PAF SAM based Air Defense System - News, Discussion & Updates

Ali_Baba said:
That would be a fundamentally and completely wrong approach - completely wrong. Chances of the use of Ballistic missiles by Pakistan are tiny, and nuclear weapons even less.


Pakistan has "more" than sufficient level of nuclear deterrence as of now. Adding more is pointless waste of time, and money.

HQ-11/LD-3000 and HQ-19 along with J10CE, JF17C and J-35As are the way to go..
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Hi,

Once air superiority had been managed---the rest is SEAd & DEAD mission---to which Paf had the opportunity and they should have contd. for at least 24 to maybe 36 hours---.

The S400 were taken out---that was the time to have continued & destroyed all the enemy anti air defenses and surface to surface missile sites---.

With most of the SA missile destroyed---the enemy would have gone into confusion as what to get---they would go out on a desperate shopping spree.

The SELLEING NATION would be thinking---do I want to sell my product to this nation and see failure of my equipment---.

Never in the known history of mankind---a weapons selling nation has faced this dilemma---. Should I sell it---should I not---what about my reputation if their enemy destroys it again---.

Pakistan needs to propagate this mantra--- sell to india---destroy your reputation and future sales---.
 
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Ali_Baba said:
That would be a fundamentally and completely wrong approach - completely wrong. Chances of the use of Ballistic missiles by Pakistan are tiny, and nuclear weapons even less.


Pakistan has "more" than sufficient level of nuclear deterrence as of now. Adding more is pointless waste of time, and money.

HQ-11/LD-3000 and HQ-19 along with J10CE, JF17C and J-35As are the way to go..
Click to expand...
HQ16FE,HQBE ,FD2000 missiles are like long shot snipers against AWACS & Fighters but ineffective against low flying cruise missiles like scalp & brahmos

PAF needs highly maneuverable & high tech seeker based yet work horse type medium & Short range defence system.
 
MS Sandhu said:
HQ16FE,HQBE ,FD2000 missiles are like long shot snipers against AWACS & Fighters but ineffective against low flying cruise missiles like scalp & brahmos

PAF needs highly maneuverable & high tech seeker based yet work horse type medium & Short range defence system.
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we discuss this further on the @Quwa podcast which should drop soon. Keep an eye out!

but effectively, the best antidotes for BrahMos are1748712609172.png1748712636683.png
 
MS Sandhu said:
HQ16FE,HQBE ,FD2000 missiles are like long shot snipers against AWACS & Fighters but ineffective against low flying cruise missiles like scalp & brahmos

PAF needs highly maneuverable & high tech seeker based yet work horse type medium & Short range defence system.
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Any potent system that china and turkey offers us for this case?
 
Quwa said:
Will keep you all posted. Just some finishing touches.
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I hope there is also a discussion on the value of Soft kill techniques in taking out the Brahmos.

From taking out low level drones all the way up to Brahmos. We will need layers of missile defense but also ew defenses. China is at the cutting edge of this tech, especially AI enabled and Cyper-protected. Whatever products are out in the west, I’m sure China can make something similar or better and at a price point Pakistan can work with.

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FuturePAF said:
I hope there is also a discussion on the value of Soft kill techniques in taking out the Brahmos.

From taking out low level drones all the way up to Brahmos. We will need layers of missile defense but also ew defenses. China is at the cutting edge of this tech, especially AI enabled and Cyper-protected. Whatever products are out in the west, I’m sure China can make something similar or better and at a price point Pakistan can work with.

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@JamD
 
Quwa said:
@JamD
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Couple of points:
1. You need Intel on the seeker and software to be able to design EW based counter measures. In this regard seekers of models landed during this conflict may be useful. But keep in mind these were old models and stocks.
2. We hear about espionage about Brahmos all the time, which makes me think that we are actively working on ECM targeted at Brahmos. This may be the reason for the ones we soft killed this month.
 
JamD said:
Couple of points:
1. You need Intel on the seeker and software to be able to design EW based counter measures. In this regard seekers of models landed during this conflict may be useful. But keep in mind these were old models and stocks.
2. We hear about espionage about Brahmos all the time, which makes me think that we are actively working on ECM targeted at Brahmos. This may be the reason for the ones we soft killed this month.
Click to expand...
FuturePAF said:
I hope there is also a discussion on the value of Soft kill techniques in taking out the Brahmos.

From taking out low level drones all the way up to Brahmos. We will need layers of missile defense but also ew defenses. China is at the cutting edge of this tech, especially AI enabled and Cyper-protected. Whatever products are out in the west, I’m sure China can make something similar or better and at a price point Pakistan can work with.

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But you're limited in what you can actually do softkill wise.

attacks against the seeker in terminal stage- okay yes, but this applies in real limited scenarios (attacking a moving target)- plus, brahmos now has an aesa seeker, making the task far harder.

Land attack BrahMos use a RLG based INS+GPS, so against static targets, in GPS denied and also onboard seeker denied scenario- the reality is a successful kill will still occur, just with degraded accuracy.

BrahMos is probably better to be defeated via hardkill sys like CAMM. I dont think softkill measures will be of much use, except for perhaps to the PN.
 
MS Sandhu said:
HQ16FE,HQBE ,FD2000 missiles are like long shot snipers against AWACS & Fighters but ineffective against low flying cruise missiles like scalp & brahmos
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Tell that to the PLAN and PLAAF. Their entire modern destroyer fleet is built around HQ-9 and PLAAF uses HQ-9 for airbase defense. And what makes you think Long range missiles can't be effective at shorter ranges?
 
arslank01 said:
But you're limited in what you can actually do softkill wise.

attacks against the seeker in terminal stage- okay yes, but this applies in real limited scenarios (attacking a moving target)- plus, brahmos now has an aesa seeker, making the task far harder.

Land attack BrahMos use a RLG based INS+GPS, so against static targets, in GPS denied and also onboard seeker denied scenario- the reality is a successful kill will still occur, just with degraded accuracy.

BrahMos is probably better to be defeated via hardkill sys like CAMM. I dont think softkill measures will be of much use, except for perhaps to the PN.
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CAMM is really good and almost a perfect gap filler but “may” bring issues of integrating in the overall IAD and cost maybe an issue too.

What is your opinion of HQ11/FM3000?
 
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