Can the US win a war with China? Shocking new simulation reveals what could happen if Taiwan is attacked

China literally has much larger manufacturing capacity. All of this can be turned to defence manufacturing which means China can easily produce military equipments in massive quantities that will dwarf USA if it actually enters a war. I don't see how China can lose
Because rule number 1 of war.

YOU FIGHT WITH WHAT YOU GOT, NOT WHAT YOU WILL HAVE.

Industrial Capacity means nothing if you are at war, because you cannot make things instantly, especially if you are on the side that facing active warfare (again, bullet and missile will not just going 1 direction if China go to war with Japan and US) if you bank on producing military equipment during an active war, you have already lost that war.
 
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And the fleet in Asia can destroy the Chinese cities? What has the Russo-UKrainian War prove to you? Even with thousands of bombs and missiles, Ukraine is still standing due to sheer size.

Dude, you are comparing coastal city to the entire country now?? And do you know how damage Ukraine is in part that was important? How about Kyiv? Kharkiv? Kherson?

You don't need to damage everywhere, nobody would say you need to damage everything to extra a toll. Go look at a map and see how many cities in China is within 500km of Taiwanese Coast, all those city is going to be targeted Unless you can eliminate every threat both Naval and Ground, which you don't need to serve in the Military to know this is impossible.

Do you know why we have the world's largest optical, radar and signals satellite network? Do you know why we have the world's most hyperprecise mm level (near Taiwan Straits and Mainland) Beidou Navigation System? Do you know why we have the World's first ASBM system with 2000km range? Guess why? You think we can only destroy 3 CBGs? That is not counting the countless shore based ASM, AAM and submarines. The moment you enter Taiwan Straits, US Navy is basically fried. You can send 10 carriers and it will be toasted in that tiny area. You never said this and you never said that, hey you also say alot of things and don't admit thereafter, come on, I have caught you bullshiting numerous times LNG, Navy Rust and what else I forgot. lol.

First of all, as I said before, you can't track anything real time, the best bet you can is with AI doing Target ID, which you aren't good at, and it's still not going to be real time.

Second of all, you are expecting the US to just push the 10 Carrier into 2000km without any action station nor strategy, sure, if they do that, they probably deserve to lose them all, this is what you people never understand, you move tactically by combining a number of fleet, you push the contagious zone into China by first getting an exclusive zone operate by sub and smaller ship, and then move closer with the bigger ship, and finally with the carrier. It's called an executed manuver

On the other hand, you aren't going to fight in China, you invade Taiwan, that mean that fight is going to be at least over Taiwan, and that mean you don't have any local advantage. Becuase if you fight the American in Taiwan, they are going to make it hel for you to entire the Taiwanese Airspace,

But do I expect that tiny brain of yours can process those information? No.

Carriers lose their advantage in near shore battles against unsinkable land 'carriers'. Do you know how far the Chinese air defense system extend into. Do you know we can even vaporize Taipei from coastal China using just cheap artillery? You must be the genius who thinks it takes 2 frigates to sink 1 destroyer and 4 corvettes to sink 1 destroyer? LOL. Within the Taiwan Straits, even the simple missile boat can sink a carrier.

Let's look at conventional warfare and see the balance

CHINA
US

LOL. Maybe we can all go home if you think 1 missile boat can sink a carrier.

Dude, you have no concept of how warfare work, I don't even know where to begin.

You don't fight a war with 1 to 1. It's not a game, you don't go up with a Type 52 against a single AB Class destroyer. War is about combine action and maneuver. In this case, PLA would be in the disadvantage because YOU initiate the attack, which mean your navy can only do 1 of the 2. Either hunt down the US fleet as a pack OUTSIDE of Taiwanese Contagious Zone, or sit there and protect the fleet and the landing and the operation in Taiwan, you can't do both, NOBODY can do both. And you don't have enough ship and fleet to do both . Which mean either way you will have an issue because if you are tied down, and there are no way you can maintain sea control with 3 fleets, that's too big of a gap to cover, which mean your enemy can exploit them, or you can use the 2 fleet to stay on your side of Taiwan strait and protect the approach and launching 1 fleet to chase down the US fleet, but then it will be 1 against 3. Either.

In war, we don't just have everyone sit in one place and send missile or lob artillery, the first thing they teach you in Infantry School is how to move against an objective, and the first thing in Officer Candidate School is they teach you how to maneuver your unit into position to attack, to ambush and to work with other unit. If you think your war is going to be just sending artillery and missile on the other side, then you probably would have a big surprise when your troop land in Taiwan.


Why do you think we have 100+ fast agile missile boats? What do you think these boats can do near shore within the coastal air & antiship defence umbrella? A destroyer is basically a missile boat with air defense capability and longer op range. If it is near shore, covered by coastal air defense, a corvette or a missile boat can actually destroy any ship. Do you understand now? This is IF US sends in their WHOLE NAVY. Destroy Chinese cities my arse. Even tiny Ukraine after getting bombarded by thousands of missiles and artillery is still standing. I am not even getting into the industrial might of our MIC producing missiles, artillery and drones. What about ship repair, replenishment and supplies? US Okinawa base is 600km away. China is 200km from Taiwan. It will take US 10 hours travelling at 30 knots just to reach Taipei. Kiev is 800 kmsq and 1700 kmsq, is Kiev destroyed yet?

The highlighted sentence is the reason I said you have no idea at all how war is fought.

IF IT IS NEAR SHORE. What if it wasn't? What if your fleet has to chase down some target? What if you have to stay in one area to protect the approach? The what if part is why Akagi was sunk during Battle of Midway, in fact it's the reason why the entire battle was done for the Japanese, because they ignore the what if situation, because it's too implausible. You don't assume anything in war. Everything you have to prepared for. You can't just have one play book and think, if this war happened this way, then we will do that, because this through process does not exist in real war. you have to prepare for all possibility, in fact, many simulations would see US ship not even go inside the Taiwan Strait because their main job is to position themselves to support Taiwan, they don't need to get close to Chinese Coast, have you even thought about that?

And agian,you fight a war with equipment you get, you can't ask your enemy to wait for your next batch of product before they attack, be it 1 year or 3 months, once you expanded all your stored equipment, you are going to sit with your thumb up your arse waiting for your suuperor MIC to turn out the next one, only that your enemy will not stop and wait for you. Or why do you think Russia have to fight with 60 years old tank they got, instead of building new T-90? Do you think Russia lost the ability to build new tank?

Dude, your word make me laugh......
Do you want me to remind you of your 'intelligence' and how many times I caught you with your pants down? Nukes are weapons of last resort, why go nuke first when you can attack conventionally. Why do you think US is just cheerleading in Ukraine with POM POMs? If Moscow is destroyed conventionally by NATO, what do you think happens? They are gonna take it like a bitch? Now open up that big brain of yours and start thinking. If it was that simple, they why don't US destroy St. P? Occupy it? Hey, Ukraine is just next to NATO man, no sea barrier, easy logistics, huge NATO army. WHY???

Kursk is occupied by a weaker Ukraine, heck Ukraine can send anybody and camp in that 1000s of square km of wilderness, same like what Russia did intially, occupying 1000s of kmsq of empty land and then what? Does it mean anything besides prolonging the war? That's the act of desperation to get attention and funding and the stupidest move ever. What are they going to achieve doing that? Imagine there is a huge empty land in Siberia, and China moves in with 10'000 soldiers and encamp there, and then what? But if 10'000 Chinese capture Vladivostok, that would be different. So tell me why isn't US destroying Moscow or occupying Kursk? Despite having no CBGs, US does not even dare sink a Russian tugboat. WHYYYYYYY? GUESS WHY?
Again, that show you how lack of Strategic Thinking you have.

Why or how would Russia be destroyed at all if it was the one that attacking. The war can stop when Russia pull its troop out, so unless Putin is REALLY, EXTREMELY stupid and even stupider than you who come up with this idea. There are no way Russia can be destroyed. He would have pull his troop and stop fighting before it got destroyed by Ukraine with whatever mean possible. They are an active participant, not a passive a participant.

It's stupid to think you are going broke to attack someone when the easiest way to prevent you from going broke is to stop doing it.

And why would US destroy Saint Petersburg? Dude, that's not even a military target. In fact, why US need to do anything at all? Just because they don't like Russia does not equate to they need to send their force and destroy Russia, especially the war is not really going the Russian way to begin with. I see no need to even send American Personnel to protect Ukraine, why would they want to attack Russia? The only people that even Tried are all Russian, and some Ukrainian currently in Kursk

And talking about Kursk, the aim is very obvious that if there is a negotiation, you would trade Kursk with Russia, or if they would divert, which they did, that's why the Southern Attack is all but thawed, and force the Russia to either choose to support their force in the South or in Kursk, if the Ukrainian didn't invade Kursk, the Russian would have already taken Pokrovsk and Torske, that is a strategic move as it interdict supply line and draw your force into 2, you only see it as desperate act because your brain lack the function to see things strategically.


You can have nukes since 1000BC for all I care. The point is the bombs now are 100x deadlier than Hiroshima. And that's the reason US can only bark in Ukraine. No Superpowers fight direct, they can fight indirectly because if Russia proper or Mainland China is attacked, the war will escalate very fast into nuclear war. Even if only Shanghai is destroyed, China WILL retaliate and DESTROY SF.

Which is a smarted move? Making Russia a NATO member and gangraping China? Or pushing Russia the world's largest resource center to China the world's largest industrial power? LOL. Doesn't take a genius to see it mate. Russia with access to Chinese market and industrial goods can militarize very fast. Look, Russia was supposed to have ran out of ammo 1 year ago, out of drones, out of missiles. WHERE DO YOU THINK THEY GET THEIR COMPONENTS?
Well, Russia can only bark in Ukraine too, how's the 3 days operation going? From taking Ukraine as a whole to try to cut them off from the coast to now try to take Donbas, which is still multiple decade away, if that is ever possible.

I mean sure, if Russian tourist want to eat Chinese Food, that's cool, they can be your bitch for all I care. Have fun propping up a 1.5 trillion market with literally nothing in return but oil and potatoes, gosh, you must love Potatoes........

LOL
 
This is the difference between China and the US in a potential conflict in the Western Pacific.

The great American effort will be measured by its ability to solve the logistical problems of maintaining an air-naval war in the Pacific.

In addition, it is not only a question of logistics, but also a war of attrition that most of these "war games" do not consider, because they think that any war will be a war with a decisive victory in a short period of time, because that is how they plan to wage a war but this does not take into account what the enemy's capabilities can impose, which is why they fell flat on their faces when the war in Ukraine turned into a war of attrition with Kiev's allies unable to adequately arm Ukraine to make a military victory against Russia possible, while Russia had all its military industry weight to maintain this war of attrition, with China this nightmare is worsened more than 100 times.

For example, CSIS's "war games" only cover one month of fighting:

What happens if the war lasts more than a year? Here are the questions.

RUSI goes into full detail about this fundamental problem for the West:
That's because unlike Ukraine, if China have to invade Taiwan, there are only 1 way they can do it, and that's by amphibious operation. And you can't last 3 months of that if you are to fight. In fact, even Russian/Ukraine war, the land scape now and the land scape 3 months after Feb 24 2022 is quite similar with only 500 or so Squre Kilometers different, and you are talking about a plain border with road access.

On the other hand, the issue with Taiwan is they are a near peer for China, unlike Ukraine to Russia. If China fight Taiwan, unless you are thinking along the line of Kabul capitulation, there are going to massive damage in the Chinese coast facing Taiwan, and you also did not consider any potential resource embargo when China need Copper, Aluminium and Iron ore to keep the production. If US is going to war with China, this is NOT going to be just a Taiwan Strait warfare, but it will be stopping Chinese bound traffic from as far down south at Singapore and North from Alaska (May even be from the middle east). You can't make shit if you don't have resource, which mean if China is at war with the US, they don't just need to fight in Taiwan Strait.

So things are not at all that rosy as you think.
 
Much like Russia's nuclear saber rattling, the US coming to the defense of Taiwan is a bluff. If the US was serious, they would have signed a formal treaty...they have not, because they know the truth.

The only thing stopping China from taking Taiwan are 2 things.

1) China wants Taiwan's infrastructure intact (including its Semiconductor industry), and a war would mean that they can't guarantee it.

2) China isn't completely confident in its military preparations, and infantry capabilities yet.
 
lol, do you think all this mean anything if you piss off the American if you invade Taiwan?

Again, you get it the other way around, if you don't want to fight the American, the best course of action is not to invade Taiwan.
The Korean War, the Vietnam War, the Sino-US trade war, it's not like China and the US haven't fought wars before

You are afraid of the US, but that doesn't mean the Chinese are afraid of the US

Do you think China invaded Taiwan

Taiwan occupied China's Kinmen Island and Mazu Island, do you think it's an invasion?

1732710591612.png
 
That's because unlike Ukraine, if China have to invade Taiwan, there are only 1 way they can do it, and that's by amphibious operation. And you can't last 3 months of that if you are to fight. In fact, even Russian/Ukraine war, the land scape now and the land scape 3 months after Feb 24 2022 is quite similar with only 500 or so Squre Kilometers different, and you are talking about a plain border with road access.

On the other hand, the issue with Taiwan is they are a near peer for China, unlike Ukraine to Russia. If China fight Taiwan, unless you are thinking along the line of Kabul capitulation, there are going to massive damage in the Chinese coast facing Taiwan, and you also did not consider any potential resource embargo when China need Copper, Aluminium and Iron ore to keep the production. If US is going to war with China, this is NOT going to be just a Taiwan Strait warfare, but it will be stopping Chinese bound traffic from as far down south at Singapore and North from Alaska (May even be from the middle east). You can't make shit if you don't have resource, which mean if China is at war with the US, they don't just need to fight in Taiwan Strait.

So things are not at all that rosy as you think.
Dude, what are you talking about? China is one of the largest copper producers in the world, and they have Russia, which has large copper reserves to maintain production. With sanctions against Russia, they threw Russia into China's lap to make this a reality. Aluminum is the same thing. China is the largest producer in the world, and with Russia in third place, there will be no shortage of aluminum. In terms of iron ore, China has one of the largest reserves. They can still rely on recycling. China will not lack anything you said in an eventual all-out war.

Another thing in your narrative that is actually funny is that the US does not even have enough resources to keep choke points open in a limited war in the ME. Do you really imagine that the US would have the capacity to close maritime traffic south of Singapore, north of Alaska, and also in the ME? hahahahahahaha don't make me laugh man, you always make me laugh with your absurd statements...

The US does not have a fleet that allows for such great coordination and deployment of forces in multiple theaters, this has not existed since the end of the Cold War. The US had difficulty maintaining just a single CVN in the ME, they will not be able to do what you claim, this is total nonsense. What is even worse is that you still claim that they would fight China, that is: the US fleet would close several choke points, closing trade with China and would also fight China in the Taiwan Strait, I don't know where you got that idea, because it is simply not realistic under any circumstances, especially if we talk about the logistics issue that has clearly shown that they cannot sustain this deployment that you disclose here.

I advise you to calm down because you have already made several mistakes that have been refuted in this topic alone. I know you are anti-China, but you don't need to use narratives to impose your OPINION that things would not be as everyone imagines, because you really don't know how things would be.
 
The next war will be fought at the time, location and scale of our choice.
It will be a trap for Anglo, not another way around.

The result will be Anglo and Jews murdering each other, we will be the judge.
 
Because rule number 1 of war.

YOU FIGHT WITH WHAT YOU GOT, NOT WHAT YOU WILL HAVE.

Industrial Capacity means nothing if you are at war, because you cannot make things instantly, especially if you are on the side that facing active warfare (again, bullet and missile will not just going 1 direction if China go to war with Japan and US) if you bank on producing military equipment during an active war, you have already lost that war.
You are mistaken big time. Wars are not waged for 1 day. They are a long process. WW1 lasted 4 years. WW2 lasted 6 years. Even with missiles and nukes, wars of annihilation (total wars) will drag on. So, during the course of war, China will vastly outmatch USA.

As for current inventory, China doesn't want to have huge inventory of equipments that need regular maintenance and fuel - like aircrafts, large ships etc as they would cause diversion of useful resources to mere maintenance activities. USA is using 3 million barrels of oil just for sustaining its military- aircraft fuel, cargo ships, transportation etc across the globe due to its vast bases. In addition, good quality human resources are also deployed all over the world doing useless marches and drills most of the time instead of doing productive activities. China is simply being smart and avoiding these needless costs while also having enough capacity to fight and huge reserve capacity to win wars of attrition.
 
lol, do you think all this mean anything if you piss off the American if you invade Taiwan?

Again, you get it the other way around, if you don't want to fight the American, the best course of action is not to invade Taiwan.
speaking on behalf of your daddy who discarded you in VN, PH, JP, KR? More posts 24/7 window closing on the 1.6B of alms...Bidenyahu is staggering into the sunset.....
 
Dude, what are you talking about? China is one of the largest copper producers in the world, and they have Russia, which has large copper reserves to maintain production. With sanctions against Russia, they threw Russia into China's lap to make this a reality. Aluminum is the same thing. China is the largest producer in the world, and with Russia in third place, there will be no shortage of aluminum. In terms of iron ore, China has one of the largest reserves. They can still rely on recycling. China will not lack anything you said in an eventual all-out war.

China is the 4th largest Copper Producer in the world, however it is also the number 1 import country in the world


1732722672620.png


1732722563127.png

In fact, the net difference is 5 million tons (that's -5 million tons)

It's the same with Bauxite *(Aluminium Ore) Where China is the third biggest production country, however, Chinese import Bauxite Dependency is at 46.7% import level at 132 million tons

1732723170167.png

1732723148451.png

That's a negative of -73 million tons....

You don't just go look at production value, you also need to go look at import value, because that's actual need for said element. It's the same with US Oil, US Oil Production is world number 1 at around 11 million barrel a day, however, it mean nothing as US consumption is around 19 million barrel a day. Yes, US produce hack ton of oil, but if there is an oil embargo on the US by the other country, US would still suffered. Same as China toward Copper and Aluminium production.


Another thing in your narrative that is actually funny is that the US does not even have enough resources to keep choke points open in a limited war in the ME. Do you really imagine that the US would have the capacity to close maritime traffic south of Singapore, north of Alaska, and also in the ME? hahahahahahaha don't make me laugh man, you always make me laugh with your absurd statements...

Huh? First of all, I said it could, it doesn't mean it will, and if they blockade the Middle East, they don't need to blockade the Malacca Strait. And you don't need a lot of fleet to blockade the middle east, because there are 2 choke point at the med. One at Suez Canal, and another is a Gibraltar

And what make you think if you go to war with US, the other NATO country won't join? Talking about absurd. Do you think you attack the US the other NATO country would just sit by??

I can doi hahahahahahha, that mean shit man.

The US does not have a fleet that allows for such great coordination and deployment of forces in multiple theaters, this has not existed since the end of the Cold War. The US had difficulty maintaining just a single CVN in the ME, they will not be able to do what you claim, this is total nonsense. What is even worse is that you still claim that they would fight China, that is: the US fleet would close several choke points, closing trade with China and would also fight China in the Taiwan Strait, I don't know where you got that idea, because it is simply not realistic under any circumstances, especially if we talk about the logistics issue that has clearly shown that they cannot sustain this deployment that you disclose here.

I advise you to calm down because you have already made several mistakes that have been refuted in this topic alone. I know you are anti-China, but you don't need to use narratives to impose your OPINION that things would not be as everyone imagines, because you really don't know how things would be.
lol, yeah, because you said so?? Would you care to explain how Logisitic is an issue for the US when they do have port literally like everywhere.

Oh, I forgot, you must be Naval God. What you said must be true, and for sure you know EVERY US capability to have said that, I wonder what kind of security clearance you have? LOL Maybe you have some super duper clearance I don't, because I do have TS/SCI clearance and I wouldn't know how capable the US Navy is at any given time.

So please don't make me laugh son. But well, you did say Ukraine can't do CAS support with NATO aircraft despite Ukraine is NATO certified, oh, well, carry on.

:ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:
 
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The Korean War, the Vietnam War, the Sino-US trade war, it's not like China and the US haven't fought wars before

You are afraid of the US, but that doesn't mean the Chinese are afraid of the US

Do you think China invaded Taiwan

Taiwan occupied China's Kinmen Island and Mazu Island, do you think it's an invasion?

View attachment 84667
I don't know whether or not China will invade Taiwan.

I am saying if China invade Taiwan and US was directly involved, 9 out of 10 times China WILL LOSE that war.
 
You are mistaken big time. Wars are not waged for 1 day. They are a long process. WW1 lasted 4 years. WW2 lasted 6 years. Even with missiles and nukes, wars of annihilation (total wars) will drag on. So, during the course of war, China will vastly outmatch USA.

As for current inventory, China doesn't want to have huge inventory of equipments that need regular maintenance and fuel - like aircrafts, large ships etc as they would cause diversion of useful resources to mere maintenance activities. USA is using 3 million barrels of oil just for sustaining its military- aircraft fuel, cargo ships, transportation etc across the globe due to its vast bases. In addition, good quality human resources are also deployed all over the world doing useless marches and drills most of the time instead of doing productive activities. China is simply being smart and avoiding these needless costs while also having enough capacity to fight and huge reserve capacity to win wars of attrition.
Again, do you understand the concept of "Power Regeneration"?

Say you can super charge a production with the "MASSIVE CHINESE INDUSTRIAL CAPACITY" of building a carrier from 4 years to 1, which mean that 1 carrier cannot be destroyed or put out of service within that year, otherwise you won't have a carrier to replace it. It applies to literally EVERYTHING IN WAR, not just ship, the same applies to Tanks, Artillery, Artillery Rounds, and most important of all, human. Say if you build 10 carrier in one year, where do you find people to staff it? You need trained people to staff military equipment, like I said on the other thread with @That_Guy power generation is not just plug someone and put a rifle on him and tell him to charge an enemy position. The more existing equipment can last you longer, that's a unreputable fact. And that fact is, US have more fleet in the current and that can make them last longer.

On the other hand, you also need to consider damage to the country industrial base, especially for the Navy, because they are close to Taiwan as well, if you can reach it, they can reach back, which mean you won't have full capacity on production to begin with.
 
speaking on behalf of your daddy who discarded you in VN, PH, JP, KR? More posts 24/7 window closing on the 1.6B of alms...Bidenyahu is staggering into the sunset.....
Dude, you need to chill, your post makes zero sense............
 
The next war will be fought at the time, location and scale of our choice.
It will be a trap for Anglo, not another way around.

The result will be Anglo and Jews murdering each other, we will be the judge.
Don't share your ideas with Putin.

Putin and Trump don't have secrets. What you tell Putin is going to be shared with Trump.

Trump: ‘Used to talk about’ Ukraine invasion with Putin​



Putin planned a secret invasion of Ukraine and told Trump years ago the plan. Meaning Trump was in on the plan. Not, as Trump lies, against the plan. Trump did not warn Europe and Ukraine. Trump after the invasion called Putin genius for invasion.

Trump calls Putin ‘genius’ and ‘savvy’ for Ukraine invasion​


 
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I don't know whether or not China will invade Taiwan.

I am saying if China invade Taiwan and US was directly involved, 9 out of 10 times China WILL LOSE that war.

Exactly, the US will sink the majority of Chinese ships, and destroy its airlift capacity.

Without those China cant gain sea control and resupply its forces on Taiwan. This isn’t Russia-Ukraine, where Chinese forces can just drive to Taiwan.

The US will destroy the PLAN and its naval production capacity. At that point, it’s over for China.
 

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