PAF J-10CE News Updates and Discussions part ll

[Deino]

The ones that were spotted over the last year or so

Ah ... in fact not all in my opinion and most likely again @Michael knows more.

Per my understanding we have seen indeed several and most of them are in plain yellow primer, at least one was seen likely witha different camo and others in the typical PAF livery albeit without markings.

So in my opinion - and several credible posters on Weibo at least hint so - there is another export customer and likely a few are for this one (Uzbekistan ?), others claim there are even two more yet unknown customers (like Indonesia and according to some reports at least one country from Africa (most likely Tanzania)) ... and indeed some are for Pakistan!

But as long as we don't have any credible news, any clear images, it is all unclear.

 

[Michael]

Ah ... in fact not all in my opinion and most likely again @Michael knows more.

Per my understanding we have seen indeed several and most of them are in plain yellow primer, at least one was seen likely witha different camo and others in the typical PAF livery albeit without markings.

So in my opinion - and several credible posters on Weibo at least hint so - there is another export customer and likely a few are for this one (Uzbekistan ?), others claim there are even two more yet unknown customers (like Indonesia and according to some reports at least one country from Africa (most likely Tanzania)) ... and indeed some are for Pakistan!

But as long as we don't have any credible news, any clear images, it is all unclear.

Is it really necessary to seriously explain and analyze this issue?

I don't think they would necessarily be interested in examining this matter. It's a waste of time.

 

[Yasser76]

Is it really necessary to seriously explain and analyze this issue?

I don't think they would necessarily be interested in examining this matter. It's a waste of time.

Welcome to PDF, waste of time is what some peope live for on here

 

[Michael]

Welcome to PDF, waste of time is what some peope live for on here

All right!
Out of respect for @Deino and you, I'll offer my analysis. However, I hope you understand that I am communicating using translation software, which is quite a hassle.
======================
Before delving into this issue, one point must be clarified.

To date, there have been numerous claims regarding CAC transferring the J-10CE production line to GAIC in Guizhou. Many people appear to be firmly convinced of the veracity of this news.

However, thus far, we have yet to observe any J-10CEs at GAIC—nor have we encountered any corroborating evidence, such as photographs, videos, or satellite imagery—nor has there been any formal statement issued at an official level. GAIC currently remains primarily engaged in the production of the WZ-7 and JL-9, and there are no indications of any expansion to its production facilities.


To date, all factory-level information (photos and videos) regarding the J-10CE that we have seen has originated from CAC's headquarters in Chengdu.

So, who exactly is the customer for the J-10CEs currently on the factory floor? That remains a massive question mark.

1. If GAIC's J-10CE production line has indeed been completed and has commenced operations—and if the concurrently surfacing videos do, in fact, depict J-10CE production taking place at the Chengdu headquarters—then this batch of fighter jets 100% does not belong to the PAF, but rather to an unknown new client.

2. Conversely, if GAIC's J-10CE production line either does not exist or has not yet begun production, then the intended customer for the J-10CE aircraft currently located at CAC's Chengdu headquarters cannot be determined; they could belong to the PAF, or they could belong to a new client.

I don't know if I explained this issue clearly.

 

[Yasser76]

All right!
Out of respect for @Deino and you, I'll offer my analysis. However, I hope you understand that I am communicating using translation software, which is quite a hassle.
======================
Before delving into this issue, one point must be clarified.

To date, there have been numerous claims regarding CAC transferring the J-10CE production line to GAIC in Guizhou. Many people appear to be firmly convinced of the veracity of this news.

However, thus far, we have yet to observe any J-10CEs at GAIC—nor have we encountered any corroborating evidence, such as photographs, videos, or satellite imagery—nor has there been any formal statement issued at an official level. GAIC currently remains primarily engaged in the production of the WZ-7 and JL-9, and there are no indications of any expansion to its production facilities.
View attachment 199956

To date, all factory-level information (photos and videos) regarding the J-10CE that we have seen has originated from CAC's headquarters in Chengdu.

So, who exactly is the customer for the J-10CEs currently on the factory floor? That remains a massive question mark.

1. If GAIC's J-10CE production line has indeed been completed and has commenced operations—and if the concurrently surfacing videos do, in fact, depict J-10CE production taking place at the Chengdu headquarters—then this batch of fighter jets 100% does not belong to the PAF, but rather to an unknown new client.

2. Conversely, if GAIC's J-10CE production line either does not exist or has not yet begun production, then the intended customer for the J-10CE aircraft currently located at CAC's Chengdu headquarters cannot be determined; they could belong to the PAF, or they could belong to a new client.

I don't know if I explained this issue clearly.

Appreciate you taking the time here, I enjoy your explanations. There was a speech by a senior PAF officer a few weeks back where it explicitly mentioned more J-10s, so lets see what happens. I think they are much further down the pipeline then the J-35 is for sure

 

[Michael]

Appreciate you taking the time here, I enjoy your explanations. There was a speech by a senior PAF officer a few weeks back where it explicitly mentioned more J-10s, so lets see what happens. I think they are much further down the pipeline then the J-35 is for sure

According to reliable internal sources, the large-scale production line for the J-10C at CAC’s Chengdu headquarters has been dismantled; the facility’s interior has been repurposed to house a new-generation production line dedicated to manufacturing other fighter aircraft. Currently, only a single low-rate production line—operating under a traditional, manual assembly model—remains in operation (and this line does not, in fact, belong to CAC).

Consequently, while CAC’s Chengdu headquarters is indeed capable of producing the J-10CE fighter jet at present, the production rate is extremely slow. Should the PAF significantly increase its procurement orders for the J-10CE, the current production capacity at CAC’s Chengdu headquarters would be insufficient to meet the demand.

In the mid-to-late part of this month, I will be traveling to Chengdu to attend my son's university graduation ceremony. The venue is located very close to the CAC Chengdu headquarters. If time permits, I will invite some friends to join me for tea, conversation, and a meal—perhaps allowing me to learn a bit more. However, if my schedule does not allow for it, I will not go.

 

[Yasser76]

According to reliable internal sources, the large-scale production line for the J-10C at CAC’s Chengdu headquarters has been dismantled; the facility’s interior has been repurposed to house a new-generation production line dedicated to manufacturing other fighter aircraft. Currently, only a single low-rate production line—operating under a traditional, manual assembly model—remains in operation (and this line does not, in fact, belong to CAC).

Consequently, while CAC’s Chengdu headquarters is indeed capable of producing the J-10CE fighter jet at present, the production rate is extremely slow. Should the PAF significantly increase its procurement orders for the J-10CE, the current production capacity at CAC’s Chengdu headquarters would be insufficient to meet the demand.

In a while, I will be traveling to Chengdu to attend my son's university graduation ceremony. The venue is located very close to the CAC Chengdu headquarters. If time permits, I will invite some friends to join me for tea, conversation, and a meal—perhaps allowing me to learn a bit more. However, if my schedule does not allow for it, I will not go.

Maybe PAF J-10C orders top off at two Sqds? So 36 planes, which means only 16 more needed, that could be handled by a low production line I think?

We all know J-35 is the future

 

[Desprado123]

According to reliable internal sources, the large-scale production line for the J-10C at CAC’s Chengdu headquarters has been dismantled; the facility’s interior has been repurposed to house a new-generation production line dedicated to manufacturing other fighter aircraft. Currently, only a single low-rate production line—operating under a traditional, manual assembly model—remains in operation (and this line does not, in fact, belong to CAC).

Consequently, while CAC’s Chengdu headquarters is indeed capable of producing the J-10CE fighter jet at present, the production rate is extremely slow. Should the PAF significantly increase its procurement orders for the J-10CE, the current production capacity at CAC’s Chengdu headquarters would be insufficient to meet the demand.

In the mid-to-late part of this month, I will be traveling to Chengdu to attend my son's university graduation ceremony. The venue is located very close to the CAC Chengdu headquarters. If time permits, I will invite some friends to join me for tea, conversation, and a meal—perhaps allowing me to learn a bit more. However, if my schedule does not allow for it, I will not go.

If production is halted and slow even than why would PAF would even announce to order more j 10c or even thinking of investing in it. If it is true than it seems dumb planning by PAF while india is planning for 150 new Rafale.

 

[maxpane]

My conspiracy theory paf will get refurbish j 10c from chinese air force.

 

[Michael]

My conspiracy theory paf will get refurbish j 10c from chinese air force.

1. The PLAAF does not have any surplus J-10Cs available to supply to the PAF. Currently, the PLAAF still possesses a large number of aging fighter jets—which are significantly inferior to the J-10C—that are in need of replacement.

2. A modern fighter jet constitutes an extremely complex and massive systems engineering project. It is impossible to conceal the fact if a unit is "second-hand."

If production is halted and slow even than why would PAF would even announce to order more j 10c or even thinking of investing in it. If it is true than it seems dumb planning by PAF while india is planning for 150 new Rafale.

1. Thus far, the reports we have heard consist entirely of uncertain terms—such as "possibly," "likely," and "will"—with absolutely no definitive statements.

2. GAIC has indeed been fully acquired by CAC. If there is, in fact, a substantial order for the J-10CE, it would be no difficult task for GAIC to commence production of the J-10CE fighter jets.

 

[maxpane]

1. The PLAAF does not have any surplus J-10Cs available to supply to the PAF. Currently, the PLAAF still possesses a large number of aging fighter jets—which are significantly inferior to the J-10C—that are in need of replacement.

2. A modern fighter jet constitutes an extremely complex and massive systems engineering project. It is impossible to conceal the fact if a unit is "second-hand."

1. Thus far, the reports we have heard consist entirely of uncertain terms—such as "possibly," "likely," and "will"—with absolutely no definitive statements.

2. GAIC has indeed been fully acquired by CAC. If there is, in fact, a substantial order for the J-10CE, it would be no difficult task for GAIC to commence production of the J-10CE fighter jets.

i have an innocent question if thats the case then why Chinese air force offered j 10 s to indonesia .l?? i think j 10s are better than other aging fleet in plaaf. what do you say about ot . as you are better informed on this type of matter

 

[Michael]

i have an innocent question if thats the case then why Chinese air force offered j 10 s to indonesia .l?? i think j 10s are better than other aging fleet in plaaf. what do you say about ot . as you are better informed on this type of matter

The PLAAF currently operates a substantial fleet of J-10A fighters, as well as the J-10S variant, which was developed based on the J-10A platform.

The J-10A has largely been reassigned to training units and non-frontline forces; in practical terms, it is now in the process of being phased out and replaced. It is no longer fully compatible with the PLAAF's current integrated combat system.

In contrast, the J-10S has undergone internal system upgrades and modifications; it currently operates in conjunction with the J-10C, primarily fulfilling tactical training missions.

Additionally, there remains a small number of J-10B aircraft in service. These have been upgraded to the J-10BG standard and continue to perform operational duties.

Reports regarding Indonesia's potential acquisition of J-10 fighters remain, at present, purely speculative and lack any concrete corroboration.

Should they indeed proceed with purchasing second-hand J-10 fighters, the J-10A and J-10B would represent the most probable options. Furthermore, to meet tactical training requirements, a small number of J-10S aircraft might be included in the package.

Early production batches of the J-10C—which are powered by AL-31 engines—also fall within the scope of aircraft that could potentially be offered for sale as second-hand assets.

 

[maxpane]

The PLAAF currently operates a substantial fleet of J-10A fighters, as well as the J-10S variant, which was developed based on the J-10A platform.

The J-10A has largely been reassigned to training units and non-frontline forces; in practical terms, it is now in the process of being phased out and replaced. It is no longer fully compatible with the PLAAF's current integrated combat system.

In contrast, the J-10S has undergone internal system upgrades and modifications; it currently operates in conjunction with the J-10C, primarily fulfilling tactical training missions.

Additionally, there remains a small number of J-10B aircraft in service. These have been upgraded to the J-10BG standard and continue to perform operational duties.

Reports regarding Indonesia's potential acquisition of J-10 fighters remain, at present, purely speculative and lack any concrete corroboration.

Should they indeed proceed with purchasing second-hand J-10 fighters, the J-10A and J-10B would represent the most probable options. Furthermore, to meet tactical training requirements, a small number of J-10S aircraft might be included in the package.

Early production batches of the J-10C—which are powered by AL-31 engines—also fall within the scope of aircraft that could potentially be offered for sale as second-hand assets.

so as you said in the last part there is a chance for sale . i mean if fit with ws 10 and how many are they ?can you have any number in your mind?

 

[Michael]

so as you said in the last part there is a chance for sale . i mean if fit with ws 10 and how many are they ?can you have any number in your mind?

The J-10 fighter series did not officially and comprehensively adopt the WS-10 engine family until the commencement of the mid-production batches of the J-10C variant. The total number of such aircraft is estimated to be around 120 (a speculative figure).

These fighters have not been in active service for very long, and they will not be offered for sale. Furthermore, these aircraft are deeply integrated into the PLAAF's modern operational ecosystem; disentangling them from these supporting systems would entail a massive workload. It is, therefore, more practical to simply manufacture new J-10CE aircraft instead.

 

[maxpane]

The J-10 fighter series did not officially and comprehensively adopt the WS-10 engine family until the commencement of the mid-production batches of the J-10C variant. The total number of such aircraft is estimated to be around 120 (a speculative figure).

These fighters have not been in active service for very long, and they will not be offered for sale. Furthermore, these aircraft are deeply integrated into the PLAAF's modern operational ecosystem; disentangling them from these supporting systems would entail a massive workload. It is, therefore, more practical to simply manufacture new J-10CE aircraft instead.

thanks for your time