Green light for Eurofighter from Germany for the Turkish Air Force

[Foinikas]

well its complicated Greece is an MTCR member so technically France is allowed to give them the missile, just like the US gives the UK Tomahawks.

The export restriction is to non MTCR states.

But lets see which version they get. Either way its not a significant difference from other subsonic cruise missiles. and they would be needed in numbers to have any significant impact..

The government is saying a lot now. That's what pissed most defence/military fans online. The minister suddenly said "all the FDI HN will be able to carry MdCN" without giving any other information. That took the defence sites and reporters by storm. Then everyone started wondering: Will they reduce the number of Aster-30 from 32 to 24 just to put 8 MdCN? Will they install additional cells to carry MdCN? Then how many? 8 or 24? Is it worth it? Why not buy submarines that can carry it?

Then,in the interview the other day,he said the Hellenic Navy will be incredibly strengthened and it will acquire a first strike capability that it never had before in the history of Hellenism. And then he says he'll tell them in secret,meaning he can't reveal it publically. Then he says we are making an AA dome ....and that he will tell them with what,but again confidentially.

Then what's the news? That's why everybody calls him names online. He keeps mumbling about ecosystems and innovation and let me quote:

"We are creating the most powerful Armed Forces in the (many) centuries-old history of our motherland".

And people just get angry with him,because on one hand he says such stuff and on the other he nags about not having enough money to spend here or there or that we have to "prioritize" our defence projects.

On a small note,a bit relative to the thread:

There is rumor that we're probably going for Iron Dome and David's Sling or Spyder and David's Sling. Somehow,there is a rumor that the government wants to go with Israeli systems. Which makes you wonder,why not something European?

 

[Foinikas]

typical thieves with French-Americans

What exactly did we steal?

 

[SiliconBit (silicon0000)]

The government is saying a lot now. That's what pissed most defence/military fans online. The minister suddenly said "all the FDI HN will be able to carry MdCN" without giving any other information. That took the defence sites and reporters by storm. Then everyone started wondering: Will they reduce the number of Aster-30 from 32 to 24 just to put 8 MdCN? Will they install additional cells to carry MdCN? Then how many? 8 or 24? Is it worth it? Why not buy submarines that can carry it?

Then,in the interview the other day,he said the Hellenic Navy will be incredibly strengthened and it will acquire a first strike capability that it never had before in the history of Hellenism. And then he says he'll tell them in secret,meaning he can't reveal it publically. Then he says we are making an AA dome ....and that he will tell them with what,but again confidentially.

Then what's the news? That's why everybody calls him names online. He keeps mumbling about ecosystems and innovation and let me quote:

"We are creating the most powerful Armed Forces in the (many) centuries-old history of our motherland".

And people just get angry with him,because on one hand he says such stuff and on the other he nags about not having enough money to spend here or there or that we have to "prioritize" our defence projects.

On a small note,a bit relative to the thread:

There is rumor that we're probably going for Iron Dome and David's Sling or Spyder and David's Sling. Somehow,there is a rumor that the government wants to go with Israeli systems. Which makes you wonder,why not something European?

Atleast you people wants to see work, not words. Good for Greece.

Is it a good idea to go for Israeli goodies or any country goodies involve in active war? Don't you think right now their own demands are high and they were not able to fulfill new orders for atleast few years if not many?

Or is it another lollypop to people?

 

[Foinikas]

Well lets see, the ones sent to Ukraine were from French Stock itself which is why they likely had no limitation. But let see.. either way you would need more than 24. Thats likely not going to penetrate air defense extensively at a hardened facility. And wouldn't be a sustained fight.

There is no replacement for building your own turbofan engines and your own missiles, where you control your own eco system and can sustainably produce munitions while a conflict is ongoing in hardened facilities especially underground in mountain.

Turkey is quite mountainous, I hope they start building production facilities underground under heavy mountain rock like Iran is doing.

I don't think Turkey is looking for a fight but the neighborhood is getting quite chaotic, and they need to be prepared for any scenario.

I don't really see any conflict with Greece unless someone tries to change the status quo unilaterally. I don't like Mitsotakis but he is a lot more level headed than Dendias who seems to have a stick up his @$$ for Turkey for whatever reason. lol

View attachment 80926

Well,Mitsotakis disappointed and enraged a lot of people after his victory in the May 2023 elections. For many reasons. I wrote a big paragraph about it,but just deleted it as it was getting too long and off topic. But anyway,he disappointed and enraged a lot of people and that showed in the Europarliament elections and in recent polls where New Democracy's rates have fallen significantly,although still higher other parties.

As for Dendias,there's a theory some people talk about. That he was seeing himself as a future president of the Party,so they say he was getting too strong as a Minister of Foreign Affairs and he was switched to the Ministry of Defence,which has a of troubles and he shifted the previous Minister of Defence,Panagiotopoulos(who was one of the best Ministers of Defence we've ever had)to the Immigration Ministry which is a hot potato.

So according to what some people on the internet say(and some journalists)Dendias avoids to sign big defence deals as much as he can,so that he won't be accused of doing a bad job in the future. At the same time he talks about great and expensive systems that "we'll purchase" and the restructuring of the entire Armed Forces. About "co-designing" the Constellation class with the Americans and the creation of innovation centers to produce our own equipment.

Meanwhile,the Archytas UAV has still not come out in 3 years(maybe 4?)and we used to be a country that had great shipyards and ship-building skill and now you have people like MMM-E saying "Greece produce nothing". Imagine,we built our own UAVs before Turkey even bought UAVs for the first time. We had our own anti-tank weapon prototype,we bought plans for gunboats and FACs and built them in Greek shipyards. And now you have MMM-E going around "Greece produce nothing,we have 50,000,000 projects and 5 trillion billion money to spend in aircraft. Even Erdogan gave 5 trillion billion to poor people to play monopoly. You walk in Turkey and you find diamonds on the street and you don't pick them up. Only the large ones."

Anyway,Dendias was a relatively good Minister of Foreign Affairs. He used to reply to provocative statements by Turkish politicians. But you see how the situation is now.

 

[Foinikas]

Don't you think right now their own demands are high and they were not able to fulfill new orders for atleast few years if not many?

I know,although to be honest,most defence companies are full now,producing stuff. And all that aircraft MMM-E is dreaming of first needs to be signed,then wait in line,then start production,then send them to Turkey,train pilots,establish logistic chains,train the other pilots in Turkey and then put them in active service.

 

[MMM-E]

Meanwhile,the Archytas UAV has still not come out in 3 years(maybe 4?)and we used to be a country that had great shipyards and ship-building skill and now you have people like MMM-E saying "Greece produce nothing". Imagine,we built our own UAVs before Turkey even bought UAVs for the first time.

And now you have MMM-E going around "Greece produce nothing,we have 50,000,000 projects and 5 trillion billion money to spend in aircraft. Even Erdogan gave 5 trillion billion to poor people to play monopoly. You walk in Turkey and you find diamonds on the street and you don't pick them up. Only the large ones."

Enough with your silly posts
as like Greek Paper project HSC-1 Cruise Missile ?

Greece has zero technology ... and no any Greek weapon
Greece can not produce even a wheel

on the other hand
Turkiye has developed even Aircraft in 1936-1944 period
and now Turkiye has its own advanced defense industry with over 1.000 military projects

Turkiye is a big boy and in a different league
When the weapons you bought are destroyed in a few days, you will beg the USA and France to stop the war

but it will be too late

still dreaming with 4 FDI Frigates , and now DAVID SLING SPYDER AD Systems which will be destroyed in a day

 

[MMM-E]

And all that aircraft MMM-E is dreaming of first needs to be signed,then wait in line,then start production,then send them to Turkey,train pilots,establish logistic chains,train the other pilots in Turkey and then put them in active service.

Turkish Pilots already flying with Qatari Eurofighters
there are Qatari Fighter Jets in Turkiye

To address this a military agreement was signed between Turkiye and Qatar in 2021. According to this agreement, 36 Qatari fighter jets and 250 personnel were stationed in Turkiye under the jurisdiction of the Turkish General Staff.



also Turkiye and Qatar have formed a joint Squadron, which consist of Turkish F-16 fighter jets and Qatari Fighter Jets.

the Dukhan Air Base in Qatar.


As part of the joint Squadron, the Turkish Air Force conduct joint trainings with the Qatari Rafales, thus having the opportunity to learn everything about the French-made 4++ generation fighter aircraft, which the Hellenic Air Force also has in its arsenal.

Qatar - Turkey | Joint Air Force Squadron with F-16 and Rafale | DEFENCE ReDEFiNED | News on Defence, Security and International Relations

Turkey and Qatar have formed a joint Squadron, which will consist of Turkish F-16 fighter jets and Qatari Rafale fighter jets.

defenceredefined.com.cy

 

[SiliconBit (silicon0000)]

Guys this is not a battle ground. No need to fight here.
@MMM-E and @Foinikas better if you guys share your countries achievements and discussion points instead of attacking on other countries achievements and lacking.

 

[Foinikas]

Turkish Pilots already flying with Qatari Eurofighters
there are Qatari Fighter Jets in Turkiye

Yes as if that's the only problem in the deal...

To address this a military agreement was signed between Turkiye and Qatar in 2021. According to this agreement, 36 Qatari fighter jets and 250 personnel were stationed in Turkiye under the jurisdiction of the Turkish General Staff.

You've said that like 10 times already on the forum.

Rafales, thus having the opportunity to learn everything about the French-made 4++ generation fighter aircraft, which the Hellenic Air Force also has in its arsenal.

Yes,you've learned so much you ran to buy Eurofighters and F-16Vs,asking the Americans and Germans again and again and again.

 

[Foinikas]

Greece has zero technology ... and no any Greek weapon
Greece can not produce even a wheel

I've posted all about it in the old thread. If you don't want to admit it,that's your problem.

on the other hand
Turkiye has developed even Aircraft in 1936-1944 period
and now Turkiye has its own advanced defense industry with over 1.000 military projects

If I had one penny every time you repeated this fart of a sentence about Turkey "developing"....lol developing...aircraft back in 1936-1944....

Turkiye is a big boy and in a different league
When the weapons you bought are destroyed in a few days, you will beg the USA and France to stop the war

Big boy can't even solve the Kurdish issue.

 

[MMM-E]

"We are creating the most powerful Armed Forces in the (many) centuries-old history of our motherland"

We TURKS also creating the most powerful Armed Forces in the last 400 years history of our motherland

when all Turkish major military projects enter service in 2030s not only Greece but also whole region will face with our tremendous military power

from TAYFUN-CENK hypersonic Ballistic Missiles to MIRV - HGV
from GEZGIN long range strategic Cruise Missile to supersonic anti-ship Missile
from RAMJET SCRAMJET to anti-ship Ballistic Missile
from 230 m TCG ANADOLU to 285 m Aircraft Carrier
from TF-2000 class Destroyer to ISTIF class Frigate
from Type-214TN and MILDEN class AIP Submarines to STM-500 Submarine
from KAAN 5th gen Fighter Jet to 6th gen Fighter Jet
from KIZILELMA to ANKA-3/4 unmanned stealth Fighter Jets
from HAVASOJ to ASOJ-234U airborne stand off Jammers
from 700 km to 3.000 km Early Warning Radars
from Passive Radars to Quantum Radars to detect stealth Fighter Jets
from T-929 heavy Attack Helicopter to AKINCI strategic strike UCAV
from Space Radars to next gen Satellites
from SLV to anti-Satellite Weapon ( ASAT )
from STEEL DOME integrated AD System to Ballistic Missile Defense System
from unmanned Robotic Systems to AI supported war Machines
from C4ISR situational awareness with BVIA to artificial intelligence advanced Analytics (BDA) and hundreds of other weapons


And while your countries will remain dependent on the US and France,
Türkiye will not be dependent on anyone with its own advanced defense industry and Türkiye will become a real military power

 

[MMM-E]

Yes as if that's the only problem in the deal...

You also said same things about F-16V deal
Your MENENDES could not stop the TURKS
and with the initial payment completed, contracts for Türkiye’s procurement of the F-16 Block 70 have officially come into effect


Eurofighter also will join the Turkish Air Force

Big boy can't even solve the Kurdish issue.

There is no Kurdish issue and PKK terrorists were kicked out of Turkiye
also 4 Turkish military operations in Syria destroyed ROJAVA dream
also Turkish Army blocked Northen Iraq
also Turkiye helped Azerbaijan to liberate occupied lands
also Turkiye stoped thieves in the Eastern Mediterranean
also Turkish military bases in Libya , Qatar , Somalia

only big boys can do it ....

 

[hyperman]

Then why Greece only got the 250 km export version of SCALP Missile ?

USA sold even 900 km AGM-158 JASSM-ER Cruise Missile to Poland

The MTCR agreement has no legally binding provisions

Poland is part of MTCR

Legality and political will is different. we will see if France wants to sell them the same version as their own or the export version, its not definitive one way or the other.

 

[hyperman]

They sure were looking for a fight back in 2020-2022

Turkey is not looking for a fight, but they will not allow fiat accompli based on unilateral decisions from Greece. The Ball essentially is in Greece's court, Turkey doesn't want a confrontation and they would prefer the status quote and a negotiated solution and the status quo remaining in the meantime. However if Greece decides they are feeling confident to make "power moves" based on the assumption that their daddies will back them and their maximalism, Turkey will not back away and accept it. If people in Greece stick to what Tsipras or even Mitsotakis currently are doing, which is to negotiate and leave the status quo as is in the meantime, there will not be an issue from the Turkish side. If you want to listen to hawks and gamble, Its likely going to bring a confrontation.

 

[hyperman]

The government is saying a lot now. That's what pissed most defence/military fans online. The minister suddenly said "all the FDI HN will be able to carry MdCN" without giving any other information. That took the defence sites and reporters by storm. Then everyone started wondering: Will they reduce the number of Aster-30 from 32 to 24 just to put 8 MdCN? Will they install additional cells to carry MdCN? Then how many? 8 or 24? Is it worth it? Why not buy submarines that can carry it?

Then,in the interview the other day,he said the Hellenic Navy will be incredibly strengthened and it will acquire a first strike capability that it never had before in the history of Hellenism. And then he says he'll tell them in secret,meaning he can't reveal it publically. Then he says we are making an AA dome ....and that he will tell them with what,but again confidentially.

Then what's the news? That's why everybody calls him names online. He keeps mumbling about ecosystems and innovation and let me quote:

"We are creating the most powerful Armed Forces in the (many) centuries-old history of our motherland".

And people just get angry with him,because on one hand he says such stuff and on the other he nags about not having enough money to spend here or there or that we have to "prioritize" our defence projects.

On a small note,a bit relative to the thread:

There is rumor that we're probably going for Iron Dome and David's Sling or Spyder and David's Sling. Somehow,there is a rumor that the government wants to go with Israeli systems. Which makes you wonder,why not something European?

Why would you go for iron dome? its useless for a country like Greece, Iron dome works on rudimentary rockets and artillery and its good against nonstate actors in small areas, but pretty useless against a peer adversary or even a near peer adversary.