TF-X / KAAN / Hürjet Turkish Fighter & Trainer Aircrafts News & Discussions

[BonPlan]

You did say something disgusting by bringing family when replying to my post without any provocation. While my post did not contain anything personal or insulting. (Should sincerely apologise)

I'm very sorry. It was not an insult, more a humoristic comment.

 

[BonPlan]

You did say something disgusting by bringing family when replying to my post without any provocation. While my post did not contain anything personal or insulting. (Should sincerely apologise)

But back to topic, Eurofighter is indeed superior to Rafale.

When it comes to kinematics, Eurofighter flies faster and higher. Which matters in BVR combat. You did not provide any evidence to your claim that it cannot sustain high altitude.

Rafale has higher turn rate at low speed. But that's only relevant to WVR combat. Which is something only Russians care about.

Sure, Rafale has slightly higher payload at 9.5 tonnes. But it isn't 7.5 tonnes for Eurofighter. Typhoon is actually structurally cleared to carry 9 tonnes. But the fact is neither jets carry those numbers into real life operational Scenarios. Because there are no combination of weapons and fuel tanks that reaches that limit while not exceeding payloan specific capacity.


There is no credible evidence or OSINT analysis that says Rafale actually has lower RCS than Eurofighter. Both were aircrafts had conflicting reports about its RCS. Both reported to be ranging in-between 1-0.5m².

As for AESA radar development, Eurofighter isn't 10 years late as you claim. Consortium successfully completed AESA development under caeser program in 2000s. Which first flew in 2007 and euroradar consortium was ready to provide partner nations in 2010 with AESA front-end. (For comparison, Rafale recieved its AESA in 2012)

However, Captor M was already a capable FCR, and partner nations didn't feel the the urgency to justify the cost for AESA upgrade at that time.

What is important to note is, RBE2 AESA version uses same back-end as the pesa version. A processor unit that is quite old by today's standard. RBE2-XG might change that with new LRUs. But it isn't here yet.

Caeser program also did the same thing, it used back-end hardware of captor M and install and AESA.

However ECRS mk0 is a new radar designed from 2014-2020. It utilises the experience gained from Ceaser program. But it brings new front-end (next gen TRM compared to the one used on Caeser prototype) and new back-end LRUs. (Much more capable processor unit than original Captor M)

As to your claim it does not have air to ground fanction, well it does.

View attachment 202039

As for radar aperture, antenna size matter very much. The more T/RM you have the tighter beam you can generate. And the tighter your beam is, the further it can see and the better ECCM it has. It is a simple function of radar equation.

RBE2 has 838 T/RM. While ERCS MK0 has at least 1500 T/RM. It's gonna have close to 50% more in range performance at minimum. (Assuming they both bring similar technology. MK0 is actually newer)


Here is a simplified formula given by the AESA radar calculator developer.

"Rfac = ((Nx/Nref)^3*(Px/Pref))^(1/4)

Where the Px is your target/scaled radar's TRM power, Nx is your target/scaled radar's TRM number while variable with "ref" in it is the reference value or baseline value. Rfac here is range factor which you can multiply with your radar's reference range"

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And we are not even discussing the advantages of swashplate in BVR combat. It allows you to move away earlier while maintaining lock. A worthwhile advantage.

This is way Turkish Eurofighter is gonna have an edge in BVR against greek Rafale.

​

No no and no.

What about the EF2000 RCS ? it is well known higher than Rafale one (see the huge and nearly in box shape of air intakes).
832 T/R modules of RBE2 : it was the prototyp, made with US modules (with a very average result...). The serially produce RBE2 AESA has slightly more than 1000 modules. The sole pic of the RBE2 AESA antenna is the one of this prototyp.
Do you really think the RBE2 AESA produced in 2026 use the same GPU than the 1999 one ? seriously. As the EMTI calculation unit, the calculation cards are changed nearly every 2 years.
Speed and ceilling : with Meteor Missile the gain is marginal, but indeed EF has the edge.
Load : 9,5 tons for Rafale, 7,5 for the bigger EF2000. EF2000 is unstable with heavy load (because studied as a pure air superiority fighter). Rafale has 5 heavy points capable each of 2 tons of load. Imagine a pylon for 2 x 900kg bombs, and the 9,5 tons can easily be usefull.
Range : Rafale can carry air to air missiles and massive air to ground weapons WITH 3 x 2000 external tanks. Eurofighter can't compete.
Price : EF cost more, and the cost/flight hour at least the double (a french source, Jean Bernard Pinatel 2 stars air general, say x3 !).

 

[Oublious]

This video has already shown enough information.

Aluminum alloy frame, hand assembly process, composite material production, surface polishing and painting......

This still presents a significant gap compared to the manufacturing of a true modern fifth-generation fighter jet. However, for staunch nationalists, rational explanations and analyses are meaningless.

LoL

ther is no more latest technology incorporated when it comes to Kaan, the skin is from compoiste and the frame is from titanium. Ther is no other latest technology then this, nor the Americans or the Chinese have different. What are you trying to prove?

 

[eIsQengiz]

As the BATU MBT motor ? LOL

The Batu diesel engine produces 1,500 horsepower. The enthusiastic French have a rather amusing anecdote about the Batu.

The Batu engines are nearly ready for operation. They perform at their best when ready, and the fact is that when a power unit is rejected due to project failure, the task of the Batu's new transmission system is to convert the torque and transmission speed into the vehicle's gears. This configuration not only ensures optimal speed performance but also gives the Altay vehicle broader mission capabilities and greater operational range, along with increased mobility through unprecedented fuel efficiency. Modern Turkey is now developing a nearly indigenously produced six-speed transmission for the Batu power unit, which can weigh up to 70 tons and reach speeds of up to 70 km/h. They possess the necessary technology to operate military vehicles, a type of technology unavailable in France or its subsidiaries.

 

[MMM-E]

KAAN vs 4,5th gen Fighters in BVR combat


-- KAAN is a stealth Platform with much lower RCS than all 4,5th gen Fighters
-- KAAN is coming with powerful AESA Radar
-- KAAN has internal weapon bays for stealth flight capability

-25 dBsm (0.003 m²) with the best possible acceptance


KAAN : RCS of 0.01 m² with the worst possible acceptance
F-22 : RCS of 0,001 m²

Head to Head engagement ... ( approximately )
KAAN : 175 km
F-15EX : 47 km
Eurofighter : 38 km
RAFALE : 35 km
F-16V : 29 km

KAAN has a modern design suitable for 5th generation.

RAFALE or F-15EX have no any chance against KAAN in BVR combat.

4.5th Fighters can not detect KAAN even from 100 km away with their radars
and they will be shot down before they see KAAN on their radars


Even RAFALE can detect KIZILELMA ( RCS of 0,3 m² ) from 90 km away

------------------------------------------------------------------------

-- RAFALE's RBE2 AA AESA Radar has 838 T/R modules built on GaAs

-- F-15EX's AN/APG-82(V)1 Radar has 1.000+ T/R modules built on GaAs

-- F-16V's AN/APG-83 Radar has 1.000 T/R modules built on GaN


-- F-35's AN/APG-81 AESA Radar has 1.626 T/R modules built on GaAs

-- F-22's APG-77 AESA Radar has 1.956 T/R modules built on GaAs

-- KAAN's MURAD-600A AESA Radar has 2.000+ T/R modules built on GaN

 

[BonPlan]

The Batu diesel engine produces 1,500 horsepower. The enthusiastic French have a rather amusing anecdote about the Batu.

The Batu engines are nearly ready for operation. They perform at their best when ready, and the fact is that when a power unit is rejected due to project failure, the task of the Batu's new transmission system is to convert the torque and transmission speed into the vehicle's gears. This configuration not only ensures optimal speed performance but also gives the Altay vehicle broader mission capabilities and greater operational range, along with increased mobility through unprecedented fuel efficiency. Modern Turkey is now developing a nearly indigenously produced six-speed transmission for the Batu power unit, which can weigh up to 70 tons and reach speeds of up to 70 km/h. They possess the necessary technology to operate military vehicles, a type of technology unavailable in France or its subsidiaries.

It is so fine tune that the 80 (+/-) first Altay use another engine. Strange isn't it?

Your Altay, built with the S korean technological assistance, is based on K2. K2 is itself a son of Leclerc MBT.
Leclerc MBT is powered by a 1500HP french engine my dear.

 

[BonPlan]

RAFALE or F-15EX have no any chance against KAAN in BVR combat.

WILL HAVE.
Because so far Kaan has no weapon system. It is a nice aero show jet without weapon system.

 

[MMM-E]

WILL HAVE.
Because so far Kaan has no weapon system. It is a nice aero show jet without weapon system.

Even 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air Missile is enough and in service as of 2026

even KIZILELMA fired 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air Missile using MURAD-100A AESA Radar


No need KAAN
KIZILELMA will be enough to match with the RAFALE in BVR combat

Turkiye can produce 7 KIZILELMA in price of 1 RAFALE
The People still dont realize what's coming

 

[BonPlan]

Even 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air Missile is enough and in service as of 2026

even KIZILELMA fired 100+ km GOKDOGAN air to air Missile using MURAD-100A AESA Radar
View attachment 202138

No need KAAN
KIZILELMA will be enough to match with the RAFALE in BVR combat

Turkiye can produce 7 KIZILELMA in price of 1 RAFALE
The People still doesn't realize what's coming

HQ9 chinese SAM is very efficient in exercise, but proved to be deceipt full in combat.

 

[Sinan]

I’ll try one more time—even though I have little hope for you, since you don’t listen or want to understand anyway:

You should stop trying.

A guy with the nick name of "MME" who posts on internet, called Turkey's most prominent defence industry analysts as nobodies.

No sane person would construct such a sentence.

 

[MMM-E]

HQ9 chinese SAM is very efficient in exercise, but proved to be deceipt full in combat.

As like your RAFALE in a real BVR combat ? India vs Pakistan

When Turkiye develops the MUM-T concept, some Countries like France , India will understand how far behind your are, and that's not a very distant future.

KAAN by 2029
KIZILELMA by 2026
ANKA-III by 2027

vs

RAFALE

 

[MMM-E]

You should stop trying.

A guy with the nick name of "MME" who posts on internet, called Turkey's most prominent defence industry analysts as nobodies.

No sane person would construct such a sentence.

Yes , They are nothing for Turkish Defense Industry who have not participated in any projects

The only People we follow and trust are official institutions TAI , TEI , ASELSAN , ROKETSAN , TUBITAK-SAGE , MSB ARGE , etc