Pakistan First
Registered Member
You either don't know the basic definition of war and how to determine the victor Or just don't want to accept the reality.
To understand who won the war, first thing is to understand the objectives of aggressor.
Now the clear objectives of war are:
1 Regime Change (That's why going after leadership tiers, going after baseej and internal security forces, police etc, and Trump's several tweets / messages)
2 Destroying Iran's offensive capabilities (Ballistic missile & Drones)
What was NOT the objective of war:
- Nuclear program was never an objective of this war due to following reasons:
a) Iran had no active nuclear weapon program, they had nuclear program for civil purposes. There was a fatwa ( a religious / moral binding on the nation) by last supreme leader to not pursue nuclear weapons. It cannot get higher than this. The highest authority of the country had passed the highest order to not build nuclear weapons.
b) US destroyed Iran's nuclear facilities last year and Trump claimed 100s of times last year that they wiped out Iran's nuclear program.
c) Last year, Nethanyahu publicly said multiple times that nuclear threat is gone but Ballistic missile threat needs to be gone too. Israel was really furious last year when it saw Iranian missiles falling at Telaviv.
Because of these reasons, this war had no nuclear program on the menu but the Ballistic missile & drone program only.
Now, to determine if an aggressor has won the war, we have to see if aggressor has fulfill its objectives of war OR subdued the enemy / enemy surrendered, OR regime has collpased. Nothing of such thing happened. The primary objectives failed spectacularly. Regime is still intact, more strict / anti-west and young Khamenie has taken place of older one, IRGC still has full grip and we know that till the last day of action (before ceasefire / 38th day of war) Iran was still firing BMs all over the place. So obviously Iran's offensive capability is still intact. For defender to win a war, is just to survive and keep fighting back without losing any territory. Iran not only did that but it also destroyed all US bases in the region (a massive strategic loss of US at epic proportions. The bases serves as Hegemonic control over the region and now the pillar of that control is decimated ) and on top Iran closed the strait of fucking hormuz ( a 20% world's oil supply line). If US really had won and overpowered Iran then why US even needs to talk with Iran ? Then why they need Iranian permission to even pass from god damn strait. You LOST this war by every definition of geopolitics. If you don't agree that you lost then you might have lost your senses already.
Wars are never won by dropping more bombs. US killed probably millions in Vietnam and dropped several mega tons of payloads but still lost that war because it failed to establish its writ and failed to achieve its political objectives. Its even more clearer here in Iran war. If you still don't understand then I give you another clue, US - Iran are in negotiations. US had a lot more comfortable position in getting lot of terms accepted BEFORE the war when Oman was mediating. Omani FM even said that Iran had already agreed on lot of items including diluting HEU. Why is that after using US hard power and technological prowess for 38 days that Iran is now coming stronger at negotiating table and demanding a lot of stuff. Before war, US was asking Iran to cap or abandon its missile program, now US is even not daring to ask such stupid terms. US asking to open strait which was open already before the war, US is begging for HEU which Iran already had agreed before the war to dilute without a shots fired, In return Iran is asking for sanctions to be lifted, assets to be unfrozen, etc. stuff which Iran was in no position to ask before the war. War gave USA nothing except humiliation and strategic defeat, losing bases in the most important region. Now keeping US forces in a host country puts a target on the back of that country. Iran war has taught the world that US forces cannot protect your country but gives the reasons/excuse to attack the country. Attacking US bases has become a new normal. The strategic implications on US from the loss of this war are enormous if you think impartially and without any bias.
P.S and btw, fighting Iran with one hand tied behind back comment, LOL! Entire world knows, US is not doing out of courtesy lol, US is only nation on earth which has actually used nukes over totally civilian population centers and its the nation which arms an extremist state of Israel at the time when it was carrying out a genocide. You have some limitations in this war, because you had no other easy option. Not because you are nice. Also remember 2 countries US and Israel together fought against one alone and attacked it in middle of negotiations. That's some level of cowardice and yet you have audacity to pass silly comments.
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