PAF SAM based Air Defense System - News, Discussion & Updates

[Oscar]

I swear to God i had thought the same..Lol lol..obv a special type of thread..But you are a 100% right

In retrospect the better approach is to have drone operators with cutters but the kite flying approach allows for a low tech approach to get a lot of quasi untrained talent to work.

The problem with this approach is that unlike kites the cable of drones isn’t exactly taut.
So you’re really looking for a needle in a haystack.

The other obvious approach is the bike riders with shotguns but then they need training for discipline to know enemy from friendly drones and be very focused in kill zones

 

[RedRock]

In retrospect the better approach is to have drone operators with cutters but the kite flying approach allows for a low tech approach to get a lot of quasi untrained talent to work.

The problem with this approach is that unlike kites the cable of drones isn’t exactly taut.
So you’re really looking for a needle in a haystack.

The other obvious approach is the bike riders with shotguns but then they need training for discipline to know enemy from friendly drones and be very focused in kill zones

Obv its a light hearted idea, but consider it a last resort of such. The best is what i had written, a drone/quad copter with the ability to stay airborne for 24hrs+ and with a cutting device of some sort. Could also be equipped with some sort of machine gun. I actually will not be surprised if GIDS has come up with sth like that. It should have been a priority since the Ukraine and russian war has shown the world the direction in which wars will be fought now and in the future, till we get star trek/wars like weapons.

Also, soldiers should all be taught how to fly these quad copter/drones. It should be introduced in PMA as compulsory to know how to fly them.

 

[Ali_Baba]

In retrospect the better approach is to have drone operators with cutters but the kite flying approach allows for a low tech approach to get a lot of quasi untrained talent to work.

The problem with this approach is that unlike kites the cable of drones isn’t exactly taut.
So you’re really looking for a needle in a haystack.

The other obvious approach is the bike riders with shotguns but then they need training for discipline to know enemy from friendly drones and be very focused in kill zones

How would you know which one to cut ? That the problem, so many of them and which is new, which is old ?

 

[Falcon26]

In retrospect the better approach is to have drone operators with cutters but the kite flying approach allows for a low tech approach to get a lot of quasi untrained talent to work.

The problem with this approach is that unlike kites the cable of drones isn’t exactly taut.
So you’re really looking for a needle in a haystack.

The other obvious approach is the bike riders with shotguns but then they need training for discipline to know enemy from friendly drones and be very focused in kill zones

What’s the possibility of equipping the civil defense forces with these types of drones?

 

[RedRock]

What’s the possibility of equipping the civil defense forces with these types of drones?

That should be the case. police should be equipped to deal with the drones once they have entered the cities. Troops should be responsible for when they are crossing the borders. Once they are about to reach the urban cities thats where the police should take over in bringing them down.

That is why it is imperative for all defence forces , civilian included, to be trained on how to operate drones as well as anti drone devices.

We have so many different anti terrorist squads/ groups other than the police and God knows what all, that it would be wise to shift/train them for anti drone operations when the need arises

 

[Michael]

Pakistan's friends have overestimated the capabilities of small UAVs and FPVs and underestimated the countermeasures of short-range air defense systems.

Below is a research report from the PLA.
It targets a scenario of 200 enemy drones within 30 minutes.

 

[Saifullah]

The other obvious approach is the bike riders with shotguns but then they need training for discipline to know enemy from friendly drones and be very focused in kill zones

Civilian anti drone militia isn’t a bad idea. Every neighbourhood/area has their own anti drone focused militia with a proper command structure. During war they treat every drone as an enemy drone and get notified beforehand if a friendly drones will fly in the area.

 

[ustaad]

Pakistan's friends have overestimated the capabilities of small UAVs and FPVs and underestimated the countermeasures of short-range air defense systems.

Below is a research report from the PLA.
It targets a scenario of 200 enemy drones within 30 minutes.
View attachment 200902

Translation? . .

 

[RedRock]

Civilian anti drone militia isn’t a bad idea. Every neighbourhood/area has their own anti drone focused militia with a proper command structure. During war they treat every drone as an enemy drone and get notified beforehand if a friendly drones will fly in the area.

I dont think its required. Whats the point of having so many soldiers and police then. If the military collapses and civil defence forces are non existent then it would make sense. But in Pakistan's case it's pointless. We have enough personnel to handle this, we dont need to start arming civilians for this.

On a side note:
We pakistanis are begging for a reason to shoot sth, me included. I live next to nilore(nuclear factory), so i am always dreaming of shooting down a drone/quad copter..Lol lol.. so much so that one day i saw one hovering over our house so i ran inside to get my shotgun. I loaded it with No. 4 birdshot and ran outside. By that time it had flown away..when I inquired from the people around they said Mahira and fawad(dude from the band EP) were shooting a drama or movie, dont remember which, in a house just down the road from our house so the director was using a drone to get a picturesque shot of the area. Lol

 

[RedRock]

Pakistan's friends have overestimated the capabilities of small UAVs and FPVs and underestimated the countermeasures of short-range air defense systems.

Below is a research report from the PLA.
It targets a scenario of 200 enemy drones within 30 minutes.
View attachment 200902

If you could share the translation it would be appreciated. What sort of shorad system was used. How much does each defence missile cost?(if it uses a missiles) Is it worth using missiles on fpv drones? What is success rate? All these questions need to have positive answers before introducing a weapon system. Nobody is over estimating it and neither are they underestimating the countermeasures. I believe both go hand in hand. When advancing drone capabilities you also advance with anti drone capabilities. FPV drones in thousands will make it literraly impossible for ground troops to hold an area. Therfore you can not under estimate the use of FPV drones.

 

[Reichmarshal]

Performance of the Hizbullah quadcopters/drones (commercially available) against the IDF in Lebanon should open everyone's eyes.
If Hizbullah were supported by the Lebanese army, they could have wiped the floor with the IDF in a defensive war.
Such tactics on a mass scale should be the end of any mass armor/infantry thrust, backed by proper air cover or even the semblance of an air cover.

 

[Michael]

Translation? . .

If you could share the translation it would be appreciated. What sort of shorad system was used. How much does each defence missile cost?(if it uses a missiles) Is it worth using missiles on fpv drones? What is success rate? All these questions need to have positive answers before introducing a weapon system. Nobody is over estimating it and neither are they underestimating the countermeasures. I believe both go hand in hand. When advancing drone capabilities you also advance with anti drone capabilities. FPV drones in thousands will make it literraly impossible for ground troops to hold an area. Therfore you can not under estimate the use of FPV drones.

The interception system studied is a combined missile-gun interception system. The maximum range for intercepting missiles is 10 km, and the maximum range for intercepting artillery is 4 km.

The interception system was analyzed with targets having a 40%, 60%, and 80% probability of destruction.

The combined missile-gun interception system's overall interception scores against 200 targets were 178.4, 196.1, and 199.8, respectively.

* The study did not specify the model code of the particular interception system.

 

[RedRock]

T

The interception system studied is a combined missile-gun interception system. The maximum range for intercepting missiles is 10 km, and the maximum range for intercepting artillery is 4 km.

The interception system was analyzed with targets having a 40%, 60%, and 80% probability of destruction.

The combined missile-gun interception system's overall interception scores against 200 targets were 178.4, 196.1, and 199.8, respectively.

* The study did not specify the model code of the particular interception system.

That is a brilliant system. Can we say it's like the russian BUK system. Does it also have the capabilities of soft kill? If so, it will be an all round movable system. Any name or pictures of this system?

Though i should add, problem with a BUK type vehicle is that one FPV can render it uselss. Therfore the best anti FPV system would be a FPV drone that can target an enemy FPV drone. Or even smaller FPV drones that can disable multiple FPV drones by cutting the cables. Not to mention reloading a BUK type system. Keep in mind, with regards to Pak Ind, Indians will saturate any pak system with 100's of FPV drones. Therfore a vehicle is not the right type of anti drone system with regards to mass scale FPV attack

 

[Oscar]

How would you know which one to cut ? That the problem, so many of them and which is new, which is old ?

View attachment 200818

This is only doable if you have a drone approaching in the early stages.

Once the wires crowd out its near impossible.

Where you don’t have this crowding
The other option is to start putting in - and we’re back to the kit analogy - markers on your fiber optic vs the enemy.

At the end of the day the drone is the easier target than barely visible fiber optic cable.