H-1B visas must end’: Wife of US citizen shares plight of landing IT jobs

[r3alist]

@r3alist bro

This entitlement to American affairs and the American dream is really a big part of the problem

Why is this coming up again? It is the American govt and American citizenry who have to decide who is entitled to the American dream.

And why shouldn't silicon valley benefit from someone from Denmark or Switzerland or Australia who will an average be much much better educated

Of course, citizens from these countries are free to come to America if America and its employers want them. Has anyone stopped these folks from coming to US? Hopefully these immigrants will be willing to:

Put in long working hours
Take low wages
Spending months away from home working on projects at clients etc

Regards

Come on sir, you've got 50 pages plus

You want to get another 50 on this

 

[SoulSpokesman]

@kambhakt

People from third world are not more brilliant. It is just that they have enough numbers to satisfy the demand.

And they are willing to put in longer hours and work for lower wages.

Regards

 

[r3alist]

The way to do that is to get more American students into STEM. All this does is to create an imbalance in demand and supply. People from third world are not more brilliant. It is just that they have enough numbers to satisfy the demand.

America and western societies will never go command economy like Eastern society's might

They will therefore always make space for the fine arts or humanities graduate

That therefore means structurally, America will always always need foreign born scientific experts, and within that a good many Indians will fit the bill

But this visa scheme was never meant to prejudice or skew their workforce to deny entry level or further mid-level development to American citizens

So you clearly have a problem when American stem graduates are not landing into silicon valley but Indian graduates are plotting their future in America


This is the structural and societal issue that Indians really ought to be more sympathetic to for their own good

 

[SoulSpokesman]

@r3alist bro,

Yes of course, a century will do nicely.

Regards

 

[r3alist]

@kambhakt

People from third world are not more brilliant. It is just that they have enough numbers to satisfy the demand.

And they are willing to put in longer hours and work for lower wages.

Regards

They might just be very inefficient, therefore they better be willing to put in more hours

 

[vasanthm]

Yes, I seriously believe India cannot absorb the high number of college graduates it churns out every year.



It is not the legal challenges that would neutralize Trump's EO: It is the nature of the 'business' itself; they will figure out ways to bypass most of the restrictions. Legally, Trump will get away as he is getting away with most of his EOs. He is the Emperor unlike any in the American history with majorities in the House, the Senate, and even in the Supreme Court. And from his EO, if only a very high $$ fee for even the new H1Bs is retained then that will have a large impact. But even IF all of his EO is revoked there will still be some hesitation about H1Bs hiring.


Count me in those! I need a damn job!! It is almost six months since I got DOGE'd from my IT job!

As to India livable or not, this video tells you a lot. Not that Pakistan is grand but then Pakistanis don't brag much about Pakistan either; people vote by their feet and Indians are so desperate to leave India that they even take the very dangerous route of sneaking into America from Mexico! There is a reason Indians are found everywhere in the world: They escape India.

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Some of us actually did the opposite, escaped the West and chose to settle back in India.

 

[BrigSmart]

Yes, I seriously believe India cannot absorb the high number of college graduates it churns out every year

How is that incompatible with my statement that the H1B programme is causing a brain drain from India? The people leaving India are not the ones who can't be absorbed but some of the very best who could have helped turbocharge the economy if they had stayed in India.

Despite all the constraints, the Indian economy has still been the fastest growing major economy in the world for the last few years. It can surely accommodation its brightest college graduates.

 

[RajaBaja]

Here we go. India on the floor now. A nation taking steps against it's visa abuse where they lose billions of dollars for their nation and criminal activity results in denying of jobs to their population is now being called as a "humanitarian issue"! Unbelievable. Only India can do things like this!

I thought these guys were such a super duper power that these things weren't going to make a different on their $ 4 trillion economy? While I've been saying it for months now, if Trump went in, it would bring down Indian economy to $ 2.5-3 trillion and they will cap it there. India deceived them for 30 years, took their trillions and millions of jobs and now instead of getting ready to fight China, they are making friends with China, acting big. So why cry now? Weren't these guys bashing Trump last week? Why cry now and bring in "humanity"?
.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/india-warns-us-visa-fee-173544458.html

India warns new US fee for H-1B visa will have 'humanitarian consequences'​

Ben Hatton -
Sun, September 21, 2025 at 11:51 AM GMT+5·3 min read
1.8k

India's Minister of External Affairs Subrahmanyam Jaishankar, whose office warned the change would disrupt families [EPA]
The Indian government has said a new $100,000 (£74,000) fee for applicants seeking US skilled worker visas will have "humanitarian consequences".

President Donald Trump on Friday ordered the new fee for H-1B visa applications, which is more than 60 times the amount currently charged, to go into effect on 21 September.

Workers from India receive by far the most skilled visas in the programme, at just more than 70% of those issued.

Some US tech companies reportedly advised employees with H-1B visas to stay in the US or, if they were out of the country, to try to return immediately. The White House then on Saturday clarified the fee will not apply to current visas or renewal applications.

@Hakikat ve Hikmet @Hakwa Nadro @NA71 @TAC @r3alist @Mighty_Dragon_Strike @mythbuster @Meengla

 

[Meengla]

The way to do that is to get more American students into STEM. All this does is to create an imbalance in demand and supply. People from third world are not more brilliant. It is just that they have enough numbers to satisfy the demand.

Just because many take the worthless psychology, Russian Studies, or Gender Studies courses doesn't mean that there are still tens of thousands of very qualified, very smart young American graduates in STEM every year but they are being thwarted more and more by the Goddamn corporations to even start their careers!

 

[SoulSpokesman]

@r3alist bro @Dalit @Meengla

A solution is on hand. Are US STEM graduates willing to take a paycut and replace H1Bs?

MSN

www.msn.com

The rug that is the H-1B visa has been pulled from under the American immigrant community –– leaving Indian visa holders and aspirants in flux. However, despite a popular belief –– obtaining the H1B is seen as an acquisition of the American dream –– a number of research papers suggest that H-1B holders tend to earn less than their US counterparts.

A 2024 paper titled H-1B Visas and Wages in Accounting: Evidence from Big 4 Payroll and the Ethics of H-1B Visas, published in the Journal of Business Ethics, finds that Big 4 firm Deloitte pays US citizens working in tax and audit 10 per cent more than H-1B holders. While members of the firm suggested that they rely on H-1B obtainees due to a shortage of qualified American chartered public accountants (CPAs), “critics” stated that it was largely a cost-saving mechanism.

“There are several other explanations besides a desire to save on wage costs that could drive this wage discount (such as a difference in English communication skills or an attempt to recoup the considerable filing fees involved in hiring an H-1B worker),” the paper reads, noting that their results are in tandem with the “pattern predicted by H-1B critics.”

The 10 per cent difference between the salaries of US employees and H-1B holders is seen across roles, the paper, which accessed hacked payroll data from Deloitte, notes. The researchers also conclude that the rise in H-1B holders does not adversely impact American hires –– “we find no evidence of H-1B employment driving down the wages of peer U.S. citizen employees,” the report concludes.

Meanwhile, the technology sector, which has long depended on the ubiquity of Indian labour, is also subject to a similar differential. Even as of two decades ago, on average, H-1B wage claims were $16,000 lower than the US equivalent. Moreover, companies were “significantly understating what US computer workers are earning in order to justify paying low wages to H-1B guestworkers in those occupations,” according to a 2007 report published in the Center for Immigration Studies.

“90 percent of H-1B employer prevailing wage claims for programming occupations were below the median U.S. wage for the same occupation and location, with 62 percent of the wage claims in the bottom 25th percentile of U.S. wages,” reads the report.

Another study from 2007 published in Science finds that STEM H-1B workers earn 5 per cent less than Americans with the same qualifications. Conducted by researchers at Georgetown University, the study also shows that H-1B holders who refrain from “job-hopping” make about 11 per cent less than US citizens.

Lowell (author of the study) speculates that foreign workers are paid less because they are often compelled to remain with the same employer to get permanent residency within the 6 years of stay allowed by their visas,” a report on the study notes.

“Lowell says this ‘de facto bondage’ — the residency process, which can take years, starts anew if they change jobs — has the effect of depressing salaries not just for foreign workers but for natives as well.” The H-1B visa is seen as a springboard –– a necessity for a US permanent residency.

Trump’s $1,00,000 hurdle is only for fresh applicants. Even so, it has sent the once powerful Indian diaspora into a frenzy. It also stands to fundamentally alter the relationship between Indians and the American dream.

Regards

 

[Mighty_Dragon_Strike]

There are no socialist paradises anywhere, some people will always get rich first.

but India was going to win anyway!

I was told at the start of this thread, by your esteemed fellow indians

'India wins either way'



just like this photo!

no body won, every body is lost!

 

[r3alist]

@r3alist bro @Dalit @Meengla

A solution is on hand. Are US STEM graduates willing to take a paycut and replace H1Bs?

MSN

www.msn.com

The rug that is the H-1B visa has been pulled from under the American immigrant community –– leaving Indian visa holders and aspirants in flux. However, despite a popular belief –– obtaining the H1B is seen as an acquisition of the American dream –– a number of research papers suggest that H-1B holders tend to earn less than their US counterparts.

A 2024 paper titled H-1B Visas and Wages in Accounting: Evidence from Big 4 Payroll and the Ethics of H-1B Visas, published in the Journal of Business Ethics, finds that Big 4 firm Deloitte pays US citizens working in tax and audit 10 per cent more than H-1B holders. While members of the firm suggested that they rely on H-1B obtainees due to a shortage of qualified American chartered public accountants (CPAs), “critics” stated that it was largely a cost-saving mechanism.

“There are several other explanations besides a desire to save on wage costs that could drive this wage discount (such as a difference in English communication skills or an attempt to recoup the considerable filing fees involved in hiring an H-1B worker),” the paper reads, noting that their results are in tandem with the “pattern predicted by H-1B critics.”

The 10 per cent difference between the salaries of US employees and H-1B holders is seen across roles, the paper, which accessed hacked payroll data from Deloitte, notes. The researchers also conclude that the rise in H-1B holders does not adversely impact American hires –– “we find no evidence of H-1B employment driving down the wages of peer U.S. citizen employees,” the report concludes.

Meanwhile, the technology sector, which has long depended on the ubiquity of Indian labour, is also subject to a similar differential. Even as of two decades ago, on average, H-1B wage claims were $16,000 lower than the US equivalent. Moreover, companies were “significantly understating what US computer workers are earning in order to justify paying low wages to H-1B guestworkers in those occupations,” according to a 2007 report published in the Center for Immigration Studies.

“90 percent of H-1B employer prevailing wage claims for programming occupations were below the median U.S. wage for the same occupation and location, with 62 percent of the wage claims in the bottom 25th percentile of U.S. wages,” reads the report.

Another study from 2007 published in Science finds that STEM H-1B workers earn 5 per cent less than Americans with the same qualifications. Conducted by researchers at Georgetown University, the study also shows that H-1B holders who refrain from “job-hopping” make about 11 per cent less than US citizens.

Lowell (author of the study) speculates that foreign workers are paid less because they are often compelled to remain with the same employer to get permanent residency within the 6 years of stay allowed by their visas,” a report on the study notes.

“Lowell says this ‘de facto bondage’ — the residency process, which can take years, starts anew if they change jobs — has the effect of depressing salaries not just for foreign workers but for natives as well.” The H-1B visa is seen as a springboard –– a necessity for a US permanent residency.

Trump’s $1,00,000 hurdle is only for fresh applicants. Even so, it has sent the once powerful Indian diaspora into a frenzy. It also stands to fundamentally alter the relationship between Indians and the American dream.

Regards

And yet this is an aspiration versus the next option of remaining at home


It's a very cute attempt to garner sympathy, now let's look at the opportunity cost and then it's actually an unbelievably good outcome

 

[BrigSmart]

people vote by their feet and Indians are so desperate to leave India that they even take the very dangerous route of sneaking into America from Mexico

I know several people with substantial dollar net worth, who could have comfortably retired almost anywhere in the world at a relatively young age if they had chosen to, who have moved to India for a multitude of reasons.

India may be a tough place to live for the poor, but it is quite comfortable if one is well off.

 

[Meengla]

How is that incompatible with my statement that the H1B programme is causing a brain drain from India? The people leaving India are not the ones who can't be absorbed but some of the very best who could have helped turbocharge the economy if they had stayed in India.

No, you are still wrong about the 'brain drain' claim. Your logic is like the sky is getting dry because it is 'draining' water via rain! Think about that!
And you are not sending your 'very best'. You are sending everyone who could get away from India. Please don't kid yourself!! But I don't blame India anymore than I would blame Pakistan for trying to export its VERY surplus labor!!

Despite all the constraints, the Indian economy has still been the fastest growing major economy in the world for the last few years. It can surely accommodation its brightest college graduates.

Maybe, just maybe you could 'accommodate' your 'brightest' college graduates but those graduates would still amount to a tiny portion of the large number graduates you produce every year. I don't know why you are kidding yourself by such claims like 'brain drain'. If it was such a 'drain' then you'd wouldnt see even your PM Modi once jockeying for the Indian workers in America.
However, I do agree with you that India has more stability, and better economy than most poor countries of the world.

 

[BrigSmart]

@r3alist bro @Dalit @Meengla

A solution is on hand. Are US STEM graduates willing to take a paycut and replace H1Bs?

MSN

www.msn.com

The rug that is the H-1B visa has been pulled from under the American immigrant community –– leaving Indian visa holders and aspirants in flux. However, despite a popular belief –– obtaining the H1B is seen as an acquisition of the American dream –– a number of research papers suggest that H-1B holders tend to earn less than their US counterparts.

A 2024 paper titled H-1B Visas and Wages in Accounting: Evidence from Big 4 Payroll and the Ethics of H-1B Visas, published in the Journal of Business Ethics, finds that Big 4 firm Deloitte pays US citizens working in tax and audit 10 per cent more than H-1B holders. While members of the firm suggested that they rely on H-1B obtainees due to a shortage of qualified American chartered public accountants (CPAs), “critics” stated that it was largely a cost-saving mechanism.

“There are several other explanations besides a desire to save on wage costs that could drive this wage discount (such as a difference in English communication skills or an attempt to recoup the considerable filing fees involved in hiring an H-1B worker),” the paper reads, noting that their results are in tandem with the “pattern predicted by H-1B critics.”

The 10 per cent difference between the salaries of US employees and H-1B holders is seen across roles, the paper, which accessed hacked payroll data from Deloitte, notes. The researchers also conclude that the rise in H-1B holders does not adversely impact American hires –– “we find no evidence of H-1B employment driving down the wages of peer U.S. citizen employees,” the report concludes.

Meanwhile, the technology sector, which has long depended on the ubiquity of Indian labour, is also subject to a similar differential. Even as of two decades ago, on average, H-1B wage claims were $16,000 lower than the US equivalent. Moreover, companies were “significantly understating what US computer workers are earning in order to justify paying low wages to H-1B guestworkers in those occupations,” according to a 2007 report published in the Center for Immigration Studies.

“90 percent of H-1B employer prevailing wage claims for programming occupations were below the median U.S. wage for the same occupation and location, with 62 percent of the wage claims in the bottom 25th percentile of U.S. wages,” reads the report.

Another study from 2007 published in Science finds that STEM H-1B workers earn 5 per cent less than Americans with the same qualifications. Conducted by researchers at Georgetown University, the study also shows that H-1B holders who refrain from “job-hopping” make about 11 per cent less than US citizens.

Lowell (author of the study) speculates that foreign workers are paid less because they are often compelled to remain with the same employer to get permanent residency within the 6 years of stay allowed by their visas,” a report on the study notes.

“Lowell says this ‘de facto bondage’ — the residency process, which can take years, starts anew if they change jobs — has the effect of depressing salaries not just for foreign workers but for natives as well.” The H-1B visa is seen as a springboard –– a necessity for a US permanent residency.

Trump’s $1,00,000 hurdle is only for fresh applicants. Even so, it has sent the once powerful Indian diaspora into a frenzy. It also stands to fundamentally alter the relationship between Indians and the American dream.

Regards

I have to point out the irony of the Journal of Business Ethics publishing a paper that was based on hacked data.