Pakistan's Airborne Early Warning and Control Aircrafts

[Yasser76]

The PAF will use its own in-house TDL to connect its fighter assets, including the J-31. In fact, Pakistan's TDL stack is good and scalable, with in-house TDLs driving both air force and naval needs via Link-17 and Link Green, respectively.


Sweden wasn't in NATO when the Erieye was first developed, hence requiring Saab to design the Erieye to support proprietary TDLs from the onset. In other words, there's no restriction on whether the Erieye can support Link-17, Link-16, etc. Rather, the Erieye was specifically designed to support as many TDLs as possible from the onset.

For the Erieye to support multiple TDLs, the PAF needed to configure it with a system that can receive and process information from different TDLs -- Multi Data-Link Processor or M-DLP, like the Leonardo M-DLP or MilSoft M-DLP.

When the PAF inducted ZDK03, I suspect this system wasn't yet added to the Erieye, and the PAF couldn't get to it when it lost several units to the terrorist attack. So, that project got delayed until the new and rebuilt Erieyes came online.

This explains a lot. Thanks. Still I guess there is the issue of F-16 not having Link 17. F-16s still very much part of our cutting edge, albeit less and less so

 

[Fatman17]

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300m$ down the drain

 

[Oscar]

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300m$ down the drain

ChatGPT and random image additions zindabad.

But the reasons go beyond AESA to user experience and pretty much poorly prototyped system.

Thank you Mushy

 

[Jango]

The article confirms 9 Erieyes in service, this is in addition to our 5 standard SAAB 2000s for transport.

We have 5 for transport now? Dayum.

This enables us to save airframe life on the Erieyes by using the standard SAAB 2000s for pilot training.

I have not seen the numbers, neither have I gone through any figures yet, but you would hazard a guess that with a commercial platform like the Saab 2000, the airframe life would be the least concern, especially since on an AWACS platform the EW suite is the more sensitive technology (Or is it not?).

Actually just found this, a Saab 2000 airworthiness limitation manual.

The Design Service Goal (DSG) concerns the durability of all aircraft systems including the structure and is an estimation of the life of the aircraft, after which it may not be physically or economically feasible to repair or overhaul the different aircraft systems and its components, to maintain the continuing airworthiness. Initially, the SAAB 2000 in Airliner configuration has a Design Service Goal of 75000 FL or 60000 FH, whichever occurs first.

https://downloads.regulations.gov/FAA-2021-0841-0004/attachment_1.pdf

Would be interesting to see how many hours the PAF puts in, would be less than the cycles and hours you get in commercial aviation probably?

 

[Yasser76]

According to this article we are looking to order more Erieye in addition to the 9 in service.

Saab Delivers Last Saab 2000 Erieye AEW&C Aircraft to Pakistan

The Swedish company Saab has handed over the last of the ordered Saab 2000 Erieye airborne early warning and control aircraft to Pakistan

mil.in.ua

 

[Areesh]

According to this article we are looking to order more Erieye in addition to the 9 in service.

Saab Delivers Last Saab 2000 Erieye AEW&C Aircraft to Pakistan

The Swedish company Saab has handed over the last of the ordered Saab 2000 Erieye airborne early warning and control aircraft to Pakistan

mil.in.ua

I have heard that this is some ER version different from the earlier versions

Is this true?

 

[Yasser76]

I have heard that this is some ER version different from the earlier versions

Is this true?

Would make sense, do not think SAAB making the older version anymore

 

[Quwa]

I have heard that this is some ER version different from the earlier versions

Is this true?

Would make sense, do not think SAAB making the older version anymore

This is still the non-ER version. I wouldn't say "older" per se because the Erieye AEW&C the PAF is getting does have some updates, but it isn't an ER.

That said, I do think the PAF will eventually acquire a few Erieye-ERs, but as the full GlobalEye package.

IMO, the PAF is raising dedicated offensive wings with the J-31 and a UCAV (Bayraktar Kizilelma?) at the center.

If they want to give the connected units radar coverage while safely being within Pakistan, they'd need the Erieye-ER's range.

So, we could see the PAF aim for 3 GlobalEye AEW&C and 3 HAVASOJ for 2 offensive wings and 1 dedicated maritime ops wing (each with 1-2 J-31 squadrons).

 

[Falcon26]

This is still the non-ER version. I wouldn't say "older" per se because the Erieye AEW&C the PAF is getting does have some updates, but it isn't an ER.

That said, I do think the PAF will eventually acquire a few Erieye-ERs, but as the full GlobalEye package.

IMO, the PAF is raising dedicated offensive wings with the J-31 and a UCAV (Bayraktar Kizilelma?) at the center.

If they want to give the connected units radar coverage while safely being within Pakistan, they'd need the Erieye-ER's range.

So, we could see the PAF aim for 3 GlobalEye AEW&C and 3 HAVASOJ for 2 offensive wings and 1 dedicated maritime ops wing (each with 1-2 J-31 squadrons).

What updates are coming with the new erieyes?

 

[Quwa]

What updates are coming with the new erieyes?

Going by what the Brazilians did, I imagine improved C2 systems, new comms systems, better data processing, etc.

I wouldn't expect any major improvements at this stage, especially seeing how the new Erieyes cost around $55-70 m each. The Erieye-ER costs much more than that.

That said, the PAF isn't banking on the Erieyes for its future offensive ops. Ultimately, an AEW&C with a more powerful radar will be sought, either the Erieye-ER/GlobalEye or something from China or - if they really want to push it - original solution designed in-house, but with inputs from Turkiye, Germany, etc.

 

[Yasser76]

Going by what the Brazilians did, I imagine improved C2 systems, new comms systems, better data processing, etc.

I wouldn't expect any major improvements at this stage, especially seeing how the new Erieyes cost around $55-70 m each. The Erieye-ER costs much more than that.

That said, the PAF isn't banking on the Erieyes for its future offensive ops. Ultimately, an AEW&C with a more powerful radar will be sought, either the Erieye-ER/GlobalEye or something from China or - if they really want to push it - original solution designed in-house, but with inputs from Turkiye, Germany, etc.

If cutting edge of PAF will be Chinese should we not invest in entire Chinese ecosystem here?
Unsure if more Erieye (even ER version) is the way forward , but then we are retiring ZDKs as well so seems China is yet to master AEW!?

 

[Oscar]

If cutting edge of PAF will be Chinese should we not invest in entire Chinese ecosystem here?
Unsure if more Erieye (even ER version) is the way forward , but then we are retiring ZDKs as well so seems China is yet to master AEW!?

So long as they can communicate there is no need to be locked into a system country.

Erieye has enough potential and suitable for the next 20 years - but no offboard guidance.

The SAAB-2000 platform might continue or the PAF may look at what the Navy is doing


ZDK was Pakistani fault technically(or Musharraf rather) who pushed for a barely proven prototype system at the behest of Chinese and landed PAF a half baked partly working system on a less than user friendly airframe.

 

[TOPGUN]

So long as they can communicate there is no need to be locked into a system country.

Erieye has enough potential and suitable for the next 20 years - but no offboard guidance.

The SAAB-2000 platform might continue or the PAF may look at what the Navy is doing


ZDK was Pakistani fault technically(or Musharraf rather) who pushed for a barely proven prototype system at the behest of Chinese and landed PAF a half baked partly working system on a less than user friendly airframe.

What will happen to these 4 birds since they are retd from service or will be for what they were built for?

 

[Oscar]

What will happen to these 4 birds since they are retd from service or will be for what they were built for?

Cant say - my guess is like the Lynx they either go into storage or if there is enough airframe life left in them might try to get manufacturer to buy at back dirt cheap to use for another conversion

Even the Y-9 as a platform is not liked by its pilots. And because its this full modified aircraft there seems no potential to demilitarize it and sell it off. Would be funny to see the PAF use it as a VIP transport

 

[Yasser76]

Cant say - my guess is like the Lynx they either go into storage or if there is enough airframe life left in them might try to get manufacturer to buy at back dirt cheap to use for another conversion

Even the Y-9 as a platform is not liked by its pilots. And because its this full modified aircraft there seems no potential to demilitarize it and sell it off. Would be funny to see the PAF use it as a VIP transport

Such a waste of time and resources. Best bet would be useful as a diplomatic gesture to gift to BD?