PAF J-10CE News Updates and Discussions part ll

[White Privilege]

In a multi-domain data linked environment, the capabilities of the host platform do not matter as much as they used to, so this should not be a factor for Pakistan.

The advantage of the PL17 would be to take out India' s AEW&C, Standoff Jammers and EW platforms that are just behind the front lines.

PL17 availability will be more factored on politics, then integration capability or platform limitations.

One thing is certain, we need an upgrade over the PL-15.Is it possible to attach an additional booster to PL-15 to increase its range?? It will be a smaller weight increase so not much of an issue....

 

[EgoKaempfer]

Interpolate the existing length-range ratio of PL-15 with your desired range (idk additional 150-200 kms) AND voila, you end up with a PL-17

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Not even sure how practical such an ultra long range missile is in south Asian scenario

It'll do a super psy ops on the Bharati mindset though! Last time they fell to the 'margin of error" due to underestimating the Chinese capability. This time they'll overestimate....

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

IAF will never ever go into air combat with PAF. Just understand the significance of this.

It implies capitulation! Then PAF will pund on its adversaries the way USAF does, and PRF the way IRGC does....

 

[ThoroughPro]

One thing is certain, we need an upgrade over the PL-15.Is it possible to attach an additional booster to PL-15 to increase its range?? It will be a smaller weight increase so not much of an issue....

PL15 still has enough range to surprise them yet again, but we are getting the longer and invisible sticks

 

[Gripen9]

Been saying this for ages, with no upgrade, SU-30MKI is late 80s tech trying to fight in a 4/5th Gen age.

It's only main attributes (thrust vectoring and two seater) are no obsolete in a world of data fusion and extreme BVR

Take away 28 Rafales, the SU-30MKI is supposed to be the sharp end and makes up 12 sqds. Add the 6 MIG-29 sqds and MK2000 Sqds and you are looking at the vast majaority of IAF planes lagging in AESA and 120km plus BVR.

Not a great position

I agree with your views.
The issue for the Su-30MKI fleet is that, despite its strengths in kinematics and payload, it is increasingly operating against an environment dominated by sensor fusion, network-centric warfare, and long-range AESA-supported BVR combat.

From a PAF perspective, if Pakistan adds another two squadrons of J-10Cs along with around 50 JF-17 B3, it could maintain a much superior counter-air capability even as India inducts additional Dassault Rafale squadrons toward 2030.

The introduction of the J-35 would obviously shift the balance more decisively, but even without it, the PAF will still retain a competitive edge in the air-superiority role through better BVR integration and force concentration.

Where PAF still has a noticeable gap is in the interdiction and deep-strike mission capability, especially involving heavy ordnance delivery. That likely requires at least two additional J-10 squadrons armed with long-range ALBMs and Taimoor to fully replace the aging Mirage / ROSE fleet currently soldiering on with those duties.

In an ideal world, and yes, this is wishful thinking Saudi/Qatar funding for a package of 36 F-15EX Eagle and 72 F-16 Block 72s would significantly strengthen our airpower for any future “Operation SSA” (“Save Saudi Ass” ) and we can justify it as necessary for interoperability with Saudi & Qatari AFs .

 

[Oscar]

I agree with your views.
The issue for the Su-30MKI fleet is that, despite its strengths in kinematics and payload, it is increasingly operating against an environment dominated by sensor fusion, network-centric warfare, and long-range AESA-supported BVR combat.

From a PAF perspective, if Pakistan adds another two squadrons of J-10Cs along with around 50 JF-17 B3, it could maintain a much superior counter-air capability even as India inducts additional Dassault Rafale squadrons toward 2030.

The introduction of the J-35 would obviously shift the balance more decisively, but even without it, the PAF will still retain a competitive edge in the air-superiority role through better BVR integration and force concentration.

Where PAF still has a noticeable gap is in the interdiction and deep-strike mission capability, especially involving heavy ordnance delivery. That likely requires at least two additional J-10 squadrons armed with long-range ALBMs and Taimoor to fully replace the aging Mirage / ROSE fleet currently soldiering on with those duties.

In an ideal world, and yes, this is wishful thinking Saudi/Qatar funding for a package of 36 F-15EX Eagle and 72 F-16 Block 72s would significantly strengthen our airpower for any future “Operation SSA” (“Save Saudi Ass” ) and we can justify it as necessary for interoperability with Saudi & Qatari AFs .

They have all the infrastructure to upgrade and scale the MKi and their super MKI program(and subsequent evolutions) do offer them that but because it is also their backbone they haven’t figured out a proper scaled upgrade across the fleet primarily due to the franken nature of their batches especially those early ones from HAL.

Unlike the Mirages which were done by OEM and which were already at a known baseline - there are MKis out there with various levels of existing and replaced components and spread upgrades that all need more “custom” kits to bring them to standard compared to say the Jaguars…

اور ادھر بھی چوّل ماری ہے

 

[Taimoor]

So if they get a whiff that PAF has PL17s, they would stay 300-400 km away, which in fact works in PAF and Pakistan's favor, because now all of a sudden, a lot of their Air launched munitions are useless since they don't have the 400km-500km range to strike inside Pakistan. They will be left using the longer range ALBM or ALCMs if any, which means Pakistan gets a longer time to track and react to them.

IAF is in a quagmire. They know that the best A2A missile money can buy from their western sources, their only sources, the meteor, failed in last conflict. They have the money, but what can they buy with it? Aim260? That is not ready for USAF let alone any foreign AF, provided yanks give approval for mating with Rafales, then what will be the timeline and wait? Aim174b ? Thats a stop gap measure till aim260 is developed and integrated and exclusively used for career based operation on F18s. Fat chance IAF ever getting close to them.

IAF will rely heavily on S400 protection and lob Israeli ALBMs at us while remaining within protection envelop. Our top priority in next conflict should be to take out S400 protection as the first blood.

 

[Paraboi]

IAF is in a quagmire. They know that the best A2A missile money can buy from their western sources, their only sources, the meteor, failed in last conflict. They have the money, but what can they buy with it? Aim260? That is not ready for USAF let alone any foreign AF, provided yanks give approval for mating with Rafales, then what will be the timeline and wait? Aim174b ? Thats a stop gap measure till aim260 is developed and integrated and exclusively used for career based operation on F18s. Fat chance IAF ever getting close to them.

IAF will rely heavily on S400 protection and lob Israeli ALBMs at us while remaining within protection envelop. Our top priority in next conflict should be to take out S400 protection as the first blood.

Yiha drone ha na wo pipe wala phenko daba k saturation k lia

 

[Taimoor]

Yiha drone ha na wo pipe wala phenko daba k saturation k lia

taddi dal hamla. One serious note, do those have enough range to reach S400 deployment area?

 

[iron shrapnel]

taddi dal hamla. One serious note, do those have enough range to reach S400 deployment area?

A retired PAF official claimed that we had a drone lock on to an A50 Awacs on the ground... It travelled so far in side India that it was possible to destroy it on ground... So S400 would have been in range as well....

 

[Paraboi]

taddi dal hamla. One serious note, do those have enough range to reach S400 deployment area?

Yep they do

 

[Xestan]

A retired PAF official claimed that we had a drone lock on to an A50 Awacs on the ground... It travelled so far in side India that it was possible to destroy it on ground... So S400 would have been in range as well....

He has habit of exaggerating things. I remember him claiming that Pakistan used more ordnance in May-25 than we did in 1965 war.

 

[Oscar]

He has habit of exaggerating things. I remember him claiming that Pakistan used more ordnance in May-25 than we did in 1965 war.

Technically - that is possible
Because a B-57 carried 7000lbs a JF-17 can do 8000lbs

A WW2 B-17 carried 5000lbs of bombs - a F-15E can do 20000lbs+ and unlike the B-17 those are very accurate bombs.

So it likely plausible that even with lesser sorties the PAF delivered greater tonnage.

 

[maxpane]

Technically - that is possible
Because a B-57 carried 7000lbs a JF-17 can do 8000lbs

A WW2 B-17 carried 5000lbs of bombs - a F-15E can do 20000lbs+ and unlike the B-17 those are very accurate bombs.

So it likely plausible that even with lesser sorties the PAF delivered greater tonnage.

sir is it true that paf was targeting their awacs while on its runway but due to escalation they let it go