Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

That part about Trumps character, I know. But you have to remember there is strong Israeli lobby, Trump can't just go around taking credits without some concrete actions that will please the Israelis.
Yes, but there's notable differences this time:
  • In the past it was the US public that strongly supported Israel. This time Trump's MAGA base specifically wants him to not support Israel. That might change things
  • US does support Israel, yes, but they are also Fed up of Nethanyahoo as Israeli PM. As much as they wanna support Israel, they also want Nethanyahoo to finally fk-off. As he keeps using US compulsion to help Israel for his personal gains. If he does win, he will never leave.
US could have sent 2 B2 Bombers and finished off all Iranian sites in a single go, nobody would have known what hit them. But they have not done it despite Israel pleading for 6 months.

Nethanyahoo then jumped into the war, in hopes US will have to come help them. He has been desperately pounding Fordow Mountain with zero effect, pleading with the US to help him and since 5 days Trump is not listening to him. All the while Tel-Aviv is getting decimated. That never ever happened before. Now either US will do it. Or Trump might let him fail on purpose. Both possibilities are there this time.
 
Last edited:
Its has fatal flaw, We need to attack Cyprus ( which we should start to send warning about this to EU ) ,

And who said they are only using their own Air Base ?

Also, "keep firing small salvos every day for a few more weeks until Israel's air defences are significantly depleted"

Why fire small volleys everyday until AD are depleted. If depletion of AD is the goal, then send 100s of the old missiles within a day or two. Israel doesn't have many AD missiles, possibly not more than 500-600.
 
What China needs is a stable friend, not a regular threat to recover ports like Australia. If we build a good military base and the country repents of recovering land for some reason, will China send troops to fight or give up? Does the war belong to China's invasion of a country?
At present, China has not seen such a friend in the Middle East.

Many countries in Mideast have reservations about China more then China has reservations about them and even Russia has that reservations about China.

First of All the Chinese always follow the US sanctions they avoid doing business with you if you get sanctioned in order to avoid themselves sanctions.

The second issue is the Chinese will bolt out of there the second you get yourself into issues. They are very illusive.

A fine example is what happened in the Solomon Islands. We heard news of China trying to ethabalish military bases there plus the Solomon Islands president okayed the bases and the next thing that happened is 100s of US diplomats flying into the Solomon Islands to literally threaten the President of the Solomon Islands and where was China when all this happened no where to be found.

The next interview he had after these American diplomats threatened him was epic he started saying we don´t want anything that harms our brothers and neighbours etc etc and talking about pacifism and assuring everyone of no bases.

Another example China avoided to invest in Syria during Assad era aka an ally but since Sharaa came and the sanctions lifted China has arrived to Syria to invest and has already made some deals
 
Last edited:
Yes, but there's notable differences this time:
  • In the past it was the US public that strongly supported Israel. This time Trump's MAGA base specifically wants him to not support Israel. That might change things
  • US does support Israel, yes, but they are also Fed up of Nethanyahoo as Israeli PM. As much as they wanna support Israel, they also want Nethanyahoo to finally fk-off. As he keeps using US compulsion to help Israel for his personal gains. If he does win, he will never leave.
We have to consider that US could have sent 2 B2 Bombers and finished all Iranian sites in a single go, nobody would have knows what hit them. But they have not done all this time despite Israel pleading for 6 months. not even now as Tel-Aviv is getting decimated. That has never happened before. Nethanyahoo kept asking Trump to even lend him a B2, but he did not. then Nethanyahoo just jumped into the war in hopes US will do it. Now either US will do it. Or Trump might be so pi**ed off at Nathanyahoo that he might let him get screwed on purpose. Both possibilities are there this time, because of the circumstances.

I know about the MAGA base who don't want it, Tucker Carlson and Steve Bannon have been talking about it, but you have to remember about Israeli lobby. They can pressure Trump and other Republican congressmen and senators. They have very high leverage on them.

I also suspect Israel may have something in their hands about Trump-Epstein relationship. Mind you, many other big shots were also in the Epstein Islands, they may have something against them too.
 
War with Iran was planned long ago. It all started with indian assault on Pakistan. The idea was a weak tactically defeated Pakistan or at least an afraid Pakistan ( may be CIA should stop reading this forum for OSINT as here a certain chosen demographic due to their own prejudice think as if Pakistanis can't fight. They wrongly project their own insecurities. Once war starts, Pakistan can fight without mercy, with anger and energy like no other).

Anyway, since US has been actively planning this war since february as per reports, the idea was that somehow Pakistan can be coerced so that it may be used in two capacities:

1. As logistic and reconnaissance source when needed.

2. More importantly as a psychological warfare tool, where Iranian can be led to believe that their next door neighbor is about to be used to launch attacks or at least taken aboard for future high hitting never ending drone attacks. That's why Asim muneer was invited far before the war started and He unknowingly said yes, not realizing that his "well advertised dinner with Trump" will be latter used as part of behind the scenee threats to iran which will increased the perceived danger within iranian leadership. It will also set the stage to destroy Pakistan by later iranian open assitance to anti pakisan militants. That is is dumbest thinking by the US planner.

American and western planner don't understand the muslim Psyche and project their own life loving and becoming extremely fearful of war mind set (if its involves actual physical harm) as the basis of their plans. Muslim can die when need arises and with pride. They also failed to realize that the world is now changed. Countries are now capable of sustaining and entering the war with US. They will take the hit but fight back. Even under the extreme savagery like that of Gaza that US and Israel are jointly waging, the spirit of Muslim courage is without any rival.

US cannot coerce Pakistan. It can only threaten with Trade sanction which might hurt but Pakistan can take them. Especially since thanks to Israel Pakistan has now special place. The Gulf countries have seen what Israel does and with how much impunity. They will need Pakistan as backup more than ever, even if they become buddies with Israel.

Turkey too now knows, despite being a powerful nation, and being part of NATO, the jewish states fully controls US and Europe. No one can rise to the top or stay at the top without their funding and "media" projection in western nations. Israel is above NATO.

Since Middle east-africa, Middle east-asia economic corridor is so strategically important for all, Pakistan, China, Turkey and Iran and Israel is trying to takeover it (in effect snatching it), Turkey's future confrontation with Israel can happen. A joint strategic Partnership between to large muslim nation namely Pakistan and Turkey which is already taking shape and will emerge as soon as Pakistan break evens (import = export +investments somewhere between 2028-2030), Then Pakistan will be unstoppable, rising economically faster than anyone else in the region as Chinese industry begins its investments along with Gulf and Turkey itself. Pakistan can then openly declare this strategic partnership with Turkey that would include any Israeli nuclear threat to Turkey as an act of war against Pakistan (just like Saudi arabia ). Pakistan can be very assertive once this current economic hardship eases. it is easing as Tax collection strengthens and export rising reaching that breakeven point.

Relationship with china is very deep, so much so that even real time fiber-optic and satellite war situation is shared between Pakistan and China as well as satellite, reconnaissance and other data.

SO dinner with Asim muneer would be nothing more than a psychological ploy by Trump to made it look like Pakistan is part of his plans, when it can never be. its just a show to create hopefully future chaos whose time is passed. since now only regional alliances can survive.

Pakistan cannot destroy all its actual "real" relationship the one that works, just for another temporary "Muslim hate filled" driven western war. Due to economic decoupling jewish lobby will not have much money to influence the world or media very soon. Even Indian will not let them be the ruler they once were. Attempt to capture middle east as another cash and power source will not work either nor it can be economically controlled, like it did not work in south korea or Japan who took the investment but ended up having their own brands and industry and "non-jewish banking sector" that protects its own interests.

So Asim muneer not to lose latest US Cripto promises (that may help ease dollar shortages) or more importantly investment in rare earth minerals where China is reluctant due to security concern. But West is not reluctant since most bloch terror leader are being kept in the western nations or india ( to harm CPEC but that won't work since Iran will now use "Wisdom rather than jealousy and end indian led work there and in a year or two so will Taliban once they tast some Economic progress).

So Asim Muneer to save 5.5 billion trade with US, along with investment like this, had to follow through this pre-planned US trips. US wil use it as psychologically threat to Iran otherwise, why Trump who won't bother even visiting Pakistan (as was the tradition by US presidents) starts having dinner with Pakistan's army chief.
Its Trump's bad luck that their indian "dog" after a false flag in Kashmir tried to attack and win and war against Pakistan with aim to make us afraid. The result turned out to be opposite.

Pakistanis literally watched bombs dropped outside relatively close ranges and did not even bother to run away and not caring as well as offering prayers in defiance few hours latter in the same Mosques that india bombed for NO bloody reason.

Combined thousands of much hyped Brahmos, Top western Cruise missiles, advanced Israeli drones, did nothing but few hits as most were soft killed, captured intact, or hard killed. With Pakistanis traveling, enjoying their daily life as nothing is happening or making phone videos of drooping drones, or bombs, without even taking shelters and military fighting with extremely high moral.

So instead of weak Pakistan, a confident, courageus Pakistan turned up and now only way to make Pakistan " a great friend again", or "big beautiful friend again", now dinners are being used as psychologically messaging by a country whose few bunker buster may or may not destroy Fordow which won't make much difference since you can replace all of that, or by a country that has few interceptors left and can't go on and risk Iranian retaliation against its bases. US only options are and will be to either themself or using Israel attack Iranian cities similar to Gaza to black mail them , attack Kharg Island oil export facilitates to break Iran economically, along with trying to destroy Fordow. after Fordow destruction even fake one with some visible signs declare victory may be stating all goals met. IF bunker buster can't even destroy 90 meters deep mountain facility then it would be a great embarrassment as Pakistani mountains are "in Kilometers in height and there are so many of them.

Or if they are willing to take risk of American soldiers beign killed in gulf bases, keep on attacking Iranian infra-structure after Fordow. Nations rise from such bombings like vietname did, or we did are doing due to daily suicide bombings, terror attacks, lost of all investments and sanctions. Iran will survive rise again then every nation would want nuclear weapon especially as US influence decreases. .

Asim Muneer will come back and will at most refrain from actively arming Iran. He will however provide intelligence to Iran such as where Pakistan detecting Israeli fighter.

US is afraid even in the absence of Iranian air defenses, the B-2, that has low mono-static radar cross sections but huge bi-static and multi-static RCS due to nature of scattering physics for such high aspect ration aircraft ( Theories involving asymptotic approximation of Maxwell Equations such as Physical diffraction theory used to design such plans clearly tell us that and Even US has to obey Physics so no one can challenge that ) plus B-2's large sizer means low frequency radars with (two or more preferably and they are easy to built) can reasonably locate it. In fact with sensor fusion like we have in Pakistan this is one mechanism we are using to track stealth plans and it involves low or lower frequency radars. Unlike in the past when spatial resolution was horrible for such radars (instead of pin pointing exact location, detecting it but with large position uncertainty) modern sensor fusion allows detection and tracking of low observable aircraft reasonably accurately at much larger distances than ever before ( at which we are as good anyone else since fundamental mathematics is the same (e.g. Particle Filters or even random finite set based filtering )) Plus we have additional dual system from china integrated with ours as well. .

Once located, B-2 huge 4 engines no matter the altitude, are infra-red missile's magnets and easy to kill even if active radar jammers are somewhat successful. You can't get rid of infra-red signatures and modern sensors are very sensitive. Pakistan or even china can provide such near real-time dat Aircraft tracking data (using satellite communications of either countries and informing Iran how to tape into it).

Asim Muneer is probably being requested to refrain into entering this kind of arrangement including not warning Iran about impending attack but if China shows willingness to ensure IMF loan delivery like it did during our war with india (likely offering something in return to western nations) We can accept the loss of trade with US (though unlikely as it would mean loss of Pakistan forever for US too). We will find new markets for out taxtile. Otherwise, unstable Iran or puppet drive Iran will cause so much more loss not to mention Pakistan will lose all its credibility which took decades of harship to earn (E.g. Not abandoning Afghanistan even when being hit by daily US-India funded terror campaign from at one stage 26 indian consulate and CIA led afghan intelligence agency). We took the hit but did not allow these nations or their puppets to stay in power. We can do it again. But for that we need IMF loans guarnatee or GCC easing oil supply. which is a big question mark.

Regardless even if Asim Muneer promises Trump not provide intelligence to Iran, like afghan war Pakistan military will end up supporting Iran. Its a matter time.

Iran will also be provided Food security both by sharing our products as well as imports something that US and Israel likely weaponize against Iran (these monsters are doing to children in Gaza that daily, even building piers stating they are for food and then massacre them and now a days, shooting them when they come to get thier food distribution centers under greatest of desperation.).

So Iranian ports importing food are out of question. Russian can only provide limited help since Jewish Oligards and rich businessmens have their have huge power over there (many are putins personal friends ). Plus large nations like Iran need even in food items a lot more than what one country can provide. So Like Afghan who recived subsidized Pakistani agriculture products, Iran will be provided too. Asim Muneer no matter how much he is coerced, rest of the military or Pakistani nation won't let him plus he is not that stupid to go against whole of Pakistan, China nd Russia and he is himself quite reglious. So his whatever promises are to USA, they are empty promises like Pakistani generals made regarding AFghanistan. As a nation we never abandoned other muslim nations or allies in a total ruthless manner like Jordan king can do (though NOT jordian people though). We even went in and saved Sri lanka a quite anti muslim somwhat of an ally from almost cetain defeat when tamil tigers surrounded Columbo.

In this case, we have our extreme hate for Israel due to daily suffering of Palestian brothers and sisters, and what its doing now in Gaza and other muslim nations. So for Trump Asim munner nothing but just " a psychological Trump Card" which has No subtance but in Trump's delusional head, it is is one of many scare tactics which will never work.

In this war, most if not all shia-sunnies are fully with Iran. What Israel does to muslims civilian, our sisters, our babies as we are witinessing in Gaza, Israel is seen as nothing but pure source of evil that must be checked and stopped. That will happen as power shifts from west to east. Then NO one will be there to save Israel from "sea of muslims surrounding it". NO magical powers will happen for them like they did not during crusader period expulsion of them when they secretey joined christian mass murderers and slaghtered muslim civilians. Despite our problems here and there with Iran, Iran cannot be abandoned, and as death toll in Iran rises, love and support for Iran will grow so much that US or Israel cannot sustain this war for long not by counting on any muslim nation's open help certainly NOT in Iran's neighborhood. American struggling industries cannot re-supply them so much like they did before earlier muslim slaghter nor they can financialy pour that many resources or China will be so ahead, it will finish them off faster than they think displacing them to their little world. They know that and want to focus on that. Its now their existential war. They never thought it will come to this. But it has. China is far too big and far more capable than their earlier "made up" fake adversaries where Chosen ones on both sides "made cash" and attained power (soviet union was engineered by jewish led groups that's why most post soviet oligards had jewish ancestory).

This idea that differences between shia or sunni world means that we can tolerate death of our fellow muslims is Israel's delusional dream. We are all muslims after all plus as we see it, it again a group of rutheless baby murdering and never bloody ending their hate filled civilian killing mad maniac nations doing the same shit again. It has been nearly 300 years now. Even in Yemen most attacks were on civilians with no regard to women or chidren with absolute psychpathic hate filled attitude. It was NOT even in the news.

Sooner it later they will fall and they will fall to just as ruthless new world. Iran will survive and rise up again. This comes from a pure sunny muslim like me.
how one can write this much, without loosing sanity, is beyond me..

I have not written this much even for debt investment proposals!
 
Another consequence of this war is that no sane people will take USA words and their negations seriously anymore ...
US was in dialogue with Russia, right before one of the meetings Ukraine launched massive drone attack and destroyed a fleet of Russian bomber planes. US was in talks with Iran, right before a meeting Israel attacks Iran and takes out its military command. US talks mean unprovoked attack by its ally.

Every 10 years US and israel are in danger from a Muslim country/leader and regime change is the only solution to all the problems in the world. They are following a pattern and no country has responded to them with strength other than Iran.
 
Don’t use the capital letters again or your post will be deleted/warned no matter how important it is.

Please write like everyone else
Just checking if you still on top of things.... Cz it's been a looong month and half for pdf crew 😂 😂 😂
 
Interesting perspective on why China doesn’t intervene outside its immediate neighbourhood.

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.
 
The video in Kermansha showed Hermess drone flying over the recorder , if there was aManpad , they could hunt it down ....

The manpads should be given to the troops ...
hmmm ... I wonder where Iran suddenly got MANPADs from after so many days of no AD activity, only 2 countries come to mind who have openly supported Iran. Hopefully, after Iran has a win (insha Allah) Iran will not host Indians again, knowing wo sabotaged them vs who helped them when the time came.
 
The Chinese don’t actively get involved in anything. If they wanted to send a message, they could send a message by sending a large PLAAF contingent to Pakistan, 200-300 jets. There is no need to actively get involved or kenetic operations, just messaging.

That would get the Americans attention and change the strategic calculus for everyone.

It isn’t n a question of why should China or Russia help Iran. Iran has not earnt the trust or the faith of the Chinese at all with their double and triple dealing. We know this. It is a question of does it change the strategic nature significantly for the region that affects chinas long term strategic interests and therefore is there a reason to intervene to protect those interests.

This would mean Pakistan taking a stronger policy front on this issue than they want to at this stage so I don’t see it happening. Afghanistan would be the best for all parties for China to host their presence on to send a message but I don’t think the infrastructure exists there for the to do that and the taliban are currently too unpredictable anyway.

The question for Pakistan is if the recent uptick with thenUSA is long term sustainable with real tangible benefits or temporary as they need Pakistan out of the way for this war and the it will be back to the old norm between Pakistan and the USA.

Let’s be clear, Israel and India jointly coordinated the attack on Pakistan as part of the attack on Iran to tie down Pakistan. Given the Americans and NATO actions currently against Iran,, and Vance’s time in India, it is obvious that the USA and European countries were also in on this attack also on Pakistan. The bonhomie for Pakistan is only because in my view the Indians failed…

(Personally I am of the view that Pakistan should provide military intelligence of the movement of nato and USA assets in real time to Iran and leave it at that, ie no other involvement..). This would be tangible enough for Iran to appreciate but difficult (if the Iranians can track down their miles) to trace back to Pakistan.
Here is an idea Pakistan should provide Iran manpads or vital military equipment only small arms big enough to go through the oil pipeline that Iran had built , have it on the conveyer chain of some sort 🤫
 
If the new Iranian government comes, it will be entangled with insurgency. Do you think shias are just going to stay still and let zoroastrians rule over them? The biggest miscalculation the west is going to make that if they topple current regime, Iranians are going to be freed.
Its going to be 50 50 power struggle. The other half would want to restore previous government and the new government will struggle alot. We do not know how and in what way its going to effect pakistan. Maybe the shias may become the good tban for Pakistan and who knows. Maybe Iran may get split in two parts?
Actually several year ago in city of yazd they voted for a zoroastarian representative
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top