Syrian Civil War and The future of Syria after liberation

[Bilal]

Now outsiders (non-Arabs)

Stop the racial angle all the time.

 

[_Arabia_]

Stop the racial angle all the time.

What racial angle are you talking about? Stop seeing ghosts when there are none here. Read the entire post, not just 1 sentence. Context matters.

Outsiders where telling Syrians to just forget about past events (crimes committed against them motivated by sect by their supposed brothers) which clearly makes a charade out of that notion. My example of their treatment in Lebanon by their brothers is another confirmation of that. It did not happen 10 years ago. It is happening RIGHT NOW.

It is easy to preach this positive message (which it is) when 1) you are not at the receiving end of such behavior and have not been that for 13 years, 2) the other party is not willing to change their behavior but their supporters preach the very same thing.

I think that all sane people can see that something here is not making sense.

The main and most important difference here (which is factual) is that in the Syrian theatre, extreme elements such as ISIS/AQ only have a fringe level of support (hence no minorities in Syria being targeted here almost 1 week after the fall of Al-Assad - despite the ongoing propaganda campaign that we have already seen in this very thread and online from the pro-Al-Assad faction) while on the other hand it is very different the other way around. Hence I am yet to encounter a single Hezbollah supporter who openly admits that it was wrong what they did and committed of crimes in Syria for the past 13 years. That this should not have been happening and that it was treason to the very same Syrian people that always stood with Lebanon when they fought against Israel.

This double standard should not continue if we aspire to move on and join ranks.

I am tired of regular Sunnis being called ISIS/AQ etc. by this group for standing up against their tyrants. I am tired of seeing accusations of sectarianism when they, the accusers, support the biggest sectarians and don't ever disown their extreme elements, rather the opposite.

They are the ones that helped turn a popular revolt into a sectarian war in the first place. They continue to do it to this day when nobody among the Sunnis is even remotely interest in it but rather interested in seeing Syria prosper, heal and develop.

Rather than silly "racism" accusations, look at combating posts aimed at anti-Assad posters where we are accused of being "terrorists" and various sectarian (ironically) slurs. Should not be that hard.

 

[Bilal]

What racial angle are you talking about? Stop seeing ghosts when there are none here. Read the entire post, not just 1 sentence. Context matters.

Outsiders where telling Syrians to just forget about past events (crimes committed against them motivated by sect by their supposed brothers) which clearly makes a charade out of that notion. My example of their treatment in Lebanon by their brothers is another confirmation of that. It did not happen 10 years ago. It is happening RIGHT NOW.

It is easy to preach this positive message (which it is) when 1) you are not at the receiving end of such behavior and have not been that for 13 years, 2) the other party is not willing to change their behavior but their supporters preach the very same thing.

I think that all sane people can see that something here is not making sense.

The main and most important difference here (which is factual) is that in the Syrian theatre, extreme elements such as ISIS/AQ only have a fringe level of support (hence no minorities in Syria being targeted here almost 1 week after the fall of Al-Assad - despite the ongoing propaganda campaign that we have already seen in this very thread and online from the pro-Al-Assad faction) while on the other hand it is very different the other way around. Hence I am yet to encounter a single Hezbollah supporter who openly admits that it was wrong what they did and committed of crimes in Syria for the past 13 years. That this should not have been happening and that it was treason to the very same Syrian people that always stood with Lebanon when they fought against Israel.

This double standard should not continue if we aspire to move on and join ranks.

I am tired of regular Sunnis being called ISIS/AQ etc. by this group for standing up against their tyrants. I am tired of seeing accusations of sectarianism when they, the accusers, support the biggest sectarians and don't ever disown their extreme elements, rather the opposite.

Yeah, all points are nice. But it has started to look like that relative or neighbor that shows up to own the day of your success and is suddenly the most concerned person ever.

It’s just becoming nauseating. So discuss the topic to the full and maybe tone down the owning part. Or is that too much to ask?

 

[_Arabia_]

Yeah, all points are nice. But it has started to look like that relative or neighbor that shows up to own the day your success.

It’s just becoming nauseating.

The main problem here is dishonesty. The party that screams sectarianism 24/7 was and is the most sectarian party in the first place and the party that helped turn a popular Syrian uprising into a sectarian war. Which was seemingly their goal. The same party (pro-Assad crowd) are attacking ordinary Syrians within Lebanon who just happen to celebrate the ouster of their oppressor. People who have never hurt Arab Shia Lebanese once in their life and people who gave their lives in the defense of Lebanon against Israel.

The very same regime (Al-Assad) was a sectarian project from the very beginning. How otherwise do you define a minority that makes up 5% of the population (Nusayris) controlling 75% of all top positions within Syria?

I have a problem with a regime that was sectarian to the core in its very existence and their supporters, accusing regular Syrians and anti-Al-Assad regime supporters for terrorists (as evidenced in this thread - not making this up several users can confirm), AQ, ISIS and other such nonsense (knowing very well that those fringe extremist elements are just that - fringe and not enjoying even remotely widespread support) when they never disown their sectarian elements (never seen it) and all while this happens, they have the shame and audacity to talk about unity? Really?

If Sunnis were as bad as portrayed by those confused and ignorant souls, there would not be any minorities to begin with. It is beyond ridiculous that this behavior is being tolerated and not stopped once and for all.

I have only seen them being interested in this very topic (sectarianism). While we talk about the future of Syria, how to make Syria prosper in the future, the challenges they face, they are busy (pro-Assad regime faction) calling all Syrians for AQ/ISIS, crying about Syrians dealing with their mass-murderers etc. As if it is not the prerogative of Syrians to deal with their oppressors after winning the war like it has been throughout all of recorded human history.

Meanwhile all churches, shrines etc. are still standing and nobody is hurting them or their communities, yet I and others here am supposed to accept their trolling and consent nonsense, name calling etc. just because their favorite dictator and the regime that it received help from (Iranian regime) lost the war? Don't start the conflict to begin with if you can't handle people rejoicing and supporting the Syrian people and their attempts of gaining freedom from said regime.

I ask, why are those people (we all know who they are here) allowed to call other users sectarian slurs, terrorists, but if we reply, we are the sectarian ones? How does this logic work again? I would really like to know what is going on?

Do people really think that any sane Muslim or person for that matter cares about sect to begin with? Do people think here that 99.99% of all Syrians care whatever sect you are as long as you behave like a normal person?

As I said, this conflict was made into a sectarian conflict by the very same sectarian regime that ruled the country. Now after 13 years of bloodshed and senseless division, they have created an unnecessary environment where some elements will seek revenge and maybe behave in a similar wrong way.

Syrians should not fall into this trap.

 

[Bilal]

The main problem here is dishonesty. The party that screams sectarianism 24/7 was and is the most sectarian party in the first place and the party that helped turn a popular Syrian uprising into a sectarian war. Which was seemingly their goal. The same party (pro-Assad crowd) are attacking ordinary Syrians within Lebanon who just happen to celebrate the ouster of their oppressor. People who have never hurt Arab Shia Lebanese once in their life and people who gave their lives in the defense of Lebanon against Israel.

The very same regime (Al-Assad) was a sectarian project from the very beginning. How otherwise do you define a minority that makes up 5% of the population (Nusayris) controlling 75% of all top positions within Syria?

I have a problem with a regime that was sectarian to the core in its very existence and their supporters, accusing regular Syrians and anti-Al-Assad regime supporters for terrorists (as evidenced in this thread - not making this up several users can confirm), AQ, ISIS and other such nonsense (knowing very well that those fringe extremist elements are just that - fringe and not enjoying even remotely widespread support) when they never disown their sectarian elements (never seen it) and all while this happens, they have the shame and audacity to talk about unity? Really?

If Sunnis were as bad as portrayed by those confused and ignorant souls, there would not be any minorities to begin with. It is beyond ridiculous that this behavior is being tolerated and not stopped once and for all.

I agree, as you may have seen my stance. There is no defence for the heinous crimes of Assad if everyone puts down their glasses of biases.

 

[Sinan]

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It is very sad to read this kind of Article for a guy like me, who never voted for Erdogan.
Gönül Tok is from the opposition circle (CHP mentality). She always talking like whatever does Erdogan is for domestic politics. Like Turkey have no foreign policy, no security doctrine, nothing. Their hatred for Erdogan (secular circle) blinds them. When you talk to them Erdogan done nothing good for Turkey 22 years.

Another, trait for them is their hatred for Middle East. They do not want to involve anything in Middle East.

Unfortunately, main opposition party's mentality is like this.

Some stuff main opposition party leader Özgür Özel said in the recent days.

- "We need to talk with Assad for the return of the refugees." ( He said this, on the day Assad was fleeing to Russia.
- On the day, PYD decided use free syrian new flag he said "PYD, uses Free Syrian flag now. Are you (Erdogan) still going to call them terrorists.
- Yesterday he said "Syria is not in a condition to send the refugees back"

Like, we are watching him like watching an insane person. They are really this much uninterested in Syria. Previous leader Kemal Kılıçdaroğlu was even worse than him.

Than Erdogan wins the election and everyone surprises.

 

[Tamerlane]

Another, trait for them is their hatred for Middle East. They do not want to involve anything in Middle East.

For most of my life it seemed like Turkey had abandoned Islam and become part of the secular West. People didn't even mention Turkey when issues relating to the Islamic world, or the Middle East were discussed. Then, since Erdogan has been in power, Turkey seems to be turning back to the Islamic world.

Those here who keep abusing Turkey don't seem to realize how fortunate Muslims are to have Turkey back. Of all Muslim countries Turkey has the best chance of becoming the leader, but only if it unites everyone rather than fall into nationalism or sectarian traps.

 

[SteppeWolff]

Those here who keep abusing Turkey don't seem to realize how fortunate Muslims are to have Turkey back.

all Muslim countries Turkey has the best chance of becoming the leader, but only if it unites everyone

No offence brother but this is corny ash.

 

[UKBengali]

No offence brother but this is corny ash.

It currently supplies 40% of the oil used to genocide the Gazans.

 

[_Arabia_]

No offence brother but this is corny ash.

No it is not. Turkey is the strongest Muslim country right now regardless of silly puppet accusations by the usual suspects. Yes, Turkey is a NATO member but so what? Has it attacked Muslims ever since WW2 ended? Has it created 100's of terrorist sectarian terrorist groups/militias/proxies/puppets who create havoc in various Muslim countries under the cover of fighting Israel and the US/West?

Also if you knew about history of empire building and Islamic history you would know that there were always a people who took the reigns at some point in history from the Rashidun, to Umayyad to Abbasid to Fatimid to Ottomans etc. Or in your region (South Asia) it was the Mughal Empire (most recently).

Or do you think that a sectarian Iranian regime who for 45 years have failed to unify even Shias, will take the lead?

Turkey is 1 billion times better for Muslims than the Iranian regime. You know what? Most Muslims probably agree with this.

I see a future of great Arab-Turkish cooperation even with secular/Kemalist Turkey but ironically I don't see any healthy cooperation and have never seen (for 45 years) with a supposed Islamic Republic next door (Iran).

Very funny if it was not tragicomical.

I won't explain why this is but I will just put it this way, neither Arabs or Turks, despite some past disagreements in history (throughout most of history we cooperated and had cordial ties), there is no obsession. I am talking about ordinary people, not regimes in power here.

 

[Umar]

Now outsiders (non-Arabs) will understand why Syrians have no love for Hezbollah and why cheap words of harmony and cooperation will just remain that as long as this is how they behave and have behaved in Syria since 2011.

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The message of that guy is wrong (as they would not be any better) but the point here remains the same.

Let us just speak frankly here. I am not aware of any Sunni Arabs whether in Syria or Lebanon killing or hurting Hezbollah or regular Lebanese Shia Arabs or invading their land or supporting their oppressors. Unfortunately this occurred the other way around in Syria for 13 years but somehow people expect Syrians to just accept such behavior and look the other way around? Which person with any degree of self-respect would accept such behavior from supposed brothers?

The difference here is that the vast majority of Syrian Sunnis don't support the fringe extreme groups but unfortunately the other way around, Hezbollah enjoys almost anonymous support among their community.

I hav enhver seen a single Lebanese Shia Arab say, we agree with Hezbollah in their fight against Israel but what we were doing in Syria was wrong. This is very insane when you think about it and speaks volume about the indoctrination. Yet, people have the audacity to call Syrians AQ/ISIS for toppling a bloodthirsty regime?

This also explains the poor treatment of Syrians in Lebanon in general.

Complete mess. Not sure what is wrong with that part of the Arab world.

Even when we had a war with the Houthis we never treated Northern Yemenis this way and hosted and continue to host millions of Yemenis.

I read 30 posts from you, nearly all of them are discussing nationalities, religion, ethnicity. We know Saudi Arabia is a state-sponsored racist country where even the Airpprt is different for Saudis and non-Saudis so it will be difficult to agree with you in each post

No it is not. Turkey is the strongest Muslim country right now regardless of silly puppet accusations by the usual suspects. Yes, Turkey is a NATO member but so what? Has it attacked Muslims ever since WW2 ended? Has it created 100's of terrorist sectarian terrorist groups/militias/proxies/puppets who create havoc in various Muslim countries under the cover of fighting Israel and the US/West?

Also if you knew about history of empire building and Islamic history you would know that there were always a people who took the reigns at some point in history from the Rashidun, to Umayyad to Abbasid to Fatimid to Ottomans etc. Or in your region (South Asia) it was the Mughal Empire (most recently).

Or do you think that a sectarian Iranian regime who for 45 years have failed to unify even Shias, will take the lead?

Turkey is 1 billion times better for Muslims than the Iranian regime. You know what? Most Muslims probably agree with this.

I see a future of great Arab-Turkish cooperation even with secular/Kemalist Turkey but ironically I don't see any healthy cooperation and have never seen (for 45 years) with a supposed Islamic Republic next door (Iran).

Very funny if it was not tragicomical.

I won't explain why this is but I will just put it this way, neither Arabs or Turks, despite some past disagreements in history (throughout most of history we cooperated and had cordial ties), there is no obsession. I am talking about ordinary people, not regimes in power here.

This is very good post

 

[Anatolia]

For most of my life it seemed like Turkey had abandoned Islam and become part of the secular West. People didn't even mention Turkey when issues relating to the Islamic world, or the Middle East were discussed. Then, since Erdogan has been in power, Turkey seems to be turning back to the Islamic world.

Those here who keep abusing Turkey don't seem to realize how fortunate Muslims are to have Turkey back. Of all Muslim countries Turkey has the best chance of becoming the leader, but only if it unites everyone rather than fall into nationalism or sectarian traps.

This is never happening. There's no chance Turkiye/Turks is going to lead Arabs/Iran/Pakistan and vice versa and thats without even bringing up the sectarian divide that exist. The days of leader or whole Muslim world is gone.

 

[SteppeWolff]

No it is not. Turkey is the strongest Muslim country right now regardless of silly puppet accusations by the usual suspects. Yes, Turkey is a NATO member but so what? Has it attacked Muslims ever since WW2 ended? Has it created 100's of terrorist sectarian terrorist groups/militias/proxies/puppets who create havoc in various Muslim countries under the cover of fighting Israel and the US/West?

Also if you knew about history of empire building and Islamic history you would know that there were always a people who took the reigns at some point in history from the Rashidun, to Umayyad to Abbasid to Fatimid to Ottomans etc. Or in your region (South Asia) it was the Mughal Empire (most recently).

Or do you think that a sectarian Iranian regime who for 45 years have failed to unify even Shias, will take the lead?

Turkey is 1 billion times better for Muslims than the Iranian regime. You know what? Most Muslims probably agree with this.

I see a future of great Arab-Turkish cooperation even with secular/Kemalist Turkey but ironically I don't see any healthy cooperation and have never seen (for 45 years) with a supposed Islamic Republic next door (Iran).

Very funny if it was not tragicomical.

He was being corny but this is Straight up cringe.

Turkey is part of NATO, an alliance that has killed countless Muslims. Turkey is a state that has billions of dollars of worth of trade with Israel. Turks have a fetish of being westerners ( EU-Membership ) sometimes or sometimes claiming Turan despite being Greek Anatolians.

Aint no one simping for Turks apart from those high on Turkish fairytales.

 

[_Arabia_]

He was being corny but this is Straight up cringe.

Turkey is part of NATO, an alliance that has killed countless Muslims. Turkey is a state that has billions of dollars of worth of trade with Israel. Turks have a fetish of being westerners ( EU-Membership ) sometimes or sometimes claiming Turan despite being Greek Anatolians.

Aint no one simping for Turks apart from those high on Turkish fairytales.

Let me get this straight. I see 100 times more simping for Iran (lol) of all countries on this forum that is much weaker country than Turkey and which has caused 1 million times more harm to the Muslim world and Muslims. And they are a supposed Islamic Republic, make empty speeches for 45 years against USA and Israel (yet nothing to date other than useless firecrackers that did not even kill 1 single Israeli and which they had to inform the US of prior to, LOL) yet we have hordes of users here who are 1000 times bigger fanboys of that regime than there are fans of Turkey, KSA or any other Muslim nation.

What is your problem with Turks again? Did you not claim that you were Turkic?

Turks are of many varied origins, Turkic, Kurdish, Arab, Circassian, Bosnian, Albanian, Greek (small minority), Assyrian and probably others that I forgot. This is irrelevant to the points that I made.

NATO members yes, but I don't recall Turks invading Muslims, creating 100's of terrorist proxies under false slogans etc. as certain others. Or supporting dictators that mass-murder Muslims (Al-Assad regime) like certain others.

Name me 1 Muslim country that does not trade or cooperate with the West or tries to?

Let me ask you this. Would you be as pro-Iranian as you are if the Shah was still around?

Can you explain to me what the Iranian regime has done for Muslims or for Pakistan for that matter? I am curious from where this blind worship originates from.

Is it because you are a Shia and you think/believe (falsely) that Iran represent Shia Islam or that they have a patent on it?

 

[mulj]

This is never happening. There's no chance Turkiye/Turks is going to lead Arabs/Iran/Pakistan and vice versa and thats without even bringing up the sectarian divide that exist. The days of leader or whole Muslim world is gone.

Leadership comes in many ways, history burden and fear of rule is anachronic approach, leading in cooperation would be enough as you have plenty to offer.