PAF J-10CE News, Updates and Discussion

[ghazi52]

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[Dalit]

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According to coconut @GatlingGun Indian Rafale are the most superior of all planes.

 

[Deino]

According to coconut @GatlingGun Indian Rafale are the most superior of all planes.

Is there really a need to provoke yet another flame war?

 

[Dalit]

Is there really a need to provoke yet another flame war?

If he continues to agitate me he will get even much worse. He knows exactly how he started it. I don't take any crap from any Hindutva and everyone knows that.

 

[MastanKhan]

According to coconut @GatlingGun Indian Rafale are the most superior of all planes.

Hi,

Technically he is not wrong---. Indeed the Rafale is the the most superior of all planes but it still falls in the 4th / 4.5 gen category.

But this time around, the opponent also has 4 / 4.5 gen aircraft---.

 

[Raiden]

Rafale IMO has the better self protection suite.

 

[Oscar]

Perhaps - but not in the ways assumed.
Rafale has distributed antennas for its suite but in terms of what Spectra DOES processing wise it has a straight analogue in the AIDEWSs system and what both the JF-17 block-3 and J-10 have exceeded.

SPECTRA has a larger footprint around the aircraft compared to the J-10 but the antennas it has for absorbing /emitting signals are a generation behind (on F3) versus what is on both the J-10CP and JF-17.

That is because both are derived from J-20 tech which was developed in response to a higher threat in the US arsenal while the Rafale was to combat the latest Russian (which us still no joke) systems.

Rafale IMO has the better self protection suite.

 

[Raiden]

Perhaps - but not in the ways assumed.
Rafale has distributed antennas for its suite but in terms of what Spectra DOES processing wise it has a straight analogue in the AIDEWSs system and what both the JF-17 block-3 and J-10 have exceeded.

SPECTRA has a larger footprint around the aircraft compared to the J-10 but the antennas it has for absorbing /emitting signals are a generation behind (on F3) versus what is on both the J-10CP and JF-17.

That is because both are derived from J-20 tech which was developed in response to a higher threat in the US arsenal while the Rafale was to combat the latest Russian (which us still no joke) systems.

Errr, as far as I'm concerned, French EW has always been designed to face not only Soviet but US, Israeli and British system. For example the Mirage F1EQ series has an entire EW system designed to jam state of the art US radars operated by Israel and Iran at the time.

During the Western imposed no fly zone in Iraq, Iraqi F1s and MiG-23s equipped with French Remora pod manages to blind many USAF F-16/15 trying to achieve lock and hit.

So I believed even the early Spectra EW suite is above and beyond those systems mentioned, and overtime incremental upgrade, the latest variant (F4) should be designed with 5th gen in mind.

The new standard includes upgrades to existing capabilities like the Thales AESA radar and Talios targeting pod along with the Rafale’s electronic warfare system and communications suite.

French Air Force receives first of upgraded Rafale F4 fighter aircraft

The new jets will be integrated into the service’s 30th Fighter Wing to begin training in anticipation of an initial operating capability (IOC) decision.

www.defensenews.com

 

[Deino]

Can we please come back and stick to the topic?

 

[Oscar]

Errr, as far as I'm concerned, French EW has always been designed to face not only Soviet but US, Israeli and British system. For example the Mirage F1EQ series has an entire EW system designed to jam state of the art US radars operated by Israel and Iran at the time.

View attachment 73904

During the Western imposed no fly zone in Iraq, Iraqi F1s and MiG-23s equipped with French Remora pod manages to blind many USAF F-16/15 trying to achieve lock and hit.

So I believed even the early Spectra EW suite is above and beyond those systems mentioned, and overtime incremental upgrade, the latest variant (F4) should be designed with 5th gen in mind.

The new standard includes upgrades to existing capabilities like the Thales AESA radar and Talios targeting pod along with the Rafale’s electronic warfare system and communications suite.

French Air Force receives first of upgraded Rafale F4 fighter aircraft

The new jets will be integrated into the service’s 30th Fighter Wing to begin training in anticipation of an initial operating capability (IOC) decision.

www.defensenews.com

You’re assuming a contract for a specific customer applies to all R&D whereas that isn’t the case - and it is not above and beyond but let’s agree to disagree

 

[studsmart]

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The more I learn about J10CP, the more I like it. PAF should have gone for local production, and PAF should have acquired ~100 of them quickly. I do understand the local economic conditions as a limiting factor and then the threat perception. It seems China has not only caught up to Europe but surpassed it. Rafel is the best European fighter. J10 is the third best Chinese fighter after J20 and J31/j35 [still in the process of being fully operational]. And the JF17C, which rubs salt on European wounds. when we do a comparison, we always see one platform has some advantages over the other, but by and large, J10CP and JF17C close the gap entirely with Europe in the 4/4.5 gen domain. For Chinese and Pakistani airforce, there is nothing in Europe superior to J10CP and JF-17C.

 

[MastanKhan]

Perhaps - but not in the ways assumed.
Rafale has distributed antennas for its suite but in terms of what Spectra DOES processing wise it has a straight analogue in the AIDEWSs system and what both the JF-17 block-3 and J-10 have exceeded.

SPECTRA has a larger footprint around the aircraft compared to the J-10 but the antennas it has for absorbing /emitting signals are a generation behind (on F3) versus what is on both the J-10CP and JF-17.

That is because both are derived from J-20 tech which was developed in response to a higher threat in the US arsenal while the Rafale was to combat the latest Russian (which us still no joke) systems.

Hi,

Thank you---. This has become very difficult for haters to comprehend

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Hi,

Thank you---. This has become very difficult for haters to comprehend

The Turkish engineers have shown how to beat the French EW on the East Med.....

Being vociferous doesn't mean victory.....

 

[Deino]

The more I learn about J10CP, the more I like it. PAF should have gone for local production, and PAF should have acquired ~100 of them quickly. I do understand the local economic conditions as a limiting factor and then the threat perception. It seems China has not only caught up to Europe but surpassed it. Rafel is the best European fighter. J10 is the third best Chinese fighter after J20 and J31/j35 [still in the process of being fully operational]. And the JF17C, which rubs salt on European wounds. when we do a comparison, we always see one platform has some advantages over the other, but by and large, J10CP and JF17C close the gap entirely with Europe in the 4/4.5 gen domain. For Chinese and Pakistani airforce, there is nothing in Europe superior to J10CP and JF-17C.

Oh really ... sorry, but these are again just fan-boy's dreams like so many similar dreams in the Indian section: As such you should calm down a bit and come back to reality ...

- "PAF should have gone for local production" ... if China would have allowed!
- "PAF should have acquired ~100 of them quickly" ... if Pakistan's current economic situation would have made this realistic!
- "It seems China has not only caught up to Europe but surpassed it" ... indeed an interesting perception but surely not up to reality!
- "Rafel is the best European fighter" ... I'm pretty sure Eurofighter disagrees!
- "J10 is the third best Chinese fighter after J20 and J31/j35" ... clearly not, you forgot the J-16 and J-15B
- "And the JF17C, which rubs salt on European wounds" ... sorry, but that's the joke of the day!
- For Chinese and Pakistani airforce, there is nothing in Europe superior to J10CP and JF-17C. ... only to be topped by this sentence! What about Rafale & Eurofighter and surely the Gripen-E is also superior to the JF-17C! And for the J-10CE, yes, it's a formidable beast, but look at the PAF's numbers!

 

[MastanKhan]

The more I learn about J10CP, the more I like it. PAF should have gone for local production, and PAF should have acquired ~100 of them quickly. I do understand the local economic conditions as a limiting factor and then the threat perception. It seems China has not only caught up to Europe but surpassed it. Rafel is the best European fighter. J10 is the third best Chinese fighter after J20 and J31/j35 [still in the process of being fully operational]. And the JF17C, which rubs salt on European wounds. when we do a comparison, we always see one platform has some advantages over the other, but by and large, J10CP and JF17C close the gap entirely with Europe in the 4/4.5 gen domain. For Chinese and Pakistani airforce, there is nothing in Europe superior to J10CP and JF-17C.

Hi,

Sir---we have one main enemy---. The enemy has procured an X amount of Rafales---. We have countered with an X # of our units as well.

We are waiting and seeing what changes would be in the next batch---then we will counter accordingly---.

Our procurement and delivery is extremely fast---so there is no reason to just add up the units.

So once the next batch of Rafales come in---the enemy air force would reach a certain plateau---we can then counter it as we please.

Local production is senseless---. That would put the production line as a target for the enemy---.