PL-15E and HQ-16FE improvements needed?

[ety]

J-16 is a Chinese fighter and you still need Russian approval ? So China does not have IP rights for the Chinese Flankers ?

The air frame is Soviet/Russian design, and I think Russians don't want to see J 16 competing with their aircrafts. China doesn't want to irk them.

 

[ety]

The PLAAF has the funds, but if the PAF devices to go for the J-10 in a big way, it might be worth it for the PAF. Ideally they should just go for more J-35s.

PAF basically can't use the 75 F 16 against India in conflict or war ? So need some more higher end capable fighters other than the 36 J 10C already ordered. J 35A is still years away being inducted to PAF, so some more order of J 10C like 30 is sensible for the time being.

 

[Yasser76]

PAF basically can't use the 75 F 16 against India in conflict or war ? So need some more higher end capable fighters other than the 36 J 10C already ordered. J 35A is still years away being inducted to PAF, so some more order of J 10C like 30 is sensible for the time being.

F-16 may even have been a liability in the recent conflict as JF-17 and J-10 dully integrated into our Cyber/EW/AEW set up. Difficult to do with US equipment as permission needed. Actually could have been a chance of friendly fire if we had so many western/chinese jets up in the air at the same time

 

[FuturePAF]

F-16 may even have been a liability in the recent conflict as JF-17 and J-10 dully integrated into our Cyber/EW/AEW set up. Difficult to do with US equipment as permission needed. Actually could have been a chance of friendly fire if we had so many western/chinese jets up in the air at the same time

The F-16s could get moved over to the strike role. Look at how the mirages were once the A2A frontline of the PAF, and now are seems as the PGM carriers. As the Mirages and F-7PGs get retired, and as strike can operate in almost a separate game plan, the F-16s could make an ideal platform, due to their self protection and range and capability to carry heavier loads, as the PAF’s next main stay strike platform.

Equipped with the latest Turkish jamming pods and possibly a Turkish equivalent to the AARGM-ER, these birds can become the SEAD platform for the Air Force and to cover the navy.

Allowing the limited number of J-10s to provide Air superiority and the JF-17 to form the point defense as well as strike based on Chinese and Local munitions.

 

[guangdongt]

The J35 cannot be sold on a production line, no matter how different the Navy and Air Force versions are. The J35 is the core fighter jet of our naval aircraft carrier. Selling the J35 production line would expose the Chinese naval aviation force in front of the world, which would be suicide. No transaction can be compared to China's national core security. Has Israel and the United States cooperated so deeply that the United States has transferred the entire F35 technology to Israel. No, No matter how many versions it has now. The core fighter jet technology of a country cannot be sold during its main cycle. I believe that even Türkiye's kaan will assemble and produce at most, and its core technology will not be shared with others. The only exception is that they both have equivalent core technologies that can be exchanged and shared. For example, the next generation of cooperation between the UK and Japan. Think about how bumpy the KF21 cooperation between Indonesia and South Korea has been, and see how distant Russia is from India in fifth generation aircraft technology cooperation. The cooperation between Pakistan and China in JF17 is of great historical significance. If Pakistan wants to develop its own military industry, it must master JF17's technology and establish a sound industry no matter what. This is the most important step in collaborating with any country for technological development. The sale of fighter jets brought about by the dissolution of the Soviet Union was a result of a very special era. Under normal circumstances, more countries are exchanging information on the sale of technology.

 

[Michael]

At best it'll be Pakistan making the general airframe

Unfortunately, Pakistan cannot produce the J-35 airframe.
According to public information, the J-35 uses a large number of large-scale 3D metal printing integrated molding processes. Chinese law has prohibited these large-scale 3D metal printers from leaving China.
The fuselage skin and stealth coating of the 5th-Gen fighter are highly confidential military secrets. It is even more impossible for them to be moved outside China for production.

Plus investment into HQ11 and LD3000 for important locations. While also bolstering the numbers of HQ9, HQ16 and expediting the local LOMADS.

In contrast, my suggestion is:
1. Strengthen Pakistan's national air defense awareness and war awareness education. Establish and improve Pakistan's national air defense early warning system. At least it should be done that the air defense alarm is timely, and ordinary people can quickly enter the shelter facilities after hearing the alarm.
2. Deploy air defense missiles in key areas. Flexible deployment of vehicle-mounted CIWS air defense systems. Sufficient high-altitude and long-flight UAVs for long-term early warning and reconnaissance in dangerous areas. Appropriate satellite monitoring system.
If India is willing to use expensive BrahMos to attack a few houses, Pakistan does not need to use air defense systems to intercept. You can take the form of missile counterattacks to accurately attack their important facilities. Only when the early warning reconnaissance system determines that this BrahMos may hit important facilities or densely populated areas, the air defense system is activated for interception.
The core here is long-term reconnaissance and surveillance, as well as accurate analysis and judgment. This is more effective than deploying more air defense missiles.
This is to lay the foundation for the establishment of Pakistan's National Missile Defense system(PNMD) in the future.

 

[Aziqbal]

It is high time that the situation in South Asia cools down rather than continuing to fuel hostility between the two sides. Continuing tensions are not in the global interest, especially not in Pakistan's. India is indeed much more powerful than Pakistan. Let India earn its decency and then reap the real benefits in the ensuing water negotiations.

Waiting patiently and letting India's boasts and rumors continue to fester, and when it reaches its peak, China will then publish the evidence bit by bit, which will maximize humiliation and undermine the credibility of its adversary. Just as China did in the Galwan River case.

The air battle took place right near China's Western Military Region Command, and China must have intercepted all electronic signals and possessed sufficient evidence. The West understands this which is why they admit Rafale was shot down and are not willing to go along with India's lies. So we don't have to rush at all, let the Indians keep digging the hole and see who gets buried in it in the end.

I am pretty sure Chinese intelligence has the satellite evidence and I really hope China shares that to the rest of the world including the destruction of the S400 site

no doubt Chinese have all the proofs

sharing that information is very important for two reasons

1- for the kill confirmation
2- that Chinese are in control of the information war

 

[mythbuster]

Best way forward for Pakistan is to hedge her bets .... Pakistan must not be solely dependent on any one country for her defence needs ...Pak China relations are good now but our interests can diverge in future .

 

[Yasser76]

The F-16s could get moved over to the strike role. Look at how the mirages were once the A2A frontline of the PAF, and now are seems as the PGM carriers. As the Mirages and F-7PGs get retired, and as strike can operate in almost a separate game plan, the F-16s could make an ideal platform, due to their self protection and range and capability to carry heavier loads, as the PAF’s next main stay strike platform.

Equipped with the latest Turkish jamming pods and possibly a Turkish equivalent to the AARGM-ER, these birds can become the SEAD platform for the Air Force and to cover the navy.

Allowing the limited number of J-10s to provide Air superiority and the JF-17 to form the point defense as well as strike based on Chinese and Local munitions.

Yeah, issue is F-16 cannot carry RAAD or CM-400, JF-17s can carry both. Using PGMs will be good for air support or if escorted, but F-16's air to ground weaponry (amazing as it is) is limited.

The F-16MLU/Block 52 gave us an amazing platform and ensured air superiority over India for around 10-12 years (2010 to around 2022-23). That is not bad at all. IAF got Rafale then
The basic F-16A/B ensured we has air superiority for 10-12 years too (1982-1993-94). IAF got SU-30 then

The bird has served us amazingly, more so then any other fighter (including Sabre and Mirage).

May 7th showed us F-16 time is coming to an end. Yes, we will carry on using it, may even get the V upgrade, but in terms of weapons, avionics and integration into new PAF set up I think we will now see J-10/J-35 as our spear tip for next 10-15 years

 

[guangdongt]

Best way forward for Pakistan is to hedge her bets .... Pakistan must not be solely dependent on any one country for her defence needs ...Pak China relations are good now but our interests can diverge in future .

This is correct. Pakistan has always been on the right path. It has always had good relations with the United States, Türkiye and China. Always able to find a balanced foothold. That is why Pakistan is generally a trustworthy independent country, and it is not a vassal of any country. For China, arms trading is trustworthy. Not easily controlled by other forces. There are too many countries and regions in the world that do not have their own leaders, and changing a leader means changing the forces behind them.

 

[hydrabadi_arab]

Best way to counter more Brahmos is to have our own rival missile with more range, speed and warhead. That's the only way. A 1000 Kilometer range hypersonic cruise missile is the capability which is required.

You will never match number of missiles India can throw at you. China isn't going to give you free missiles. India is like 4 times bigger in area. Hindutva regime doesn't care about border states like sikh punjab or muslim IoK. You have to hit Delhi, Mumbai, Gujarat etc

If India doesn't come to battlefield and want to fire missiles from safe distance then hit their infrastructure etc and nuclear missiles to end with. Escalate in matter of days if not hours.

 

[Michael]

I am pretty sure Chinese intelligence has the satellite evidence and I really hope China shares that to the rest of the world including the destruction of the S400 site

no doubt Chinese have all the proofs

sharing that information is very important for two reasons

1- for the kill confirmation
2- that Chinese are in control of the information war

You need to take a look at this content.

Post in thread 'PAF J-10CE News, Updates and Discussion'

May 17, 2025

Chinese official agencies officially acknowledged the J-10CE's achievements in the India-Pakistan air battle.

CCTV's latest report clearly described:
The J-10CE achieved actual combat results for the first time, shooting down multiple fighter jets in an air battle without any loss.

The video link is as follows:

https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1fRJczAEuD/?spm_id_from=333.1387.homepage.video_card.click

• Michael

• 
• 

 

[Rational Philosopher]

Yeah, issue is F-16 cannot carry RAAD or CM-400, JF-17s can carry both. Using PGMs will be good for air support or if escorted, but F-16's air to ground weaponry (amazing as it is) is limited.

The F-16MLU/Block 52 gave us an amazing platform and ensured air superiority over India for around 10-12 years (2010 to around 2022-23). That is not bad at all. IAF got Rafale then
The basic F-16A/B ensured we has air superiority for 10-12 years too (1982-1993-94). IAF got SU-30 then

The bird has served us amazingly, more so then any other fighter (including Sabre and Mirage).

May 7th showed us F-16 time is coming to an end. Yes, we will carry on using it, may even get the V upgrade, but in terms of weapons, avionics and integration into new PAF set up I think we will now see J-10/J-35 as our spear tip for next 10-15 years

Can't believe we got 75+ F-16s when we can't even use them in an offensive capacity or get any upgrades.

That money would've been better invested into a different platform at the time, like Gripen.

 

[Yasser76]

Can't believe we got 75+ F-16s when we can't even use them in an offensive capacity or get any upgrades.

That money would've been better invested into a different platform at the time, like Gripen.

Long long history to F-16s that has been discussed by many over many years on here and other forums

We got them practically free, for the job they did in the 80s and 90s (A/.B) and 2000s (MLU/Block 52) these were fantastic. We used them offensively against India in 2019.

 

[mythbuster]

Unsung heroes of recent skirmish are link 17 ( indigenous ) and AWACS ( European )..... with out these J 10C would have been eaten up by Rafael without a burp