PTI News, Updates and Discussion

[Forsvaret]

i meant defense about why your leader is just like others and not different .

Huh? All we’re asking is to apply the very same standards for Imran Khan from which you judge military establishment’s conduct. How come military dictators get to violate the country’s constitution, impose martial laws, steal elections and are still considered "patriot" Pakistanis? But you simply refuse to give similar margin to a civilian leader like Mujeeb, Bhutto or Imran?

 

[Cipher212]

i meant defense about why your leader is just like others and not different .

I don't expect him to be perfect. But if he never goes back to being an army pet ever again he has my support. If he makes a deal now he will definitely lose all his support.

 

[alphapak]

The military establishment is the sole defender of Pakistan

They only defend their own self interests, their extension, corruption overseas
bank accounts and property.

When it comes to Pakistan they surrendered it in 1971 followed by surrender of
Siachen and Kargil.

what was worse was the surrender during Salala check post and Abbottabad
raid. Gen Kayani got Zardari to congratulate Obama after the raid lol.

Gen Kayani was shaking and sweating over his property and bank account
abroad.

 

[Taimoor]

For the generals, control is everything. That’s why they don't like or support police reforms, empowered police force might become too independent, too competent and too inconvenient for their grip on power.

Civilian supremacy cannot be achieved without the civilian law enforcement agencies under the control of civilian leadership, their capacity increased to such levels, that even if a 4 star try to venture into any unconstitutional activity, these civilians forces can just barge into GHQ, grab that mofo by his neck, and chitar parade all the way to Adiyala. A 111 brigade but in opposite way. Indoctrinated to protect the civilian supremacy come what may, heavily armed and big in numbers.

Civilian supremacy is a pipedream without hard power behind it, specially in today's Pakistan. And those who give lecture about state only having the right to use force, they need to read what state is in constitution, basically the will of citizens of Pakistan. "State" not only needs protection, but force behind behind it to enforce its will. And I am off the view that when such force is established, it will never be used in anger, the deterrence will be enough for all to follow their constitutional duties.

 

[Respect4Respect]

Civilian supremacy cannot be achieved without the civilian law enforcement agencies under the control of civilian leadership, their capacity increased to such levels, that even if a 4 star try to venture into any unconstitutional activity, these civilians forces can just barge into GHQ, grab that mofo by his neck, and chitar parade all the way to Adiyala. A 111 brigade but in opposite way. Indoctrinated to protect the civilian supremacy come what may, heavily armed and big in numbers.

Civilian supremacy is a pipedream without hard power behind it, specially in today's Pakistan. And those who give lecture about state only having the right to use force, they need to read what state is in constitution, basically the will of citizens of Pakistan. "State" not only needs protection, but force behind behind it to enforce its will. And I am off the view that when such force is established, it will never be used in anger, the deterrence will be enough for all to follow their constitutional duties.

Pakistan feels more like a stage than a country right now. Every move big or small seems choreographed by the Army. Whether it’s throwing ink or eggs at politicians or hanging them. Whether it’s grooming journalists or getting rid of them. Creating extremists, running the police, influencing lawyers and judges and even local politics and foreign policy. It’s all coming from the same playbook, nothing feels organic anymore.

 

[HAIDER]

The proposed 27th Constitutional Amendment in Pakistan, currently under discussion, reportedly includes provisions that critics argue would formalize the military's role in governance and expand the powers of Army Chief Field Marshal Asim Munir. The government, however, insists the changes are for long-term stability and will not endanger democracy.
Key reported proposals of the amendment include:

• Institutionalizing the Field Marshal Rank: Granting constitutional recognition and legal standing to the rank of Field Marshal, a title currently without formal legal basis, potentially securing and extending General Munir's tenure beyond his scheduled retirement date in November 2025.
• Altering Military Command Structure: Amending Article 243 of the Constitution, which currently states that the federal government has command of the armed forces, to potentially transfer some of that authority to the new office of the Field Marshal.
• Expanding Appointment Powers: Empowering the Field Marshal to appoint the chiefs of the army, air force, navy, and the ISI intelligence agency.
• Granting Legal Immunity: Providing immunity to the Field Marshal from legal or political challenges.
• Centralizing Federal Power: Reversing parts of the 18th Amendment (2010) by transferring control of ministries like education and population welfare from the provinces back to the federal government.
• Modifying Provincial Funding: Reducing the share of provinces in federal resources and removing the constitutional protection for their share under the National Finance Commission (NFC) during economic crises.
• Judicial System Changes: Creating a new system of constitutional courts and restoring executive magistrates at the district level, moves that some experts warn could curtail judicial independence and make the judiciary more susceptible to political pressure.
• Streamlining Appointments: Streamlining the process for appointing the Chief Election Commissioner to prevent delays.

The bill is expected to require a two-thirds majority in Parliament to pass, which the ruling coalition is working to secure. The proposed changes have drawn criticism from the opposition and legal experts, who express concerns about threatening democracy, eroding civilian supremacy, and undermining provincial autonomy

 

[Goenitz]

The proposed 27th Constitutional Amendment in Pakistan, currently under discussion, reportedly includes provisions that critics argue would formalize the military's role in governance and expand the powers of Army Chief Field Marshal Asim Munir. The government, however, insists the changes are for long-term stability and will not endanger democracy.
Key reported proposals of the amendment include:

• Institutionalizing the Field Marshal Rank: Granting constitutional recognition and legal standing to the rank of Field Marshal, a title currently without formal legal basis, potentially securing and extending General Munir's tenure beyond his scheduled retirement date in November 2025.
• Altering Military Command Structure: Amending Article 243 of the Constitution, which currently states that the federal government has command of the armed forces, to potentially transfer some of that authority to the new office of the Field Marshal.
• Expanding Appointment Powers: Empowering the Field Marshal to appoint the chiefs of the army, air force, navy, and the ISI intelligence agency.
• Granting Legal Immunity: Providing immunity to the Field Marshal from legal or political challenges.
• Centralizing Federal Power: Reversing parts of the 18th Amendment (2010) by transferring control of ministries like education and population welfare from the provinces back to the federal government.
• Modifying Provincial Funding: Reducing the share of provinces in federal resources and removing the constitutional protection for their share under the National Finance Commission (NFC) during economic crises.
• Judicial System Changes: Creating a new system of constitutional courts and restoring executive magistrates at the district level, moves that some experts warn could curtail judicial independence and make the judiciary more susceptible to political pressure.
• Streamlining Appointments: Streamlining the process for appointing the Chief Election Commissioner to prevent delays.

The bill is expected to require a two-thirds majority in Parliament to pass, which the ruling coalition is working to secure. The proposed changes have drawn criticism from the opposition and legal experts, who express concerns about threatening democracy, eroding civilian supremacy, and undermining provincial autonomy

It is not constitutional. Just 2 forces are present in Islamabad. Both are protecting and extending each other's tenures through guns. It is robbery, loot, plunder, and all, but not a constitutional amendment.

 

[Cipher212]

Well it means Imran Khan is never coming out of jail.

 

[Respect4Respect]

Granting Legal Immunity: Providing immunity to the Field Marshal from legal or political challenges.

So Muneer clearly knows what he’s guilty of lol. He’s haunted by the shadow of Article 6, just like Musharraf after trampling the constitution. Now on top of that he ordered the killing of hundreds of protestors from PTI, Kashmir to TLP.

 

[HAIDER]

Well it means Imran Khan is never coming out of jail.

He did his job, nor he is interested, otherwise he had lots of opportunities.

 

[Respect4Respect]

Well it means Imran Khan is never coming out of jail.

آگاہ اپنی موت سے کوئی بشر نہیں
سامان سو برس کا ہے پل کی خبر نہیں

“And Allah is the best of planners”

 

[Meengla]

The main question i have is why allow free and fair elections and then refuse to give the mandate. This is high treason. The Bangladeshi politicians found perfect excuse to fight for independence.

When the Southern States in America seceded, the North declared a war. I am surprised as informed as you are , you discount that Mujib ur Rehman's Six Points were virtually a declaration of independence! He had a long history of traitorous behavior against the State of Pakistan. A long history. We will go offtopic if we discuss that here.

But what's important to note here is that Imran Khan and his supporters use Mujib as a veiled threat to break up Pakistan unless Imran is given the power back. Imran thowing out the NCM--which you yourself said was 'against the law' betrays his 'democratic credentials. Imran inciting a mutiny in the military to regain power shows how much he shares with the likes of Mujib.

As to your other post about giving the civilians their role: They are given in the current setup. Please don't think that Imran represents even 40% of Pakistani popular votes. Other parties have been around for a long time and they have their own entrenched vote bank. Go to the Interior Sindh: Bhutto still lives in the heart of the Sindhis and Sindh is the second largest province of Pakistan. Imran is not the sole representive of Pakistanis by a looooooong shot!

 

[Meengla]

He's bipolar and mentally ill
Just a better version of altaf Hussain at this point or else he wouldn't have appointed not one but 2 brain dead CM's

Right!! My arguments are against Imran the person: He has huge personality disorders which he shares with Altaf and Nawaz.

 

[HAIDER]

When the Southern States in America seceded, the North declared a war. I am surprised as informed as you are , you discount that Mujib ur Rehman's Six Points were virtually a declaration of independence! He had a long history of traitorous behavior against the State of Pakistan. A long history. We will go offtopic if we discuss that here.

But what's important to note here is that Imran Khan and his supporters use Mujib as a veiled threat to break up Pakistan unless Imran is given the power back. Imran thowing out the NCM--which you yourself said was 'against the law' betrays his 'democratic credentials. Imran inciting a mutiny in the military to regain power shows how much he shares with the likes of Mujib.

As to your other post about giving the civilians their role: They are given in the current setup. Please don't think that Imran represents even 40% of Pakistani popular votes. Other parties have been around for a long time and they have their own entrenched vote bank. Go to the Interior Sindh: Bhutto still lives in the heart of the Sindhis and Sindh is the second largest province of Pakistan. Imran is not the sole representive of Pakistanis by a looooooong shot!

He did his job, gave awareness. rest anyone has right to love or hate him.

 

[gangsta_rap]

But what's important to note here is that Imran Khan and his supporters use Mujib as a veiled threat to break up Pakistan unless Imran is given the power back. Imran thowing out the NCM--which you yourself said was 'against the law' betrays his 'democratic credentials. Imran inciting a mutiny in the military to regain power shows how much he shares with the likes of Mujib.

You goddamn American. You have the nerve to declare Imran Khan a traitor even though his talk was a warning to the military to not repeat the mistakes of the past, not a threat.

I am not surprised. Americans like you will always see this as a friend or foe confrontation just as the army does. This is more complex than that but dimwitted Americans like you will always see it this way.

Get lost American. Asim Munir and his lot will be the last of tyrants. Thus always to tyrants as they used to say...