France offers full support in nuclear submarines, jet engines and underwater drones to India

[AjayGhatak]

China-Pak relationship is on a different level to the French-India one.

Different level

 

[Justin TruDont]

Different level

As they say

Beggers can't be choosers

- Shahbaz Sharif ,chief Katora Officer of Riasat E Pudina

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

India is acquiring 2 squadrons of Rafale M for the air wing of INS Vikrant. If fourth-generation tech is so "obsolete," why does the US Navy still operate hundreds of F/A-18 Super Hornets from the decks of its 11 nuclear-powered aircraft carriers? That's because their flying hours, maintainability, and serviceability are superior compared to even the F-35, whose flying costs are so high they aren't sustainable, even for the Americans. So, the notion that fourth-generation jets are obsolete is fundamentally flawed.

The Indian Air Force’s Rafale F3R, equipped with India-Specific Enhancements, is on par with the Rafale F4.2 being delivered today. Even the French Air Force is upgrading its older Rafales to this standard before transitioning to the Rafale F5, skipping the immediate need for a fifth-generation fighter.

As for fifth- and sixth-generation jets, it's laughable that Pakistanis are discussing them when their air force still largely operates third-generation fighters like the Mirage III, Mirage V, and F-7. Even their newer JF-17 Block I had serious limitations, lacking proper air-to-air capabilities. It took the JF-17 Block III just to rectify some of those issues, but it still uses an air-cooled AESA radar, which is known to be more maintenance-prone compared to the more advanced liquid-cooled AESA radars, like India's Uttam or the Israeli Elta ELM-2052 that we are integrating.

Even if Pakistan upgrades its fleet with Chinese jets like the JF-17 Block III, it still cannot match the combat-proven capabilities of India's aircraft or its advanced avionics. The JF-17 still lacks the sophisticated fly-by-wire technology and combat data-linking that India’s fleet of 50 Mirage 2000s possess, let alone the next-gen capabilities found in the Rafale.

Both China and India upgraded the Russian MiG-21 into the MiG-21 Bison and J-7, respectively. While the Indian Air Force has retired the Bison, Pakistan Air Force and the People's Liberation Army Air Force continue to operate it. Additionally, PAF is still using the Mirage III and V, which are just as outdated as the MiG-21.

 

[AbuShalehRumi]

Mistrial is a different case as Russia is anyways nato enemy but time to time France has shown independent policies.... it didn't even embargo India after nuclear tests..... after Iraq was sanctioned during saddam time after seeing the desperate need of medicines, food by Iraqi people France ignored American warning and supplied necessary things to Iraq.... I mean they have maintained their sovereignty well compared to other nato powers.... they host American troops because of being in nato.....

I'm not saying Korea, Japan are not advanced or don't have higher per capita income but anyone can easily say that India is better than them when it comes to independent policies.... there is a reason India still do not trust America for offensive platforms.....

fair enough...

It's a business... India too supplies food, cotton to Bangladesh.....

Agreed.

One of your compatriot brought up this nonsense.

 

[Justin TruDont]

Why UAE is backing out from Rafale deal?

They are making it about the recent arrest of CEO of telegram in France.

Apparently he is a UAE citizen.

However the reality could be that they have been secretly offered the F35As by USA , with Tacit approval of Israel .

UAE sits at the entrance of the Persian Gulf. 3 squadrons of F35As will be enough to keep Iran from doing something stupid . And save millions of American tax dollars spent on maintaining F35 sqds in the Gulf

 

[silicon0000]

India is acquiring 2 squadrons of Rafale M for the air wing of INS Vikrant. If fourth-generation tech is so "obsolete," why does the US Navy still operate hundreds of F/A-18 Super Hornets from the decks of its 11 nuclear-powered aircraft carriers? That's because their flying hours, maintainability, and serviceability are superior compared to even the F-35, whose flying costs are so high they aren't sustainable, even for the Americans. So, the notion that fourth-generation jets are obsolete is fundamentally flawed.

The Indian Air Force’s Rafale F3R, equipped with India-Specific Enhancements, is on par with the Rafale F4.2 being delivered today. Even the French Air Force is upgrading its older Rafales to this standard before transitioning to the Rafale F5, skipping the immediate need for a fifth-generation fighter.

As for fifth- and sixth-generation jets, it's laughable that Pakistanis are discussing them when their air force still largely operates third-generation fighters like the Mirage III, Mirage V, and F-7. Even their newer JF-17 Block I had serious limitations, lacking proper air-to-air capabilities. It took the JF-17 Block III just to rectify some of those issues, but it still uses an air-cooled AESA radar, which is known to be more maintenance-prone compared to the more advanced liquid-cooled AESA radars, like India's Uttam or the Israeli Elta ELM-2052 that we are integrating.

Even if Pakistan upgrades its fleet with Chinese jets like the JF-17 Block III, it still cannot match the combat-proven capabilities of India's aircraft or its advanced avionics. The JF-17 still lacks the sophisticated fly-by-wire technology and combat data-linking that India’s fleet of 50 Mirage 2000s possess, let alone the next-gen capabilities found in the Rafale.

@DDG-80 You don't need to bring same crap you are posting in every thread, This is not JF17 Thread nor Pakistan Jet thread (If you want to discuss that then do it in relevant thread and got proper response). First read the comments on which i commented and then my comments and If you can't understand what was in discussion then you better avoid it.

 

[onlinpunit]

This is the thing Indians fail to understand.

If youre allowed to buy advanced US tech, you are already deep in a alliance with US. There are multiple defence agreement which has to be implemented before any advanced equipment is sold.

I thinks it's difficult for the Pakistanis to understand independet foreign policy. Also we buy US Equipment in hard cash..

 

[AjayGhatak]

French know they have got you over a barrel, if you sign a deal ("fast track deal" has been "fast tracked" for last year now), you will pay a handsome premium for aome good weapons and that is all.

If 36 Rafales and 6 Scorpenes got you no ToT, another 26 Rafales and 3 Scorpese will not move the needle.

UAE Rafale deal still very much on, its crappy media outlets with no cfredibility claiming it is not and even without it Dsssault have orders up until 2030. Not including a potnetial Saudi order and follow on orders.

India is not in the power position of negotiation you like to imagine it is. French know you have already cleared 26 Rafales and 3 more Scorpenes, they have absolutely no incentive to negotiate, furthermore if you cancel with the, you face retendering and another 5 off years of delay (The French are also aware of this).

"Welcome to the Layer Cake son...."

Lets face it. India spends only 2.4% of GDP on defence. It is below even USA (3.4%), and a number of middle east countries. It is even lower than Pakistan (2.8%). Yet it is more than 10 times in absolute number of what pakistan can afford.

So if it spends even 0.1% more, it can afford all of these stuff with all the premium added. All India needs to do is to add some tax premium to luxury imports (like marble from italy and cars from germany and motorcycles from usa) and alcohol and tobacco. That alone will more than fund India's spend on defence.

Meanwhile for Pakistan to even attempt to match it, it will need to double its defence spending. With an absolutely route in economy, any more spending on defence will break Pakistan's back.

Remember, its not India that is going from one place to another asking for bailouts. Thats Pakistan and Bangladesh doing.

 

[AbuShalehRumi]

Actions of India are much louder than "birds". It is dealing with Russia while others dare not.

LOL, China is the lifeline of Russian economy. India is just purchasing some crude oil using bartering trade.

 

[AjayGhatak]

LOL, China is the lifeline of Russian economy. India is just purchasing some crude oil using bartering trade.

So? Can Pakistan buy oil from Russia? Can Bangladesh buy oil from Russia? Are they buying oil from Russia? And its not just oil. India bought S400 from Russia while all other countries were scared of CATSAA.

Can Bangladesh dare to buy S-400 from Russia? Or even BM-21 Grad rockets?

"LOL"

 

[CombatCorner]

As they say

Beggers can't be choosers

- Shahbaz Sharif ,chief Katora Officer of Riasat E Pudina

Then again, creatures from Rape Public of India, have no clue who is sitting on their face except when maybe something happens in Mumbai or Delhi.