Iranian Missiles | News and Discussions

[Immortals]

Eqtedar CM is not subsonic, nor hypersonic. Translation of its persian equal could be supersonic. The launching speed of this missile showed that.

Supersonic has not been unveiled. I suspect it’s developed but still a strategic weapon that is kept under wraps till the right time.

Plus with Pizehkian as President, reformist typically don’t like controversial weapon systems being shown in their presidency that angers the west.

 

[Emirzad]

There is no evidence it is supersonic


I would like to see the Fattah-2 warhead on the Khorramshahr

The trajectory has a difference so unlikely.

What can actually happen is that we might see a larger Fattah/Kh-Shikan with longer MRBM ranges deploying the HGV at 2500+ KM. My own understanding is that if Fattah-1 is allowed to gain my altitude and undergoes less skips (compromising its burnout V) it can still hit the 1800-2000 KM mark easily, which is remarkable for such a small and accurate missile. But that's not its job.

I predicted this years back when Dezful was unvieled on the previous forum that somewhere around 2022-2025 Fateh-110 descended lighter Solid fueled MaRVed-BMs will take the role of the major MRBM/IRBM arsenal in Iranian possession replacing Sejjil which will turn into more powerful SLV. Seems like both things are kinda happening already.

All they need is to find a way to install Fattah-1/2 on F-4E/D.

 

[Emirzad]

Hoveyzeh

Soumar

Abu Mahdi

Paveh

Talayieh

And now “eghtedar”

Hoveyzeh (Project, limited production?)

Soumar (Project)

Meshkat (Project)

Abu Mahdi (produced and delivered)

Paveh (produced and delivered)

Talayieh (Project)

Eghtedar (Likely a decade old project "Moghtader" which was a mid-course datalink target upgrade Supersonic CM)

Out of the above list only Paveh and Abu Mehdi are really produced. rest were tech demonstrators.

 

[Immortals]

Will ‘missile transfer’ enable Russian shift on Iran’s nuclear program?

Once again, reports have emerged in western media that Iran has supplied missiles to Russia. US Secretary of State Antony Blinken on Sept. 9 stated that Tehran had delivered short-range tactical projectiles that are expected to soon be deployed on the battlefield in Ukraine. The statement was...

amwaj.media

Fairly good article highlighting some recent iranian-Russo developments

 

[Immortals]

Hoveyzeh (Project, limited production?)

Soumar (Project)

Meshkat (Project)

Abu Mahdi (produced and delivered)

Paveh (produced and delivered)

Talayieh (Project)

Eghtedar (Likely a decade old project "Moghtader" which was a mid-course datalink target upgrade Supersonic CM)

Out of the above list only Paveh and Abu Mehdi are really produced. rest were tech demonstrators.

Whichever one (can’t track all these names) was based on the original KH-55 had limited production due to

1) cost of replicating engine

2) struggles with matching the efficiency and capabilities of the original Russian microjet engine

Hence Iran returned back to Toloue-4 in the subsequent versions which while reduced capability somewhat it was more cost efficient. At least that was the open source analysis.

To my knowledge iran has yet to unveil a supersonic microjet engine.

 

[Immortals]

The trajectory has a difference so unlikely.

What can actually happen is that we might see a larger Fattah/Kh-Shikan with longer MRBM ranges deploying the HGV at 2500+ KM. My own understanding is that if Fattah-1 is allowed to gain my altitude and undergoes less skips (compromising its burnout V) it can still hit the 1800-2000 KM mark easily, which is remarkable for such a small and accurate missile. But that's not its job.

I predicted this years back when Dezful was unvieled on the previous forum that somewhere around 2022-2025 Fateh-110 descended lighter Solid fueled MaRVed-BMs will take the role of the major MRBM/IRBM arsenal in Iranian possession replacing Sejjil which will turn into more powerful SLV. Seems like both things are kinda happening already.

All they need is to find a way to install Fattah-1/2 on F-4E/D.

F-1 allows for 1-2 small kinetic energy maneuvers in space during mid course when BMs are most vulnerable to fixed trajectory tracking to SM-3/Arrow-3 interception.

F-2 went more true HGV.

Neither has yet moved to a true wedge shaped HGV (like Avanguard for example or Chinese Hypersonic project) due to difficulties in controlling a finless wedge at extreme speeds (Mach 12+) and the metallurgy required to not get crushed by forces of physics. A challenging effort that has kept many leading HGVs in design stage.

As for higher warhead the other user alluded to, the biggest problem with Iranian diameter engines is carrying massive payloads.

The high diameter engines tested at Shahrud and other facilities haven’t made their way into BMs. K-3/4 are finally using different Russian based engines instead of the traditional Fateh or Shahab based engines that make up most of Iran’s arsenal.

To my knowledge there are 4 engine families:

Fateh XL/LR family
Shahab family
Sejil family
Khorramshahr family

One reason NK was able to leapfrog on missile capability is Russia is sharing direct ToT on heavier engines while they are not forthcoming with Iran in that field. I question NK capability to mass produce its latest missiles due to is limited military budget and the high cost of massive MRBM/ICBM missiles with heavy payloads.

 

[Emirzad]

Whichever one (can’t track all these names) was based on the original KH-55 had limited production due to

1) cost of replicating engine

2) struggles with matching the efficiency and capabilities of the original Russian microjet engine

Hence Iran returned back to Toloue-4 in the subsequent versions which while reduced capability somewhat it was more cost efficient. At least that was the open source analysis.

To my knowledge iran has yet to unveil a supersonic microjet engine.

=> Meshkat / Soumar (replica of KH-55 Kent, 2500 KM)
=> Hoveyzeh (Tech demonstrator of Iranian Turbofan on KH-55 aerodynamics)
=> Taliyeh (Claims of Guidance upgrade with midcourse datalink, Tech demonstrator)
=> Paveh (1650 KM, INS+ Datalink/SAT+TERCOM/DSMAC, Full Production).
=> Abu-Mehdi is just Paveh's AShCM version with 1000 KM range, its range could be reduced due to sea-skimming drag and pop-up maneuvers that most AShCM have to pull for effective damage infliction. Also fully produced.

Iran has no supersonic CM in its posession, this Eqtedar (Moqtedar previously) could very well be the fastest Iranian CM with supersonic capability. Its canisters are pressured with gauges on them.

 

[Immortals]

=> Meshkat / Soumar (replica of KH-55 Kent, 2500 KM)
=> Hoveyzeh (Tech demonstrator of Iranian Turbofan on KH-55 aerodynamics)
=> Taliyeh (Claims of Guidance upgrade with midcourse datalink, Tech demonstrator)
=> Paveh (1650 KM, INS+ Datalink/SAT+TERCOM/DSMAC, Full Production).
=> Abu-Mehdi is just Paveh's AShCM version with 1000 KM range, its range could be reduced due to sea-skimming drag and pop-up maneuvers that most AShCM have to pull for effective damage infliction. Also fully produced.

Iran has no supersonic CM in its posession, this Eqtedar (Moqtedar previously) could very well be the fastest Iranian CM with supersonic capability. Its canisters are pressured with gauges on them.

The question is this supersonic in terminal. If so that doesn’t really represent a leap in capabilities as Iran already has CMs that go supersonic in terminal phase. It’s supersonic during full flight while maintaining long range that will be the real feat as even Brahmos family is still sub 1000KM no? It’s building a fuel efficient supersonic design that can go distance without dropping to 250KM (example) range.

The other question is why hasn’t Mobin (.1 m2 RCS ‘stealth’ cm) been approved for production? Why are we still using non RCS shaped designs? That alone would make Iranian subsonic CMs more deadly and increase survivability.

 

[Emirzad]

F-1 allows for 1-2 small kinetic energy maneuvers in space during mid course when BMs are most vulnerable to fixed trajectory tracking to SM-3/Arrow-3 interception.

F-2 went more true HGV.

Neither has yet moved to a true wedge shaped HGV (like Avanguard for example or Chinese Hypersonic project) due to difficulties in controlling a finless wedge at extreme speeds (Mach 12+) and the metallurgy required to not get crushed by forces of physics. A challenging effort that has kept many leading HGVs in design stage.

As for higher warhead the other user alluded to, the biggest problem with Iranian diameter engines is carrying massive payloads.

The high diameter engines tested at Shahrud and other facilities haven’t made their way into BMs. K-3/4 are finally using different Russian based engines instead of the traditional Fateh or Shahab based engines that make up most of Iran’s arsenal.

To my knowledge there are 4 engine families:

Fateh XL/LR family
Shahab family
Sejil family
Khorramshahr family

One reason NK was able to leapfrog on missile capability is Russia is sharing direct ToT on heavier engines while they are not forthcoming with Iran in that field. I question NK capability to mass produce its latest missiles due to is limited military budget and the high cost of massive MRBM/ICBM missiles with heavy payloads.

Not what I was saying. This was discussed back when Fattah-1 was unvieled that if we reduce the skipping maneuvers of Fattah-1/2 and let it touch higher apogee instead of quasi BM trajectory then based upon its high burnout velocity, the missile just as a MaRV-MRBM will touch roughly ~2200-2500 KM which itself is a marvel considering how small this weapon is and how dead accurate. This allows it to replace Sejjil-II, the current Iranian Solid fueled MRBM/IRBM with 2500+ KM range.

Now if we make a compromise between no. of skips and range then it will still be capable of hitting MRBM domain targets at high speed. with more skips/glides added it will have the KE to enter than hypersonic zone but range will be reduced to 1500 KM.

The point is, this weapon family of Kheybar Shikan/Fattah can be just dead accurate MaRV-MRBMs or can be HGV for speed but with shorter range. Fattah-2 HGV has been tested, someone please pull out some pics of the red-HGV test.

Sejjil family morphed into multistaged solid-fueled SLVs or potential ICBMs at the right time.

Liquid fueled family is a different story altogether.

 

[Emirzad]

The question is this supersonic in terminal. If so that doesn’t really represent a leap in capabilities as Iran already has CMs that go supersonic in terminal phase. It’s supersonic during full flight while maintaining long range that will be the real feat as even Brahmos family is still sub 1000KM no? It’s building a fuel efficient supersonic design that can go distance without dropping to 250KM (example) range.

If I remember correctly because this was IMF period, the Moghtedar project was mentioned as a supersonic CM with 700 KM range and midcourse datalink upgrade for targets. Did they mean its supersonic in the entire flight on average or just in terminal phase is not known?

Knowing Iranian habits, it might just be another tech demonstrator for supersonic version of Paveh which is the actual most produced LACM of Iran.

The other question is why hasn’t Mobin (.1 m2 RCS ‘stealth’ cm) been approved for production? Why are we still using non RCS shaped designs? That alone would make Iranian subsonic CMs more deadly and increase survivability.

Mobine is a stealth SOW and AFAIK a patent-protected private venture. My guess is that IRGC never saw its utility considering Shahed/Arash drones had more utility, ranges and were cheaper to produce.

Another reason could be that IRGC saw how Yemen theatre was going to be hot where low cost conventional CMs will be deployed more easily for which they already had large established production facilities while mobin is a more modern aerodynamic design yet to be adapted. All in all Mobin IMO is a product for IRIAF, for SU-35S, Kowsar, F-4E/D Dowran, and MALE UCAVS, an opportunity lost.

 

[Navigator]

=> Abu-Mehdi is just Paveh's AShCM version with 1000 KM range, its range could be reduced due to sea-skimming drag and pop-up maneuvers that most AShCM have to pull for effective damage infliction. Also fully produced.

Abu Mahdi it's variant of the cruise missile from Soumar\Hoveyzeh family, not Paveh.

 

[muhammed45]

There is no evidence it is supersonic


I would like to see the Fattah-2 warhead on the Khorramshahr

I remember one of IRGC generals pointed to it. Without any doubt it is a supersonic anti ship missile.

 

[Persian Gulf]

Hoveyzeh (Project, limited production?)

Soumar (Project)

Meshkat (Project)

Abu Mahdi (produced and delivered)

Paveh (produced and delivered)

Talayieh (Project)

Eghtedar (Likely a decade old project "Moghtader" which was a mid-course datalink target upgrade Supersonic CM)

Out of the above list only Paveh and Abu Mehdi are really produced. rest were tech demonstrators.

there is also Ya Ali and Qadr 747

 

[Persian Gulf]

The question is this supersonic in terminal. If so that doesn’t really represent a leap in capabilities as Iran already has CMs that go supersonic in terminal phase.

do we?

 

[Persian Gulf]

Now if we make a compromise between no. of skips and range then it will still be capable of hitting MRBM domain targets at high speed. with more skips/glides added it will have the KE to enter than hypersonic zone but range will be reduced to 1500 KM.

1500km range is more than enough

Fattah-2 HGV has been tested, someone please pull out some pics of the red-HGV test.

don't think so