Pakistan Missiles - Updates, News & Discussion

[falcon34]

The Americans are extremely concerned with Ababeel.

TBH I don't believe it's range is 2200km there is no way a 4 stage missile( 2 solid fuel+1 liquid + PBV for dispering mirvs) has range of just 2200km at minimum its IRBM and the Americans know it. It's not a threat to america but their illegitimate child Israel.

 

[AeroTech]

Your info is wrong buddy, the entire Shaheen series has been upgraded with new miniature and Maneuverable RVs, deadly accurate, PBVs been added to provide Midcourse corrections and maneuverability, all this wasn't in shaheen 2. Ababeel is the result of all these upgrades over the years.
We are on the right track. Your just obsessed with SCM and hypersonics. Your forgetting the sorry state of our economy, we are utilizing the funds we have in the best manner possible.

You clearly don't have a clue about what's going on in the industry. A lot of feel good stuff with no evidence. Are you a university kid?

 

[Rational Philosopher]

You clearly don't have a clue about what's going on in the industry. A lot of feel good stuff with no evidence. Are you a university kid?

You are going to find a lot of that on Pakistani forums, it's filled with guys who just make up huge claims about Pakistan's arsenal with nothing to back it up so they can feel good about their super weapons arsenal in their imagination. And lots of them making the claims don't even understand the basic systems they're talking about. Huge coping mechanism for some.

 

[AeroTech]

You are going to find a lot of that on Pakistani forums, it's filled with guys who just make up huge claims about Pakistan's arsenal with nothing to back it up so they can feel good about their super weapons arsenal in their imagination. And lots of them making the claims don't even understand the basic systems they're talking about. Huge coping mechanism for some.

I agree.

I too was a clown like that a decade ago. Until I got into the industry myself and witnessed our 'brilliance' first hand. With a shit economy and almost no industrial base, you can only dream and hallucinate. Under the guise of 'security and secrecy' the SPD created a blackout so that no one on the outside gets to know what 'amazing' feats they're acomplishing. We are horrible in both tech and numbers.

 

[Rational Philosopher]

I agree.

I too was a clown like that a decade ago. Until I got into the industry myself and witnessed our 'brilliance' first hand. With a shit economy and almost no industrial base, you can only dream and hallucinate. Under the guise of 'security and secrecy' the SPD created a blackout so that no one on the outside gets to know what 'amazing' feats they're acomplishing. We are horrible in both tech and numbers.

I have no connection to the industry within Pakistan, but anyone with basic knowledge of how this stuff works, then taking a look at Pakistan's economy size, the level of STEM graduates it produces, university R&D, and observing its missile program, perhaps talking to a few people who know some stuff internally, and how the society generally functions (careless, ignorant, low effort, believe their old systems will work fine decades later) will be able to have a good estimation of where it stands.

And then a fanboy comes along and will tell you about Pakistan's super capabilities in every domain which there's no evidence of, in fact there is evidence of the opposite, and tells you to just believe it. Obviously such a person shouldn't be taken seriously.

 

[Metal 0-1]

Based on my information they are just checking parameters in every missile test no new upgradation of decades old missiles . Now even not doing that too no test took placed recently. They still have a chance even if they acted like fools till now to correct their course of action in 5 to 7 years we can be back on track in missile development. It's a hypersonic era show your one if you are capable other wise it didn't happened i donot believe in conspiracy theories like we have taimur icbm or any hypersonic missile . India is at least 10 years ahead in missile development againt us. India made brahmos many many years ago still we don't have its counter that far we are behind with india i would say even all nuclear powers have better missiles than us and upto date most surprisingly north Korea too they are outstanding .

Not to mention the Brahmos they fired at us were all first generation, they haven't fired their newer ones yet.

 

[AeroTech]

I have no connection to the industry within Pakistan, but anyone with basic knowledge of how this stuff works, then taking a look at Pakistan's economy size, the level of STEM graduates it produces, university R&D, and observing its missile program, perhaps talking to a few people who know some stuff internally, and how the society generally functions (careless, ignorant, low effort, believe their old systems will work fine decades later) will be able to have a good estimation of where it stands.

And then a fanboy comes along and will tell you about Pakistan's super capabilities in every domain which there's no evidence of, in fact there is evidence of the opposite, and tells you to just believe it. Obviously such a person shouldn't be taken seriously.

Yup..the parameters you described are spot on. Economy, stem graduates, R&D rigour, national attitude...

All of these are a recipe for anything but greatness.

 

[Rational Philosopher]

Not to mention the Brahmos they fired at us were all first generation, they haven't fired their newer ones yet.

BrahMos is not even going to be their tier 1 cruise missile soon since they do have a Mk 2 program going on for a hypersonic version that reaches speeds upto Mach 8.

With Russia on board, who basically gave them the P-800 Onyx for BrahMos 1, they'll probably get the tech for the hypersonic BrahMos fed in from the Zircon.

 

[hussain0216]

Your info is wrong buddy, the entire Shaheen series has been upgraded with new miniature and Maneuverable RVs, deadly accurate, PBVs been added to provide Midcourse corrections and maneuverability, all this wasn't in shaheen 2. Ababeel is the result of all these upgrades over the years.
We are on the right track. Your just obsessed with SCM and hypersonics. Your forgetting the sorry state of our economy, we are utilizing the funds we have in the best manner possible.

Yep


For ANYONE not sure about the above

Simply check U.S sanctions on our missile program

Do you think those sanctions are for nothing?????


From the sanctions you can pick up what Pakistan is trying to do

The most recent sanctions were to try and limit it control equipment that would help Pakistan test and improve rocket Motors



We had numerous sanctions applied over the last 10 years

 

[Metal 0-1]

Oh so we need to invest a huge amount of time and money in countering salvos of hypersonic/supersonic cruise missiles with huge stock of high speed interceptors

Let's disregard that and buy J-35 with A-A missiles and no deep strike capable weapons integrated. That'll solve our problem.

BrahMos is not even going to be their tier 1 cruise missile soon since they do have a Mk 2 program going on for a hypersonic version that reaches speeds upto Mach 8.

With Russia on board, who basically gave them the P-800 Onyx for BrahMos 1, they'll probably get the tech for the hypersonic BrahMos fed in from the Zircon.

 

[Rational Philosopher]

Oh so we need to invest a huge amount of time and money in countering salvos of hypersonic/supersonic cruise missiles with huge stock of high speed interceptors

Let's disregard that and buy J-35 with A-A missiles and no deep strike capable weapons integrated. That'll solve our problem.

Well the issue is, none of these areas can be compromised on. Spending all resources on interceptor stocks with no offensive capability and maintaining a modern air force is not feasible.

Again, all comes back to the huge economic issues. If I had to choose between defence or offence, I would choose offence, as the presence of a deterrence to inflict significant damage to opponents critical infrastructure including economy is a safer bet than defense which is never 100% anyway. Israel is the most defended but still took big hits. Pakistan will defensively always be weak. It has to be able to deal major significant blows as a deterrence.

J-35 if it comes will definitely have new air-to-ground weaponry, but missile arsenal is a decade behind, especially conventional one.

 

[Dalit]

You are going to find a lot of that on Pakistani forums, it's filled with guys who just make up huge claims about Pakistan's arsenal with nothing to back it up so they can feel good about their super weapons arsenal in their imagination. And lots of them making the claims don't even understand the basic systems they're talking about. Huge coping mechanism for some.

You guys are newbies on these forums. Many of us have decades of experience on Pakistani defence forums. We have followed Pakistani defence related developments when many of you were probably not even in existence or walking in diapers.

 

[Dalit]

Well the issue is, none of these areas can be compromised on. Spending all resources on interceptor stocks with no offensive capability and maintaining a modern air force is not feasible.

Again, all comes back to the huge economic issues. If I had to choose between defence or offence, I would choose offence, as the presence of a deterrence to inflict significant damage to opponents critical infrastructure including economy is a safer bet than defense which is never 100% anyway. Israel is the most defended but still took big hits. Pakistan will defensively always be weak. It has to be able to deal major significant blows as a deterrence.

J-35 if it comes will definitely have new air-to-ground weaponry, but missile arsenal is a decade behind, especially conventional one.

Most of you guys were laughing at the prospect of Pakistan acquiring the J-35 not so long ago. It was impossible. It was a fanboy dream. It is funny how you guys change narrative.

 

[Rational Philosopher]

Most of you guys were laughing at the prospect of Pakistan acquiring the J-35 not so long ago. It was impossible. It was a fanboy dream. It is funny how you guys change narrative.

I don't know who 'you guys' is. Plus no one has denied it, they disagreed on how soon it would come.

And if we went by claims made on old Pakistani forums then right now we would be flying F-16Vs, J-16s, and J-20s too as they make claims on literally everything. If you claim everything, one day you'll get lucky. It doesn't mean they have actual credibility.

If one is going to make a claim, it should either have credible sources to back it up, or be logical. Not completely fanboy stuff. But people are free to claim what they want, just lies won't help your country in reality. So it's better to focus on factual analysis.

 

[Dalit]

I don't know who 'you guys' is. Plus no one has denied it, they disagreed on how soon it would come.

And if we went by claims made on old Pakistani forums then right now we would be flying F-16Vs, J-16s, and J-20s too as they make claims on literally everything. If you claim everything, one day you'll get lucky. It doesn't mean they have actual credibility.

If one is going to make a claim, it should either have credible sources to back it up, or be logical. Not completely fanboy stuff. But people are free to claim what they want, just lies won't help your country in reality. So it's better to focus on factual analysis.

By you guys I mean exactly you guys.

No one has ever claimed that Pakistan would be flying F-16V or the J-20. You are making that up. Everyone is well aware that US F-16s are out of the question. Why would PAF want the J-20 when it can get the J-35 which fits its philosophy and doctrine?

Just like you have the freedom to share your thoughts, allow others the same liberty. Stop telling others what they can and cannot say. You don't always require a source to share thoughts and ideas. Don't ridicule older members of this forum.