Pakistan-India Conflict 2025: News Updates and Discussion

[hydrabadi_arab]

Sindoor was mega success right? Why run now?

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[Vkdindian1]

It has nothing to do with morals or who is right, but national interest and policy.

Fully agreed.

You can't deter Pakistan by these punitive strikes and will need to escalate. Pakistan can't change the status quo but then it doesn't need to, it's happy to continue supporting the Kashmir freedom fighters.

That is also true. This low threshold game has been on for many decades and it appears that India has decided to increase the cost of that game. KPK and Balochistan issues could also come into this matrix and create difficulties for Pakistan too. Now this is an assumption and please don’t double down against me for saying this.
Pakistan is a security state and the Establishment has the final say on any issue, Kashmir being the biggest one. They would loose all the relevance if this issue is resolved.

So unless there's a dramatic shift in the policy of either country,

To my assessment that dramatic shift is already happening on Indian side. Article 370, using kinetic action openly and suspension of IWT are few examples of that change.
I am also convinced that the Establishment would never back down under the threat of military action by India. Even the Indian policy makers must be well aware of that.
That is where lies the possibility of an escalation and crossing of many thresholds. The exact nature of that still remains shrouded under many unknowns.

 

[Vkdindian1]

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?

This number of 840 seems a little exaggerated. But a couple of hundred could definitely be a possibility.
I do agree with the damage part. No proof so far.

 

[Psyko70]

The lack of common sense show by the IAF shows no bounds. Truly, they have learnt NOTHING ..

Pakistan will have every single electronic snooping device it has, listening in on every frequency being used by the IAF and is busily dissecting all of the comms and radar frequencies being used right now. This exercise is a gold mine for the PAF, given it can listen in and snoop on so much of the electronic spectrum from over the border.

Ruse sir ruse,

Indians might be doing so many exercises to confuse us to think india will attack from here or there or here. If they let us listen by spoofing. Then im sure indians actual would be something else.

Indeed india had great beating but, india did right thing by grounding jets cause they knew its useless. Its not cowardice but smart move, as india knows we wont do something serious like enter india by ground offense.

Why dont we look into another factor, ispr briefing showed too much. Plus, we showed them our anti air capabilities.

I for one know and have full belief these notams are not something serious. Both countries don notam notices.

Pakistan needs to be even more cautious and forget indian losses.

 

[Ali_Baba]

Why dont we look into another factor, ispr briefing showed too much. Plus, we showed them our anti air capabilities.

I too think PAF and ISPR showed too much, in particular its soft kill capabilities which should have been kept under wraps.

 

[Corax]

Fully agreed.

That is also true. This low threshold game has been on for many decades and it appears that India has decided to increase the cost of that game. KPK and Balochistan issues could also come into this matrix and create difficulties for Pakistan too. Now this is an assumption and please don’t double down against me for saying this.
Pakistan is a security state and the Establishment has the final say on any issue, Kashmir being the biggest one. They would loose all the relevance if this issue is resolved.

To my assessment that dramatic shift is already happening on Indian side. Article 370, using kinetic action openly and suspension of IWT are few examples of that change.
I am also convinced that the Establishment would never back down under the threat of military action by India. Even the Indian policy makers must be well aware of that.
That is where lies the possibility of an escalation and crossing of many thresholds. The exact nature of that still remains shrouded under many unknowns.

Couple of points. The blowback Pakistan suffered in KPK in the 2000s was mostly due to siding with the US in the global WoT, rather than due to india. Today you can see that has diminished considerably. The Baloch issue has been going on for decades before the WoT and of course india has been using that, but relatively speaking it's manageable given the fact that WoT blowback is defeated by and large.

I would disagree with your assumption of the Pak military losing all relevance if the Kashmir issue is resolved. Remember Musharaf came very close to settling the issue.

I would say article 370 and the IWT are for visuals at the moment. How long do you think it's going to take india to divert that much water? Decades and billions of dollars. Article 370 doesn't really change much on the ground, other than trying to perhaps change the ethnic makeup in IOK, it certainly hasn't stopped any attacks.

 

[samsite84]

Not to rub salt into the wounds, but in 1962China defeated India occupied, and still occupies 38,000 sq.km of India's most strategic territory across a 1000 km border from the North to North East. 2020 China occupied an additional 1100 sq.km clubbing to death 20 Indian soldiers and capturing 110 more of all ranks including officers.
Yet India's EAM Jaishankar went to Moscow to sign an agreement on accepting the Chinese 1959 demarcations of the Line of Actual Control. Which raises the question why the 1962 war and the Galwan clash were fought in the first place.
Yet your Vice-Chief of Army howls about single front "two-adversaries " blaming China for providing arms and intelligence to the enemy.
Then your EAM Jaishankar travels to Beijing to sign trade agreements when in the 2024-25 fiscal year, India's trade deficit with China reached $99.2 billion

Sure and you won't find me denying that India is far behind China across almost every field (maybe cricket or chess is the saving grace haha). Facts are facts - we were caught unaware and didn't respond well to Chinese aggression and are way behind the geopolitical and technological might. Its only a US vs. China discussion. India is no where near.

Having said that, Pakistan in general hasn't learned any lessons from either China or India's rise. China focused on first becoming an economic powerhouse before projecting military power. Same with India (to a much lesser extent).

Moreover, I find Pakistan loves to play the "younger bro" (from 70s-90s it was USA as big bro now its China). Anyways, topic is Pakistan vs. India conflict so lets stick to it - shall we?

 

[Vkdindian1]

Couple of points. The blowback Pakistan suffered in KPK in the 2000s was mostly due to siding with the US in the global WoT, rather than due to india. Today you can see that has diminished considerably. The Baloch issue has been going on for decades before the WoT and of course india has been using that, but relatively speaking it's manageable given the fact that WoT blowback is defeated by and large.

I would disagree with your assumption of the Pak military losing all relevance if the Kashmir issue is resolved. Remember Musharaf came very close to settling the issue.

I would say article 370 and the IWT are for visuals at the moment. How long do you think it's going to take india to divert that much water? Decades and billions of dollars. Article 370 doesn't really change much on the ground, other than trying to perhaps change the ethnic makeup in IOK, it certainly hasn't stopped any attacks.

IWT is definitely a visual at the moment. Any meaningful diversion of water is atleast 6-7 years away. At this time, it can only have nuisance value in terms of water data sharing putting Pakistan under difficult situation. During lean months, this could pose some difficulties. Even at this time the masses are made to believe that a catastrophe has fallen, if the gates of the dams are either closed or opened. When closed, it is called an attempt to create a drought and when opened, it is with an intent to flood. Awam (both sides) is fully convinced about these narratives. IWT would become more and more of an emotive issue, in the coming years.

370 is not just about attacks but much more. It is also not about changing the demographics as claimed by many posters incorrectly. The details of the same have been discussed in detail on the relevant thread. After all, it has been a troublesome issue for so many decades. Wounds can’t be healed in just a few years. And one Pulwama can’t derail it either.

Moreover, these are just two factors. How big or small can change with time. This is just a start.

 

[samsite84]

Isn't India the self-proclaimed Vishwaguru of the world?
So I guess the lack of comprehension is genuine because I need you to explain the term Vishwaguru, but then as self confessed your ignorance of Sanskrit is profound.

Not indulging in troll posts - do better man. Bye bye

 

[Fatman17]

Page 296 is completely offtopic.

 

[Baibers_1260]

Funny, that a great victory by India's Armed Forces should create such a row in the Indian Parliament. We never saw such a furore even during 2019 (Balakot) and 1999 (Kargil) conflicts

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[NationalistPKDude132]

Funny, that a great victory by India's Armed Forces should create such a row in the Indian Parliament. We never saw such a furore even during 2019 (Balakot) and 1999 (Kargil) conflicts

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no bro we lost, all our nuclear facilities are destroyed, 90% of our air force is destroyed, 30 PAF plane were shot down. we lost bro. They won.

 

[Fatman17]

The classic diversion to a purely military discussion.
- We are richer than you
-We are more democratic than you
-We play better chess
Let me know if you want my posts deleted

Don't need your help or permission

 

[Ali_Baba]

Indians are complaininig of Hydrowarefare from China on new damn

China to build world's biggest dam as India warns of 'water bomb'

Chinese Premier Li Qiang officially launched the construction project for the Motuo Hydropower Station at a ceremony at a remote Tibetan village yesterday, describing it as the 'project of the century'

www.dailymail.co.uk

>> lol !!!

"What goes around, comes around" .. is all i can say.

 

[Fatman17]

Indians are complaininig of Hydrowarefare from China on new damn

China to build world's biggest dam as India warns of 'water bomb'

Chinese Premier Li Qiang officially launched the construction project for the Motuo Hydropower Station at a ceremony at a remote Tibetan village yesterday, describing it as the 'project of the century'

www.dailymail.co.uk

>> lol !!!

There is a separate thread on this subject please