PA MLRS, Self Propelled and towed artillery [BM-11, Fatah-I GMLRS, Fatah-II] - News, Updates & Discussions

[falcon34]

He didn't said other than Babur CM.
Anyway,he may be talking about F2 G-MLRS
Acc to EDR Defence, a batch of F2 GMLRS was ready to be delivered to PA.
F2 GMLRS is lot more capable system than F1 and comes with very efficient aerodynamic design + bigger & powerful dual thrust rocket motor..similar to CM400.
I think PAF should ask for Air launched version of F2 instead of going for more CM400s.
Similar to Navy's approach
Their SMASH is exactly F2.

Dude see the quoted I mentioned Chennai, Mumbai, gao, Kolkata and Bangalore.
Fatah 2 is an short range asset as much as I understand

 

[Rational Philosopher]

@Panzerkiel always does that. Sir if its possible give us a few details about those long range vectors, BMs, CMs or HGVs, DGISPR did said we are in the possession of some niche technologies, a little explanation on this wouldn't give out any confidentiality.

My guess is he just talking about a ~900-1000KM Babur cruise missile (subsonic) as well as perhaps Fatah-4 which may be ready but unrevealed said to be 700KM tactical ballistic missile.

Beyond this, I doubt anything else is operational and maybe in planning stage or development.

 

[Panzerkiel]

@Panzerkiel always does that. Sir if its possible give us a few details about those long range vectors, BMs, CMs or HGVs, DGISPR did said we are in the possession of some niche technologies, a little explanation on this wouldn't give out any confidentiality.

Not here in the open. Somewhere close, isolated, off the grid....

 

[Bentley777]

Not here in the open. Somewhere close, isolated, off the grid....

As it should be .

 

[Waz]

Brothers can we please relax with the multiple questions at @Panzerkiel.
He's got a lot to do and can only answer one thing at a time, when he gets time.
Please be considerate.

 

[falcon34]

My guess is he just talking about a ~900-1000KM Babur cruise missile (subsonic) as well as perhaps Fatah-4 which may be ready but unrevealed said to be 700KM tactical ballistic missile.

Beyond this, I doubt anything else is operational and maybe in planning stage or development.

I said other than Babur and he reacted to it.
That's why.

 

[hasn2009]

Absolutely. There are videos from locals on the ground. Same was the source of their aircraft losses, which is now being confirmed.

Plus, listen to their own official brief which clearly admits to damage to equipment and personnel at Bhuj, adampur, udhumpur and pathankot.

These are MRLS that can be launched in hundreds, what was launched was in dozens.

How cheap are these F series MLRS as compared to our ballistic and cruise missiles and how long does it take to produce one?

 

[falcon34]

How cheap are these F series MLRS as compared to our ballistic and cruise missiles and how long does it take to produce one?

We didn't had the will to fire those missiles, production wise existing weapons systems can produced at mass, everything and as pointed out by @Panzerkiel PA and PAF both have long sticks.
I don't think so production is the issue let's wait for Round 3.

 

[hasn2009]

Maybe a threat to these targets, and some more of different types, with longer range missiles is what stopped them dead in their tracks.....and i am not talking about the PAF yet.

Do you know how far were we from using nukes in this conflict?
And how much depth Pakistan has with regards to ammo/supplies/money if another such misadventure comes from hindutva?

 

[hasn2009]

We didn't had the will to fire those missiles, production wise existing weapons systems can produced at mass, everything and as pointed out by @Panzerkiel PA and PAF both have long sticks.
I don't think so production is the issue let's wait for Round 3.

I think lot has changed in the last round, next round will be much different, India will have learned a lot and they will no more have any hesitation in striking military targets, and i think Pakistani nuclear response will come quicker than anticipated.

 

[Bilal]

How cheap are these F series MLRS as compared to our ballistic and cruise missiles and how long does it take to produce one?

Should be by an order of magnitude at least. Typical American cruise missiles cost around $2-3M, let’s take the same assumption for mrbm.

While a HIMARS costs ~200k. So going by the same thump rule. Our costs for F1 should be around 1/10th of a full blown cruise and ballistic missile.

 

[hydrabadi_arab]

I think lot has changed in the last round, next round will be much different, India will have learned a lot and they will no more have any hesitation in striking military targets, and i think Pakistani nuclear response will come quicker than anticipated.

Pakistan will respond with conventional cruise missiles by hitting deep inside India. I don't see possibility of nuclear war.

Pakistan didn't use cruise missile this time because of PAF beating daylight out of IAF. And the infamous restraint.

1. PAF shot down 6-0. Likely killing few pilots. Rafale pilot Shivangi is nowhere to be seen. IAF was grounded for 2 days after that.

2. PAF toke out S400 radar with Mach 4-5 CM400 missile. PAF then crossed in LOC and came back after bombing them.

Next time Pakistan will fire cruise missiles.

 

[hussain0216]

Some of you are acting a bit irrational

We had what was it 4-5 days of actual conflict?


Pakistan followed a simple escalatory plan, and in this plan they started hitting Indian posts and bases that were most likely to be used in a attack against Pakistan or as a staging post

They used the F1 and possibly F2 as the most appropriate tool for this
Why use a babur or raad or SRBM for something within reach of the F1 or F2s

The CM400 for example was the correct tool to target the S400


If the conflict went on for weeks or months and Pakistan didn't use our strategic missiles or CMs then some of you would have had a point

But for a few days conflict, everything was reasonable
My biggest contention like some of you is that we should have been vicious and ruthless against a enemy like the hindutva, murderous even for their stupidity
But we still operate in this old school gentlemen warrior kind of bullshit and it's unacceptable


The scalp or storm shadow isn't supersonic, even the U.S or Russians will mostly use conventional sub sonic weapons to target high value targets due to their accuracy and agility

So babur, raad 1 & 2, taimur etc all have their place


And in preparation for the next conflict

Drones
A.D
A high speed supersonic or hypersonic option is vital
Alongside continued work or E.W, airforce and navy induction


We must also remember, Pakistan and India ARE NEIGHBORS,
Nothing is going to be stopped 100%
The only guarantee is that SOMETHING will get through whichever net you throw up

If Russia and Israel can't guarantee total A.D then how can we

 

[Bin Laden]

Does anyone have update on this rocket. Its has the same form factor as F1 but longer ranger due to 2 stage rocket design with possibility of the 1st stage getting detached after usage.



GIDS site still has it on so it's probably still being developed. IMHO this is a much more important system even more than F3/4.

https://www.gids.com.pk/road-to-future

 

[MS Sandhu]

Does anyone have update on this rocket. Its has the same form factor as F1 but longer ranger due to 2 stage rocket design with possibility of the 1st stage getting detached after usage.

View attachment 125282

GIDS site still has it on so it's probably still being developed. IMHO this is a much more important system even more than F3/4.

https://www.gids.com.pk/road-to-future

I think their initial plan was to develop two stage 300mm rocket to get longer range but later on changed the mind and went for bigger SRM and developed 400mm dia rocket motor based Fatah-2 G-MLRS.
Naval SMASH is also this same Fatah-2 but with better guidance mechanism
Fatah-2 SSM & F3 SSM are different in design to F2 GMLRS but likely based on same 400mm dia dual thrust rocket motor.


Except Baseline fins, Fatah-3 SSM doesn't employ any additional fins.