Who Created Harappan / Indus Valley Civilisation? | How Did It End? | Samvaad With Devdutt Pattanaik

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We NEED to teach Pakistani youngsters ANYWHERE in the world about the Indus Valley, Mehanjandaro and Harrappan civilisations.
 
Sir you are 100% making this up!

Pakistan has the HIGHER ABSOLUTE land area of IVC sites (a whopping 100,000sq km more). Apart from absolute terms, in terms of percentage of national land area, there is simply no contest. Sod off to your gangetic civilisation and leave IVC to its true masters.

We have discussed Bhiranna and Mehrgahr at length. Even if you refuse to accept it as IVC proper and regard it as a precursor instead, then this still means Pakistanis are your fathers, despite your protests. So, I don't understand how your point is supposed to initiate any sort of academic debate regarding the origins of the IVC. This civilisation arose in the fertile crescent of the middle east and exported its genome, farming techniques, and urban planning to the wonderment of AASI folk, who were rather simple and rode elephants and howled at the moon and carved pornography into their temples. Mercifully the export was over land, not via any contested Strait.

Archaeologists very much do regard Mehrgahr as a precursor site and this is very important to acknowledge, rather than brushing it under the carpet as is your want. I am certain that if Mehrgahr was located in the wild forests of Nagaland that you would be larping about it for a month without sleeping!

"According to Lukacs and Hemphill, while there is a strong continuity between the neolithic and chalcolithic (copper Age) cultures of Mehrgarh, dental evidence shows that the chalcolithic population did not descend from the neolithic population of Mehrgarh, which "suggests moderate levels of gene flow." They further noted that "the direct lineal descendents of the Neolithic inhabitants of Mehrgarh are to be found to the south and the east of Mehrgarh, in northwestern India and the western edge of the Deccan plateau," "

To reiterate what archaeologists have actually said: there is evidence of DIRECT LINEAL DESCENDANTS from Mehrgahr found to the east in Hindustan.

Again, would you like to repeat some sordid claim of reverse evolution?

Look at the buildings of Mehrgahr:

View attachment 197737

This was prior to the buildings observed in Mohenjo-Daro and Harappa but deploys the same grid based, lattice like architecture.

Would you like a more medical anf agricultural angle?

"Gallego Romero et al. (2011) further state that their research on lactose tolerance in India suggests that "the west Eurasian genetic contribution identified by Reich et al. (2009) principally reflects gene flow from Iran and the Middle East." Gallego Romero notes that Indians who are lactose-tolerant show a genetic pattern regarding this tolerance which is "characteristic of the common European mutation." According to Romero, this suggests that "the most common lactose tolerance mutation made a two-way migration out of the Middle East less than 10,000 years ago. While the mutation spread across Europe, another explorer must have brought the mutation eastward to India – likely traveling along the coast of the Persian Gulf where other pockets of the same mutation have been found." They further note that "[t]he earliest evidence of cattle herding in south Asia comes from the Indus River Valley site of Mehrgarh and is dated to 7,000 YBP." "

So you see, this animal that makes you belch and fahrt does exactly the same to European populations because of a bidirectional migration of genomic material East and West from a middle eastern origin point.

You have derailed the thread with your ramblings about mughals and marathas and ashoka for long enough. But suffice to say, what you dismiss as "blabber" clearly shatters the fragile illusion you have crafted in your mind of Ashoka being a magnanimous and virtuous individual, worthy of modern reverence and representation on flags and coinage no less! Objectivity matters and the same objective researchers who would declare Mehrgahr to be a key nidus for fertile crescentic civilisational expansion eastwards would also reason that Ashoka was a very cruel man, who reflected the murderous tyranny of the empires of his time. No criticism from me for his behaviour whatsoever! He is part of the heritage of this region, just like everyone else is. He slaughtered many of your dharmic fathers and mothers. So what? Should we remove him from our history syllabi because of that?
Great post, thank you for taking the time to compile this.
 
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Are these Indus, or another culture(It feels Buddhist to me from the styling - just a feeling that is all)? They are beautiful!
 
Are these Indus, or another culture(It feels Buddhist to me from the styling - just a feeling that is all)? They are beautiful!
Agree. Looks post-Harappan by some way. Would be interesting if @Distant_Observer or any members have any follow up on the precise dating of these treasures.
 

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