cheap is a lie which is why now you have diverted to “cost vs capability” line.

Well if its regards to capability then J-10Cs knocks the F-16V out of the water any day, every day.

Beside the fact that PL-15 is more affordable and has equal if not better range to AIM 120-D.

And the fact that there is no end user agreement which we have in the F-16s.

What use was that depth of knowledge and tactics when it was the newly acquired J-10Cs which shot down the indian jets while the F-16s hid behind the JF-17s let alone the J-10s.

Dont give baseless arguments and follow your own advice for once - start stating facts, its not me who is being emotional here.

 

[Night Memory]

It is not my fault your comprehension abilities are not up to par.

I rue wasting my time listening to the QUWA podcast if it had such biased, rude, non-sensical clowns like you speaking there as experts.

You have knowledge but you are clearly biased especially when it comes to American weapons.

 

[Ibbi32]

So we did this to ourselves by wanting to have the capability to nuke indian cities while they already have the ability? Thought Americans followed the concept of keeping the balance. You are the best unpaid lawyer of US MIC on this forum. You will defend literally any and everything.

Kisi tarah toh apna bhi eff sola khareedna hai

 

[Trailer23]

Interesting video. Silly video thumbnail tho. Their technical commentary is mostly respectful of the platform and (at times) of the Pakistan Air Force’s competence, they repeatedly call the PAF “extremely capable,” “incredibly skilled,” and treat the F-16 as a serious threat system. That part doesn’t read like cartoonish chest-thumping.

But their behavioral framing toward Pakistan is clearly adversarial and smug in a few places as per usual:

• They talk about Pakistan as a “problem object,” not a country with interests. Lines like “continued headache for us” set a tone where Pakistan’s capability is framed as an annoyance that needs managing, not something to understand neutrally.
• There’s casual, snide insinuation about Pakistan-US politics. “Field marshal Munir made friends with the US president… and the PAF got this upgrade” is presented like a wink-wink transactional payoff. That may be plausible as political analysis, but the delivery is more sneer than evidence-led.
• They slip into triumphal/loose claims without care. “India’s knocked down a few on the ground,” “I think we knocked one of them out… we don’t know,” etc. Saying contested things as if they’re basically settled (then half-walking it back) is a tell of partisan posture rather than analyst discipline.
• They use humor to belittle rather than illuminate. The “IMF paying Lockheed?” / “dole” bit is a cheap laugh at Pakistan’s finances. It’s not overt hate, but it is derisive — the kind of jab that signals “we’re above them.”
• They treat escalation like sports commentary at times. The vibe is “threat scoreboard” more than “war is serious.” That’s common in nationalist defense media, but it’s still a tone choice.

So my frank read: they’re not rabidly anti-Pakistan, and they do credit Pakistan’s operational skill and acknowledge capability gaps on India’s side, that’s better than a lot of commentary. But they’re also clearly speaking from an Indian “us vs them” lens, with occasional smugness and cheap shots, and they sometimes let narrative satisfaction outrun evidentiary caution.

WoW..., you really did cover EVERYTHING.

Yeah - I was planning on doing that, especially with Quotes ... but clearly you've done a far better job.

You forgot at one point they aren't even sure if they hit an AWAC or EW.

But then what can they do. This is all thanks to their PM & Sleepy Joe Air Chief.

Flown in the viper as sitting in the back and being flown around like a teenager?

Yeah, obviously.

The guy on the Right (Visnu) has flown in the Viper 03 Times (USAF, UAEAF and some other). Most people don't get to even sit in a Viper - let alone get an Incentive Ride.

 

[Night Memory]

Kisi tarah toh apna bhi eff sola khareedna hai

The more i read into F-16V upgrade, the more impossible it seems from a financial point of view. Not to mention, when Trump is gone, you might have the dems back in power or JD Vance who could be compromised due to the indian connection.

 

[Vapnope]

Spot on... Shiv Aroor's tweets on X are evidence of his bias against Pakistan... I think this was a carefully scripted show for audience, where they seem to be accepting PAF's professionalism to sound neutral but underlying message is same "India great, Pakistan bad"

Shiv is a BJP shill, nothing of substance can come out of his work. Lets put him as baba banares of indian journalism.

 

[Yasser76]

Shiv is a BJP shill, nothing of substance can come out of his work. Lets put him as baba banares of indian journalism.

Yeah, I remember back in 2019 he claimed a "foreign ally" had shown him proof of shot down PAF F-16 via sat photos.

No one else on the planet saw them, just him. This is how credible he is.

 

[Vapnope]

Yeah, I remember back in 2019 he claimed a "foreign ally" had shown him proof of shot down PAF F-16 via sat photos.

No one else on the planet saw them, just him. This is how credible he is.

His timeline is full of such nonsense. So yeah shows his credibility.

 

[Yasser76]

His timeline is full of such nonsense. So yeah shows his credibility.

Problem is he gets a big national platform, so you end up with hundreds of millions of people eating the shit he feeds them, then we wonder why some Indian posters on here live in an alternate reality he creates for them...

 

[r3alist]

Did anyone post this?

Apologies if someone has (already).

Other than Godi Media going bezerk on the matter, you guys outta listen to a couple of guys that do have technical knowledge - and have flown in the Viper.

Yeah..., they are obviously biased. Explains why they're still alive in Lynch Land.

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Interesting video. Silly video thumbnail tho. Their technical commentary is mostly respectful of the platform and (at times) of the Pakistan Air Force’s competence, they repeatedly call the PAF “extremely capable,” “incredibly skilled,” and treat the F-16 as a serious threat system. That part doesn’t read like cartoonish chest-thumping.

But their behavioral framing toward Pakistan is clearly adversarial and smug in a few places as per usual:

• They talk about Pakistan as a “problem object,” not a country with interests. Lines like “continued headache for us” set a tone where Pakistan’s capability is framed as an annoyance that needs managing, not something to understand neutrally.
• There’s casual, snide insinuation about Pakistan-US politics. “Field marshal Munir made friends with the US president… and the PAF got this upgrade” is presented like a wink-wink transactional payoff. That may be plausible as political analysis, but the delivery is more sneer than evidence-led.
• They slip into triumphal/loose claims without care. “India’s knocked down a few on the ground,” “I think we knocked one of them out… we don’t know,” etc. Saying contested things as if they’re basically settled (then half-walking it back) is a tell of partisan posture rather than analyst discipline.
• They use humor to belittle rather than illuminate. The “IMF paying Lockheed?” / “dole” bit is a cheap laugh at Pakistan’s finances. It’s not overt hate, but it is derisive — the kind of jab that signals “we’re above them.”
• They treat escalation like sports commentary at times. The vibe is “threat scoreboard” more than “war is serious.” That’s common in nationalist defense media, but it’s still a tone choice.

So my frank read: they’re not rabidly anti-Pakistan, and they do credit Pakistan’s operational skill and acknowledge capability gaps on India’s side, that’s better than a lot of commentary. But they’re also clearly speaking from an Indian “us vs them” lens, with occasional smugness and cheap shots, and they sometimes let narrative satisfaction outrun evidentiary caution.

I am no fighter jet geek, but there is some interesting subtext in this discussion, if any of the real knowledgeable ones would like to chip in and correct me.


the Chinese fighter jets in the may skirmish demonstrated dominance on electromagnetic disruption, they were able to create a network of silent vision, radars were off, watching and preying on the Indian jets without betraying location, deceiving and distracting. Networked and linked up, culminating in the button being pushed for the pl15

The losses don't represent just losses of jet but a complete failure of Indian war doctrine.

If you throw into the attack package 6 upgraded linked up f-16s, jets which Pakistan knows very very well, aligns the legacy fleet of f16s to the same potent, well considered and well executed doctrine, there is link 16 and there is link 17.

The gentleman on this show, were uncharacteristically complimentary and respectful, they really were, the whole show was to signal that Pafs air warfare doctrine has just strengthened its spine

The f-16 s, in their own words, now relevant for a decade more, in the way the Chinese jets are. The Americans are reinforcing the same dominance they already have across a larger fleet.


India is fighting the war in opeds, on youtube channels, paf quietly going about business