JF-17 PFX program

[Hmmmm]

That is what I am saying. Basically, something like KF-21 but a single engine one. The current KF-21 which for now doesn't have internal weapons bay it would be something like that. Money will come from Arab countries and Technological help will come from Turkey.

Why would money come from Arab countries? Why would they have a need for a light semi stealth jet?
If tech has to come from Turkiye then wouldn't the Arabs directly invest in Turkish projects like stealthy UCAVs instead of going for a light semi stealth manned fighter?

 

[Michael]

Isn't Hongdu working on something like that based on the JL-10? At least according to the patents they filed.

A more 'stealthy' 2-seat advanced trainer/light fighter, it's still 2 engines though.


View attachment 84071
View attachment 84072

View attachment 84073

The latest news is that AVIC is speeding up the construction of Guizhou's aviation industry. This “JL-10 stealth version” you mentioned should start soon. This will be China's third stealth fighter.

@FuturePAF Unfortunately, the “JF-17 BX program” I proposed has no hope of being sold to China.

 

[Deino]

The latest news is that AVIC is speeding up the construction of Guizhou's aviation industry. This “JL-10 stealth version” you mentioned should start soon. This will be China's third stealth fighter.

@FuturePAF Unfortunately, the “JF-17 BX program” I proposed has no hope of being sold to China.

Wait ... that makes no sense at all!

what has Guizhou to do with an alleged "JL-10 stealth version” since the JL-10 is built at Hongdu!??

And who mentioned ever "China's third stealth fighter"?

 

[Michael]

Wait ... that makes no sense at all!

what has Guizhou to do with an alleged "JL-10 stealth version” since the JL-10 is built at Hongdu!??

And who mentioned ever "China's third stealth fighter"?

You can check this information. Of course, this is speculation on my part.

Post in thread 'JF-17 PFX program'

Nov 24, 2024

An advanced two-seat light fighter is the current gap in the international market. China's current most advanced trainer is the JL-10. but its development has been slow due to Guiyang's strength.

Isn't Hongdu working on something like that based on the JL-10? At least according to the patents they filed.

A more 'stealthy' 2-seat advanced trainer/light fighter, it's still 2 engines though.

• Neocloud

• 

 

[Deino]

You can check this information.

Post in thread 'JF-17 PFX program'

Nov 24, 2024

An advanced two-seat light fighter is the current gap in the international market. China's current most advanced trainer is the JL-10. but its development has been slow due to Guiyang's strength.

Isn't Hongdu working on something like that based on the JL-10? At least according to the patents they filed.

A more 'stealthy' 2-seat advanced trainer/light fighter, it's still 2 engines though.

• Neocloud

• 

I know this, but again if it is from Guizhou, then it is not a JL-10 and since it is clearly a twin-engined jet-trainer; I wouldn't call it a "stealth fighter"!

Or is the a confusion / mix-up between Hongdu and Guizhou?

Based on this, it is more a design like a mini- or bonsai-F/A-18F used as a trainer.

 

[Michael]

I know this, but again if it is from Guizhou, then it is not a JL-10 and since it is clearly a twin-engined jet-trainer; I wouldn't call it a "stealth fighter"!

Or is the a confusion / mix-up between Hongdu and Guizhou?

Based on this, it is more a design like a mini- or bonsai-F/A-18F used as a trainer.

These are some of my guesses and analysis, not entirely accurate.

1, Hongdu and Guizhou both make trainers. They both have a base of light fighter manufacturing. They are both among the lesser performing fighter producers.
2, Current media news. There is no expansion plan for the aviation industrial park in Nanchang. Guizhou's aviation industry industrial park is expanding.
3, Guizhou currently produces fighters that no longer have much of a market and are obsolete products ------ except for the UAVs they produce.

My speculation, merge the two companies into one large company similar to CAC/SAC. The main product direction is light fighters, trainers and large UAVs.

 

[Deino]

These are some of my guesses and analysis, not entirely accurate.

1, Hongdu and Guizhou both make trainers. They both have a base of light fighter manufacturing. They are both among the lesser performing fighter producers.
2, Current media news. There is no expansion plan for the aviation industrial park in Nanchang. Guizhou's aviation industry industrial park is expanding.
3, Guizhou currently produces fighters that no longer have much of a market and are obsolete products ------ except for the UAVs they produce.

My speculation, merge the two companies into one large company similar to CAC/SAC. The main product direction is light fighters, trainers and large UAVs.

Now I'm going a bit off-topic - sorry for this - but per my understanding, both Guizhou and Hongdu were already "merged" in some form but not both together but Guizhou with Chengdu (so the J-10 production was transferred as well as a lot of UAV/UCAV manufacturing and Hongdu with Shenyang. Here the reports however are not as concrete as with CAC/GAIC.

 

[Michael]

Now I'm going a bit off-topic - sorry for this - but per my understanding, both Guizhou and Hongdu were already "merged" in some form but not both together but Guizhou with Chengdu (so the J-10 production was transferred as well as a lot of UAV/UCAV manufacturing and Hongdu with Shenyang. Here the reports however are not as concrete as with CAC/GAIC.

Guizhou and Chengdu, there is no news of them merging.

I think the J-10C being given to Guizhou for manufacturing should be an act of support from AVIC. cac will focus on J-20 production and development work on the next generation fighters. transferring the production function of the J-10C to Guizhou will ensure that the Guizhou plant will not go out of business, and will allow cac to focus more on its current work.
The power gap between CAC and Guizhou is too big. Merging them now would seriously interfere with CAC's current work. This is not an ideal merger plan. A merger between Guizhou and Hongdu would make more sense.

 

[Deino]

Them maybe we shouldn't call it a merger, but from what I've heard, GAIC is now a 100% subsidiary of CAC.

 

[Yasser76]

PFX project feels like a solution searching for a problem.

JF-17 Block III is the perfect lightweight fighter. We got it cheap, sanctions proof, decent weapons fit a few export orders and it has basically almost entirely replaced the F-7

We know have J-10CE - Perfect medium fighter with AESA and PL-15

J-35 round the corner and potentially KAAN too

Even after F-7s and Mirages retire we have 75 odd F-16s that can act as second line of PAF


Struggling to find the niche PFX fits. There is literally no role it can do that any of the above mentioned fighters cannot and it will be more expensive then a JF-17 Block III.

 

[Cookie Monster]

This entire project annoys the shit out of me. Sure, it can lead to major tech development for future fighter development, but something about it feels completely off.

Depending on how it’s executed…it has the potential to turn into an even better success than what JF17 was.
By success I mean:
- Indigenous manufacturing(to an extent)
- Workhorse(potentially next gen)
- Make up numbers(the low in the high low mix)
- Replace older JF17s/F16s
- Potential export orders

 

[Michael]

Them maybe we shouldn't call it a merger, but from what I've heard, GAIC is now a 100% subsidiary of CAC.

You're right.
I made careful inquiries about the situation.
In November 2021, GAIC as a whole was transferred under the CAC umbrella and fully handed over to the CAC for management. The current business registration information shows that CAC is the 100% controlling shareholder of GAIC.

PFX project feels like a solution searching for a problem.

JF-17 Block III is the perfect lightweight fighter. We got it cheap, sanctions proof, decent weapons fit a few export orders and it has basically almost entirely replaced the F-7

We know have J-10CE - Perfect medium fighter with AESA and PL-15

J-35 round the corner and potentially KAAN too

Even after F-7s and Mirages retire we have 75 odd F-16s that can act as second line of PAF


Struggling to find the niche PFX fits. There is literally no role it can do that any of the above mentioned fighters cannot and it will be more expensive then a JF-17 Block III.

In fact, I have never been able to understand the purpose and significance of Pakistan's “PFX project”.

 

[Toxic]

You're right.
I made careful inquiries about the situation.
In November 2021, GAIC as a whole was transferred under the CAC umbrella and fully handed over to the CAC for management. The current business registration information shows that CAC is the 100% controlling shareholder of GAIC.


In fact, I have never been able to understand the purpose and significance of Pakistan's “PFX project”.

The PFX program is less about upgrading the JF-17 but more about indigenization of it, PAC wants to control everything except engine for the JF-17, it's ambitious but definitely doable.

 

[Piet]

If PAF sticks and continues with it and after listening to what that Air Force officer said in the interview I won't be surprised if it turns out something like this.
View attachment 83408

Whether its a concept or just inspiration driven - nice in any case

Piet

 

[Zarvan]

PFX project feels like a solution searching for a problem.

JF-17 Block III is the perfect lightweight fighter. We got it cheap, sanctions proof, decent weapons fit a few export orders and it has basically almost entirely replaced the F-7

We know have J-10CE - Perfect medium fighter with AESA and PL-15

J-35 round the corner and potentially KAAN too

Even after F-7s and Mirages retire we have 75 odd F-16s that can act as second line of PAF


Struggling to find the niche PFX fits. There is literally no role it can do that any of the above mentioned fighters cannot and it will be more expensive then a JF-17 Block III.

PFX is most likely will eventually become a Single Engine Stealth Fighter but initially it could be like current KF 21 without any internal weapons bay and in BLOCK II of PFX we may see that