Pakistan-India Conflict 2025: News Updates and Discussion

You have misunderstood me about other point. If you are targeting Sargodha, you can stay well within India. If you have to target Peshawar, you have to come another 150km forward inside India and that means far higher risk.
Which is why i think PAF must understand the depth Balochistan offers and prepare at least two full size air bases there for situations like these. It will make targeting and navigation of any Indian ALCM much much difficult and their interception by Pakistan AD much easier.

Navy can do the same for their future sea sultans.
 
The bolded part of you comment is the actual situation.

India was desperate to have "Save face"......and that's when they resorted to throwing everything at Pakistan to get a hit on airbases (which btw the shit kumars think 'destroyed the airbases completely') while no one mentions the total number of ALCM/SLCM and other SOWs that India launched and how many actually scored a hit, and out of those how many actual scored a hit of any real value in terms of the larger Air Operations of PAF? The answer is that the percentage would be in low single digits. Not at all a good number regardless of it being a short war.

Also, the off-ramp for de-escalation included Pakistan not displaying any BDA what so ever of its impact on India to let their hate filled awaam gasp on the damaged hangers aerial pictures and let it go.

Lets see what we get out of it, we successfully tracked each and every one of their SOWs, right?

We took of most of them out via soft or hard kills, right?

So pretty much we know how to plug the gaps now and above all, exact radar tracking ability, warning times, RCS so much data etc. They actually showed their Aces when simple Kings/Queens could have sufficed to win the round.

Also, even this time they thought that issuing NOTAMs before the 7th May would confuse PAF, yet PAF tracked each and every one of their aircraft when it got airborne. Next time we have intelligence that they are preparing, rest assured we will have on the ground intel, we know the only trick they have........and prepare for CMs barrage because zero chance in hell or earth that they will risk flying even within 200km of the IB. But then that makes their targeting and navigation of CMs difficult as well over a longer range firing and allows you ample time/warning time.

What Pakistan needs is more quantity of IADS.........and the good part is we need to cover the eastern flanks only.......we already have systems that work, that our people are trained on, that worked in actual combat situation, you simply purchase and integrate more of them.

meanwhile what does IAF has to show for it? Purchase more Rafales? Or more ALCM/SLCMs? Heck, show me one kill they got from the over hyped S-400? Their operators have no idea how to work in a networked environment.....2019 own fratricide is a perfect example of this.

Their M2Ks and Mig 29s and Rafales are no where networked with their IADS........

But this is all weapons and tactics.

Another deterrence was and proven that still is valid today is that of diplomacy. India was pressured by the world to stop. As much as they claim themselves to not be dictated by anyone, no, they are no where near that independent adventurism yet. They had to listen to the world and consider de escalating.

Imagine China went to 4 day war with India........you suppose they will listen to anyone to stop? Nope. But India ain't even a tenth of the super power they claim and make it ought to be.

👇🏻 Is what I had to say to the members from our East in a discussion about a month back.

You already used your top tier systems (below Nuclear Threshold), we didn't - but we still came out on top - we brought a knife to a gun fight and still WON - let that reality sink in for a moment
 
@HemlockKhalid/AeronautIR and @side-winder

Would damage to C2 Posts in IOJK (given the terrain) and Mission Kill on Beas Storage Site even show up clearly on publicly available satellite feed?

No idea. I haven't seen the SAT imageries. Neither did i speak to anyone at the Space directorate of PAF.

I have mentioned few things i knew for sure - won't comment on the damage on their side - Until i see something for myself or talk to someone with the knowledge in all honesty.
 
@side-winder @HemlockKhalid/AeronautIR from what i read here i observed that ALCM is more difficult to intercept than SSM?
Also, when on May 7, we were ready and IAF came to strike our 9 locations, first i heard that 2 were hit by ALCM and other 7 sites by SSM. if so, why we have zero interception on the first 7 may attack? atleast we should have intercepted the SSM? or we were not ready? and after that we were ready and interception was good?
 
Again, these concepts are subjective and whole base of deterrence theory is assumption that actors are rational. If they become irrational, deterrence theory can't be academically applied.

@Tariq Habib Afridi

👆🏻 The bold part up there is the core on which Deterrence rely - ask yourself a question here i.e. why does a rational (not irrational) person commit a murder knowing if they get caught they'll be prosecuted? They might have multiple reasons that makes them think about the act but to eventually commit the act they have to first somehow convince themselves that they can get away with it. OTOH, for a sociopathic serial killer (irrational person), consequences of their actions are never taken into the decision-making/action equation to begin with.

Now scale the above psychological insight and apply to Indian leadership. Is it then:
  • The leadership is rational but thought they'd get away with their actions?
  • The leadership is irrational and didn't care what the consequences to their actions are?

Now put it in the context of a military conflict. If two adversaries are peers in military firepower but have large differences to their depth of attrition (total combined force + assets) and resources to replenish losses (total production capacity + cash flow) - can in reality, the side with attrition and resources advantage ever truly and entirely convince itself that they can not get away with their actions?
 
@side-winder @HemlockKhalid/AeronautIR from what i read here i observed that ALCM is more difficult to intercept than SSM?
Also, when on May 7, we were ready and IAF came to strike our 9 locations, first i heard that 2 were hit by ALCM and other 7 sites by SSM. if so, why we have zero interception on the first 7 may attack? atleast we should have intercepted the SSM? or we were not ready? and after that we were ready and interception was good?

We don't have enough systems to protect the entire landmass including civilians areas. Also, it was variety of options used by Indian Army at remaining sites.

Overall our AD net needs alot of improvements. But its an expensive business - the economy matters.
 
Interesting video so far. I wonder if our military establishment is planning for this scenario ...
What? You don't think our military plans for these eventualities?

They have hundreds of plans and contingencies in place for hostilities with India.

There are teams of people who's sole job is to think of scenarios and make plans as many as possible for each one of those scenarios. When the times comes, the best of those plans are put into action. They rigourously train and rehearse for those scenarios as well.

February 2019: India surprised, 2 aircraft lost.
May 2025: India surprised, 7 aircraft lost, Indian Air Farce grounded.
 
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. If Pakistan had also used cruise missiles that would escalated thr war into something big.
Exactly, if India doesn't pays a price of killing innocent Pakistanis equally and things don't escalate to full scale war they will keep on doing this, war is the only solution, than come what may.
 
We don't have enough systems to protect the entire landmass including civilians areas. Also, it was variety of options used by Indian Army at remaining sites.

Overall our AD net needs alot of improvements. But its an expensive business - the economy matters.
That make sense. Thank you
 
Which is why i think PAF must understand the depth Balochistan offers and prepare at least two full size air bases there for situations like these. It will make targeting and navigation of any Indian ALCM much much difficult and their interception by Pakistan AD much easier.

Navy can do the same for their future sea sultans.

Bhai, do you even have an idea how expensive it is to build an airbase? You can't spare shit from the budget especially now when alot of the stuff is screaming to be procured including new AD systems.
 
Bhai, do you even have an idea how expensive it is to build an airbase? You can't spare shit from the budget especially now when alot of the stuff is screaming to be procured including new AD systems.
I understand that a new airbase will require shit tons of capital expenditure upfront along with support facilities (housing colony for example) but maybe J-35s can be positioned there.....to save from the initial barrage of CMs coming from east and south east while they can take off with fuel tanks and jettison over empty lands in sindh when going towards marine/land targets and into the hot zone to take enemy Anti Air assets and CM launchers.......... Something like this can be done or thought at least.....
 
If it's not classified info, how many targets were hit by PAF and where to actually look, I've went over sat images of pathankot, Bathinda, awantipora, Sirinagar and barnala IACCS, even looked up the supply depot of Chandigarh that was claimed to be hit.
Tbh I've given up, all my hopes are on @Panzerkiel thread that's he gonna post on 7 may 2026 as promised by him.
...our deepest strike was in Subroto Park.....you can see whats located there!
 
That is actually another issue regarding PR and disclosure of info.

As an e.g. I also know of two individuals who were in the air during SR from 29sq - and so when asked regd Su-30 they made a statement which aligns with ELINT+HUMINT confirming it went down. Did it go down immediately or did it crash while in the vicinity of Avantipur are two things I have heard but the latter is from an individual not involved in SR but at AHQ. Ab kiski baat sunein? There too there is no picture.

Going further back some 14 years ago I am chatting with a former CPD JF-17 in a casual setting and I mention a low RCS mirage that was done. His eyes went up and asked me "who told you that?!".
Now I didnt tell him that I was told than as a 13 year old from a then Head of Kamra.

Can I prove it to you? No
Ab agar aik AVM ko terah saal ke bachey ki knowledge facinate ki, unhun ne lambi guftugu ki aur bohat kuch bataya tu ab kiski "ghalati" ya kaun si baat ko sachai ka tarazu mein tola jaye?? :geek:
😂
Reminds me of 14 year old me telling AOC SAC (who later became CAS) what snorkeling meant in terms of submarine warfare and why do SSKs have to snorkel from time to time 😀
 

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