The origin of Han China was Vietnamese?

[Han Patriot]

Typical Chinese ungrateful BS, Vietnamese should never have help you
All told, over two hundred thousand workers, artisans, and engineers took
part in the construction of the spectacular imperial complex, which covered
an area of approximately 101 hectares. The complex was located at the center
of Beijing, surrounded by the huge Taiyi Lake and a fifty-two-meter-wide moat
called the Jade River, and protected by a ten-meter-high outer wall. The center
of the complex was the Forbidden City...
The chief architect of the undertaking was the Annamese eunuch Nguyen An (d. 1453), who worked hand in glove with Minister of Public Works Wu Zhong.

Our dynasty employed firearms to combat the northern
barbarians, [which] are number-one weapons from ancient times to the present.
However, the ingenious (qing miao, meaning literally “light” and “wonderful”)
techniques of these firearms were not obtained until Emperor Wen (Yongle)
pacified Jiaozhi. Hence, [our dynasty] hired its false Grand Councillor . . . to
work in the Ministry of Works, [to be] solely in charge of manufacturing
[Vietnamese-style firearms], and all the techniques were truly grasped.

And yet, Vietnam has shitty architecture today? Even Cantonese Lingnan architecture is awesome.

 

[ety]

Dude, you guys have serious inferior complex. Why do you want to claim our civilization so much, same as the Koreans and Japanese. Many Chinese migrated and contributed to the Viet gene pool. If you had submitted to us 100 years ago, you might have been considered Chinese today.

Exactly, Japanese, Koreans and Vietnamese want to steal Chinese civilization, such Korean claims as Confucius was Korean and Korean created Chinese writing system, and Vietnamese claims of Chinese emperors such as 神农炎帝 and 汉高祖, and Han dynasty were Vietnamese. They just want to put up their ego that they were bosses of China to cover up the fact that their countries were vassals and ruled by Chinese before. I just can't stop laughing of all these.

 

[ety]

And yet, Vietnam has shitty architecture today? Even Cantonese Lingnan architecture is awesome.

Vietnamese could never designed and built such complex grandeur as the Forbidden city, they had no experience and skills whatever of designing and building anything in similar to that in Vietnam. Chinese previous dynasties at least such as the Qin, Han, Tang, Song and Yuan over two thousands years all had built similar grandiose imperial palaces as the Forbidden city by the Ming.

 

[ety]

And yet, Vietnam has shitty architecture today? Even Cantonese Lingnan architecture is awesome.

​

And who designed the Forbidden City ? Don't listen to his Vietnamese BS.​

Kuai Xiang​

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Kuai Xiang (Chinese: 蒯祥; pinyin: Kuǎi Xiáng; 1377–1451) was a Chinese architect and engineer widely known as designer of the Forbidden City[1] and originator of the Xiangshan carpenters. He was born in Xukou (Xiangshan), Wu County, Suzhou, during the Ming dynasty. When the Yongle Emperor decided to transfer the capital from Nanjing to Beijing in 1407, Kuai Xiang was ordered to design and construct the Forbidden City for him.

Kuai Xiang was in his early thirties when the Emperor commissioned him to design the Forbidden City. Kuai used the Imperial Palace in Nanjing as a model. He included features of palaces built during the Tang and Song dynasties into his design. He also drew from Confucian, Taoist, and traditional astronomical systems. This took Kuai several years, and the first palace and walls of the city were completed only after 13 years.[2]

Kuai Xiang - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[chuethnic]

Dude, you guys have serious inferior complex. Why do you want to claim our civilization so much, same as the Koreans and Japanese. Many Chinese migrated and contributed to the Viet gene pool. If you had submitted to us 100 years ago, you might have been considered Chinese today.

But no one is claiming your civilisation? Why do want to deny the true origin of Han dynasty so much? 100 years ago Vietnamese were living under French oppression because of your treacherous Chinese abandoned Vietnam to France. Vietnamese don't want any association with such people

And yet, Vietnam has shitty architecture today? Even Cantonese Lingnan architecture is awesome.

That is a legacy from French rule but anyway why your Chinese are copying Vietnamese?

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[chuethnic]

Exactly, Japanese, Koreans and Vietnamese want to steal Chinese civilization, such Korean claims as Confucius was Korean and Korean created Chinese writing system, and Vietnamese claims of Chinese emperors such as 神农炎帝 and 汉高祖, and Han dynasty were Vietnamese. They just want to put up their ego that they were bosses of China to cover up the fact that their countries were vassals and ruled by Chinese before. I just can't stop laughing of all these.

First, Japan and Korea are not the same level as Vietnamese because they were not part of China like Vietnam was, their relations with you developed from their Sinoboo rulers worshipping Chinese so Japanese and Koreans feel humiliated by it but Vietnamese? The existence of Vietnam is an eternal humiliation to China because Vietnamese are the only people to escape from your Chinese that's why your education system were too ashamed to mention anything about Vietnamese in your history. There is nothing Vietnamese need to do to put up their ego above you other than just existing
Second, I invite you to prove anything I said as untrue, just because you don't like that Vietnamese were the father of Han doesn't mean it's not true

Vietnamese could never designed and built such complex grandeur as the Forbidden city, they had no experience and skills whatever of designing and building anything in similar to that in Vietnam. Chinese previous dynasties at least such as the Qin, Han, Tang, Song and Yuan over two thousands years all had built similar grandiose imperial palaces as the Forbidden city by the Ming.

Huh? The entire idea and name behind Forbidden City came from Vietnamese

The Vietnamese royal enclosure was first built in 1010, during the Lý dynasty, and subsequently expanded by subsequent dynasties. It remained the seat of the Vietnamese court until 1810, when the Nguyễn dynasty chose to move the capital to Huế. The ruins of the older citadel structures roughly coincide with the present-day Hanoi Citadel area in the Ba Đình District of the city.

When the large complex was first built, Thang Long Citadel was built according to a plan of three sectors arranged in rings, similar to the modern layout. The outermost sector is the primary defensive fortification of the citadel (called La thành or Kinh thành), the middle sector is the Imperial City (Vietnamese: Hoàng thành), between these two layers is a residential area, the innermost sector is the Forbidden City (or "Purple Forbidden City", from the Vietnamese Tử cấm thành; a term identical to the Forbidden City in Beijing).

​

And who designed the Forbidden City ? Don't listen to his Vietnamese BS.​

Kuai Xiang​

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Kuai Xiang (Chinese: 蒯祥; pinyin: Kuǎi Xiáng; 1377–1451) was a Chinese architect and engineer widely known as designer of the Forbidden City[1] and originator of the Xiangshan carpenters. He was born in Xukou (Xiangshan), Wu County, Suzhou, during the Ming dynasty. When the Yongle Emperor decided to transfer the capital from Nanjing to Beijing in 1407, Kuai Xiang was ordered to design and construct the Forbidden City for him.

Kuai Xiang was in his early thirties when the Emperor commissioned him to design the Forbidden City. Kuai used the Imperial Palace in Nanjing as a model. He included features of palaces built during the Tang and Song dynasties into his design. He also drew from Confucian, Taoist, and traditional astronomical systems. This took Kuai several years, and the first palace and walls of the city were completed only after 13 years.[2]

Kuai Xiang - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

永乐年间，由于蒯祥的年龄还不大，资历尚不深，所以就名望而言，比起老工师蔡信、杨青，还是稍逊一筹。

蒯祥

蒯祥（1398年-1481年)，字廷瑞，吴县（今江苏苏州）香山人，系出蒯氏襄阳支，中国明代建筑工匠，香山帮匠人的鼻祖，被称为“蒯鲁班”。蒯祥祖父蒯思明、父亲蒯福均为技艺精湛的木匠。在祖、父两辈的熏陶下，蒯祥造诣颇深，年轻时就有“巧木匠”之称。洪武初年，明太祖朱元璋征召天下工匠兴建都城。蒯祥随父参与其事，在工程实践中积累了经验。1417年，受到征召入京，参加北京大规模兴建皇宫城墙等工程。1420年，因技艺精湛、身手超群被提升为工部营缮所丞，迁所副。1447年，进主事，迁员外郎。1453年迁太仆寺少卿。1456年擢工部右侍郎。1457年缘事降为太仆寺少卿，仍旧管工，以建裕陵之功复原官。146...

baike.baidu.com

 

[ety]

First, Japan and Korea are not the same level as Vietnamese because they were not part of China like Vietnam was, their relations with you developed from their Sinoboo rulers worshipping Chinese so Japanese and Koreans feel humiliated by it but Vietnamese? The existence of Vietnam is an eternal humiliation to China because Vietnamese are the only people to escape from your Chinese that's why your education system were too ashamed to mention anything about Vietnamese in your history. There is nothing Vietnamese need to do to put up their ego above you other than just existing
Second, I invite you to prove anything I said as untrue, just because you don't like that Vietnamese were the father of Han doesn't mean it's not true

Huh? The entire idea and name behind Forbidden City came from Vietnamese

The Vietnamese royal enclosure was first built in 1010, during the Lý dynasty, and subsequently expanded by subsequent dynasties. It remained the seat of the Vietnamese court until 1810, when the Nguyễn dynasty chose to move the capital to Huế. The ruins of the older citadel structures roughly coincide with the present-day Hanoi Citadel area in the Ba Đình District of the city.

When the large complex was first built, Thang Long Citadel was built according to a plan of three sectors arranged in rings, similar to the modern layout. The outermost sector is the primary defensive fortification of the citadel (called La thành or Kinh thành), the middle sector is the Imperial City (Vietnamese: Hoàng thành), between these two layers is a residential area, the innermost sector is the Forbidden City (or "Purple Forbidden City", from the Vietnamese Tử cấm thành; a term identical to the Forbidden City in Beijing).

永乐年间，由于蒯祥的年龄还不大，资历尚不深，所以就名望而言，比起老工师蔡信、杨青，还是稍逊一筹。

蒯祥

蒯祥（1398年-1481年)，字廷瑞，吴县（今江苏苏州）香山人，系出蒯氏襄阳支，中国明代建筑工匠，香山帮匠人的鼻祖，被称为“蒯鲁班”。蒯祥祖父蒯思明、父亲蒯福均为技艺精湛的木匠。在祖、父两辈的熏陶下，蒯祥造诣颇深，年轻时就有“巧木匠”之称。洪武初年，明太祖朱元璋征召天下工匠兴建都城。蒯祥随父参与其事，在工程实践中积累了经验。1417年，受到征召入京，参加北京大规模兴建皇宫城墙等工程。1420年，因技艺精湛、身手超群被提升为工部营缮所丞，迁所副。1447年，进主事，迁员外郎。1453年迁太仆寺少卿。1456年擢工部右侍郎。1457年缘事降为太仆寺少卿，仍旧管工，以建裕陵之功复原官。146...

baike.baidu.com

Dont put any BS nonsense, Vietnam wasnt mentioned in Chinese history in school because it was too insignificant in Chinese history. Korea was ruled by China diectly from time to time, it was a vassal at other times. Japan adopted many China cultures after been defeated in wars. You Vietnamese were the passing sh** of Chinese, you got nothing to do with Han or any Chinese dynasyies and emperors in history. Last, the Purple Forbidden name came from the Chinese astronomical name for the sky of stars in the zenith region, not borrowed from your Vietnamese nonsense BS, that stole Chinese names, not the other way around. Dont flatter yourselves, you people are the fringe barbarians to Chinese, not anything superiors. Keep your sh** to yourselves.

 

[ety]

Huh? The entire idea and name behind Forbidden City came from Vietnamese

Aside from shamelessly stealing Chinese cultures, what you people are capable of ? Before were and now you gov just copying Chinese reform policies, dumb. Your little Vietnamese brains could never came up something as sophisticated, deep and grandiose as this:

"From the photographer: “The Purple Forbidden City is a name with significance on ancient Chinese astronomy. Purple refers to the North Star (appears in the center of startrails) which in ancient China was called the Ziwei Star, and in traditional Chinese astrology was the heavenly abode of the Celestial Emperor. The surrounding celestial region, the Purple Forbidden Enclosure was the realm of the Celestial Emperor and his family. "

Astronomy Picture of the Day​

Discover the cosmos! Each day a different image or photograph of our fascinating universe is featured, along with a brief explanation written by a professional astronomer.

2009 June 19


Dunhuang Star Atlas
Credit and Copyright: J.-M. Bonnet-Bidaud (CEA, Saclay), F. Praderie (Obs. Paris) S. Whitfield (British Library)

Explanation: This ancient Chinese map of planet Earth's northern sky is part of the Dunhuang Star Atlas, one of the most impressive documents in the history of astronomy. The oldest complete star atlas known, it dates to the years 649 to 684, discovered at the Silk Road town of Dunhuang in 1907. A recent analysis that examines the accuracy and projections used to make it notes the atlas marks positions of over 1,300 stars and outlines 257 Chinese star groups or asterisms. The star positions in the hand drawn atlas were found to be accurate to within a few degrees. In this example showing the north polar region, a very recognizable Big Dipper, part of the modern constellation Ursa Major, lies along the bottom of the chart. An additional 12 charts depicting equatorial regions in 30 degree sections also includes a group resembling the modern constellation Orion. The atlas is on display at the British Library in London to celebrate the International Year of Astronomy.

TWAN | Night Exposure of Purple Forbidden City

A photo sequence is resulted in a long exposure image of stars trails around the north celestial pole, revealing the passage of time above the Purple Forbidden City in Beijing, China. A World Heritage Site today, it served as the home of emperors and their households as well as the ceremonial and po

twanight.org

Chinese constellations - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[ety]

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So this Vietnam is the origin and father of Chinese civilization ? LMAO.

 

[Han Patriot]

But no one is claiming your civilisation? Why do want to deny the true origin of Han dynasty so much? 100 years ago Vietnamese were living under French oppression because of your treacherous Chinese abandoned Vietnam to France. Vietnamese don't want any association with such people

That is a legacy from French rule but anyway why your Chinese are copying Vietnamese?

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ahahah, you are claiming based on your own intepretation. All Chinese know we descended from the North. You claim Chu is your ancestor, maybe who knows, they might have migrated south and mingled with you folks, but still doesn't deny the fact that Chu state people's descendant are Chinese looking.

Even the baiyue claim, we never denied Yue people's existence, but just because some Yue migrated and mingled with Vietnamese's ancestor which are the Chams, you have no right to claim Yue state. It is like Brazilians claiming Portuguese/Spanish are not the real owners of the iberian peninsula just because some Iberians mingled with the natives in Brazil. And all of a sudden Brazillians claim all European culture came from Brazil. LOL.

Chinese copying Viets? Do you even know how many types of architecture styles we have? Can you differentiate Northern Architecture to Lingnan to Hui to Kejia to Chaozhou to Fujian? China is a continent size country, heck we are not just a country, we are a civilization. We have Xiang, Yue, Jing, Chuan, Lu, cuisine, this is just cuisine. And you expect a small province sized country like yours to create our civilization state? Wake up and stop humiliating yourself.

 

[Han Patriot]

Vietnamese could never designed and built such complex grandeur as the Forbidden city, they had no experience and skills whatever of designing and building anything in similar to that in Vietnam. Chinese previous dynasties at least such as the Qin, Han, Tang, Song and Yuan over two thousands years all had built similar grandiose imperial palaces as the Forbidden city by the Ming.

Fire arms were invented in the Song dynasty, just because some Viets made good firearms, now they claim all firearms came from Vietnam. Ming also imported some Portueguse/Turkish/Japanese guns, and then mass produced it in China. this is typical mentality of countries with no civilization. They are not confident of their own culture and have to end up claiming the culture of others.

 

[Han Patriot]

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So this Vietnam is the origin and father of Chinese civilization ? LMAO.

Koreans claim the same shit....Japanese are a bit more humble. Yes, korean also claim Hanzi and Hanfu and Confucious came from Korea. They created all sorts of 'research papers' same as the numb numb above.

 

[ety]

Koreans claim the same shit....Japanese are a bit more humble. Yes, korean also claim Hanzi and Hanfu and Confucious came from Korea. They created all sorts of 'research papers' same as the numb numb above.

Japanese are more realistic in this regard because they have more self-confidence in their culture.

 

[ety]

Even the baiyue claim, we never denied Yue people's existence, but just because some Yue migrated and mingled with Vietnamese's ancestor which are the Chams, you have no right to claim Yue state. It is like Brazilians claiming Portuguese/Spanish are not the real owners of the iberian peninsula just because some Iberians mingled with the natives in Brazil. And all of a sudden Brazillians claim all European culture came from Brazil. LOL.

Now, many Vietnamese want to claim Guangdong province even considering seize it by force because it is an industrial powerhouse in China, and they want to "take it back" so their country could become industrialized and rich right away, LMAO. I often say the Vietnamese are much like the Indians, both have wet dream of trying to inherit their former colonial masters' empires in Asia, both greedily wanting to grab huge chunks of Chinese territories and both have wet dream of becoming superpowers in the world. That's why both deserved to be taught hard lessons by China in 1962 and 1979 wars, lest they already forget now.

 

[chuethnic]

Dont put any BS nonsense, Vietnam wasnt mentioned in Chinese history in school because it was too insignificant in Chinese history. Korea was ruled by China diectly from time to time, it was a vassal at other times. Japan adopted many China cultures after been defeated in wars. You Vietnamese were the passing sh** of Chinese, you got nothing to do with Han or any Chinese dynasyies and emperors in history. Last, the Purple Forbidden name came from the Chinese astronomical name for the sky of stars in the zenith region, not borrowed from your Vietnamese nonsense BS, that stole Chinese names, not the other way around. Dont flatter yourselves, you people are the fringe barbarians to Chinese, not anything superiors. Keep your sh** to yourselves.

First
In the Song Dynasty, Vietnam did not have a unified local government at all. The Song Dynasty did not consider Vietnam to be the same as Korea, Dali and other foreign countries. In the Song Dynasty, Vietnam was the "fan town" of the Tang Dynasty. Continuation is a country that must be unified; what about Vietnam?

That is to say, the Northern Song Dynasty recognized the fact that the Ding family ruled Vietnam, but did not consider Vietnam to be a country, but an "autonomous land" within the Song Dynasty.

https://inf.news/en/history/b9d2f29bc3a52145ca9fc4671e5317ba.html

Second, wrong, Vietnamese are ignored because your loser Chinese were too humilated by the existence of Vietnam while Koreans faithfully serve you like loyal little pet
For the Ming, like their imperial predecessors, the pattern of the world
called for a singular emperor who possessed the mandate of Heaven and
ruled tianxia, All-under-Heaven. This was his exclusive right. There
could not be two suns in the sky. Ming China’s other close vassal state,
Choson Korea, conceded to this view. When a Chinese official asked
Ch’oe Pu, a Korean official who visited China in the 1480s, “Is the King
of your country called Emperor?, Ch’oe Pu replied, “In Heaven there
are not two suns; how under the same Heaven can there be two
Emperors? My King’s one purpose is to serve your country devotedly.
Unlike their Korean counterparts, Vietnamese did use the term emperor
in their writings.

Dai Viet was a country with a similar cultural background and political
infrastructure, yet Ming officials preferred to see it as a distant, barbarian
land. Otherwise, it became a discomforting mirror image of China a
country with a parallel emperor, issuing Great Pronouncements and pre
siding over civil service examinations based on the classics. If Dai Viet was
not an integral part of the Chinese empire, it was better for it to be a
categorically different state. It could not be accepted as a mirror state.

Aside from shamelessly stealing Chinese cultures, what you people are capable of ? Before were and now you gov just copying Chinese reform policies, dumb. Your little Vietnamese brains could never came up something as sophisticated, deep and grandiose as this:

"From the photographer: “The Purple Forbidden City is a name with significance on ancient Chinese astronomy. Purple refers to the North Star (appears in the center of startrails) which in ancient China was called the Ziwei Star, and in traditional Chinese astrology was the heavenly abode of the Celestial Emperor. The surrounding celestial region, the Purple Forbidden Enclosure was the realm of the Celestial Emperor and his family. "

Astronomy Picture of the Day​

Discover the cosmos! Each day a different image or photograph of our fascinating universe is featured, along with a brief explanation written by a professional astronomer.

2009 June 19


Dunhuang Star Atlas
Credit and Copyright: J.-M. Bonnet-Bidaud (CEA, Saclay), F. Praderie (Obs. Paris) S. Whitfield (British Library)

Explanation: This ancient Chinese map of planet Earth's northern sky is part of the Dunhuang Star Atlas, one of the most impressive documents in the history of astronomy. The oldest complete star atlas known, it dates to the years 649 to 684, discovered at the Silk Road town of Dunhuang in 1907. A recent analysis that examines the accuracy and projections used to make it notes the atlas marks positions of over 1,300 stars and outlines 257 Chinese star groups or asterisms. The star positions in the hand drawn atlas were found to be accurate to within a few degrees. In this example showing the north polar region, a very recognizable Big Dipper, part of the modern constellation Ursa Major, lies along the bottom of the chart. An additional 12 charts depicting equatorial regions in 30 degree sections also includes a group resembling the modern constellation Orion. The atlas is on display at the British Library in London to celebrate the International Year of Astronomy.

TWAN | Night Exposure of Purple Forbidden City

A photo sequence is resulted in a long exposure image of stars trails around the north celestial pole, revealing the passage of time above the Purple Forbidden City in Beijing, China. A World Heritage Site today, it served as the home of emperors and their households as well as the ceremonial and po

twanight.org

Chinese constellations - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

What's grandiose about Chinese Forbidden City? It's just a larger complex because China had more wealth and larger beauracracy to accomodate, 'grandiose' ROFL, please get over yourself

EVERY single ruler of Vietnam lived in the Forbidden City starting from Ly all the way to Nguyen even after they moved the capital to Hue the imperial palace is still named Forbidden City, why none of Chinese dynasties ever have Forbidden City until Ming? LOL, so delusional quoting nonsensical BS, it's called Purple Forbidden City because purple is the colour of Jade Emperor's palace ruler of heaven and the Forbidden City is where the Son of Heaven lives on Earth so it's called purple. Vietnamese rulers believed they were Tianzi so that's why it's called Tu Cam Thanh/Zijincheng

These terms were commonly used in Vietnamese Han texts. In the TT, the Viet emperor is called di (帝) and the Ming emperor Ming di (明帝). For an example of Le Loi using the imperial I (tram朕) and claiming the Mandate of Heaven (thien-menh天命),