J-31 to be inducted soon| Pilot training reportedly in progress

[Deino]

With the recent redevelopment, let's update the table.

Shenyang FC-31 Demonstrator

Built​	Type​	Serial​	Test Model​	First Taxi​	First Flight​
01​	Demonstrator	31001​	Flight​	??/09/2012​	31/10/2012
-​	Demonstrator (WS-21 Engine)	31001​	Flight​	-​	01/07/2016
02​	Demonstrator	?​	Static​	N/A​	N/A​
03​	Demonstrator	31003​	Flight​	18/12/2016​	23/12/2016​

J-31 Gyrfalcons

01​

Prototype

?​

Flight​

?​

??/??/2024

J-35

Built​	Type​	Serial​	Test Model​	First Taxi​	First Flight​
01​	Prototype	350001​	Flight​	?​	29/10/2021​
02​	Prototype	?​	Static (?)​	-​	-​
03​	Prototype	350003 / 3503​	Flight​	??/07/2022​	??/07/2022​
04​	Prototype	Most likely not allocated​	-​	-​	-​
05​	Prototype	3505​	Flight​	July/August 2023​	26/09/2023 (?)​
06​	Prototype	3506 (?) rumoured but unconfirmed​	Flight​	​	​

Per my info it is that way ..

 

[AJKashmir1]

PAF is only ruining it's own credibility and professionalism by making such huge claims so early, even before any deal has been finalised.

This is not a good sign.

 

[Pingle]

If the past is anything to go by, the first news we will hear about PAF J-31s is when they actually land at a Pakistani airbase to be greeted by senior leadership.

When that happens, 2026 or 2030 is anyone's guess really, none of us can be sure. We do know that China can work incredibly fast, that PAF projects with regards to fighter inductions are always kept under wraps, no years of "negotiations", "Cabinet clearances", "approvals" etc like who know who.

As someone pointed out, why would China, possibly at a big cost to itself, equip PAF with such a strategic game changing system? Well the benefits are many.

1) A stealth fighter will be a MAJOR headache for IAF. Especially if AMCA is 20 years away from service and F-35 is no go for India. PAF May be able to strike Indian targets with almost impunity.
2) Pakistan takes it's fighter purchases incredibly seriously. J-31 in PAF service sends a signal that China can and will export Stealth. This message will not be lost of the host of muslim countries denied F-35.
3) A PAF support infrastructure across various bases for J-10s and J-31s suits China just fine.
4) Effectively puts an end to any enduring relationship between the Pakistan Military and the US. By 2035, bar a few F-16s that are new, it is very likely no major US weapon system will be in Pakistani service. Again, this suits China just fine.

 

[FuturePAF]

If the past is anything to go by, the first news we will hear about PAF J-31s is when they actually land at a Pakistani airbase to be greeted by senior leadership.

When that happens, 2026 or 2030 is anyone's guess really, none of us can be sure. We do know that China can work incredibly fast, that PAF projects with regards to fighter inductions are always kept under wraps, no years of "negotiations", "Cabinet clearances", "approvals" etc like who know who.

As someone pointed out, why would China, possibly at a big cost to itself, equip PAF with such a strategic game changing system? Well the benefits are many.

1) A stealth fighter will be a MAJOR headache for IAF. Especially if AMCA is 20 years away from service and F-35 is no go for India. PAF May be able to strike Indian targets with almost impunity.
2) Pakistan takes it's fighter purchases incredibly seriously. J-31 in PAF service sends a signal that China can and will export Stealth. This message will not be lost of the host of muslim countries denied F-35.
3) A PAF support infrastructure across various bases for J-10s and J-31s suits China just fine.
4) Effectively puts an end to any enduring relationship between the Pakistan Military and the US. By 2035, bar a few F-16s that are new, it is very likely no major US weapon system will be in Pakistani service. Again, this suits China just fine.

There is always the bogging down of India.

China itself is dedicating J-20s (temporarily or permanently) to Shigatse, and they wouldn’t mind India diverting some of their frontline aircraft to the Pakistan border.

 

[Lulldapull]

There is always the bogging down of India.

China itself is dedicating J-20s (temporarily or permanently) to Shigatse, and they wouldn’t mind India diverting some of their frontline aircraft to the Pakistan border.

Yaar manned aviation on borrowed time anyway…….ye sub fuzool k shennanigans haingay……you know right?

Big capital warships are a huge liability now……aur tank/APC/ Eli-kaapturr sub junk ho gaey hain…..

The whole nature of warfare has dramatically changed with legacy weapons now exposed as junk.

We need better leadership and try acquiring AI controlled Irani kamikaze drones and hypersonic mayzile…..aur Irani hamain taqreeban muftay main day dain gay saari technology…..they owe us for the KRL centrifuges and what not.

Pata nahi kyun hum nay Turkish drones khareedi hain gee?…..do Minntt main they’d get shot down just like the MQ-9’s daily.

Bewquff leadership of ours not thinking right you know?

 

[AJKashmir1]

Yaar manned aviation on borrowed time anyway…….ye sub fuzool k shennanigans haingay……you know right?

Big capital warships are a huge liability now……aur tank/APC/ Eli-kaapturr sub junk ho gaey hain…..

The whole nature of warfare has dramatically changed with legacy weapons now exposed as junk.

We need better leadership and try acquiring AI controlled Irani kamikaze drones and hypersonic mayzile…..aur Irani hamain taqreeban muftay main day dain gay saari technology…..they owe us for the KRL centrifuges and what not.

Pata nahi kyun hum nay Turkish drones khareedi hain gee?…..do Minntt main they’d get shot down just like the MQ-9’s daily.

Bewquff leadership of ours not thinking right you know?

Kamikaze drones are the simplest thing and cheapest to make we don't need anyone's support for those

Plus I think we are working on hypersonic missiles likely too

But manned aviation is still around, it won't be a good few more decades till there's a comfort switch the mainstay unmanned AI jets

 

[Lulldapull]

Kamikaze drones are the simplest thing and cheapest to make we don't need anyone's support for those

Plus I think we are working on hypersonic missiles likely too

But manned aviation is still around, it won't be a good few more decades till there's a comfort switch the mainstay unmanned AI jets

Duss saal k ander main manned weapons nay obsolete ho jana hae……the way AI is progressing daily……

Hamaray bewquff jharrnail pata nahi kis dunya ich reh re hain?

You seein the way rhusshian pumping out those kaali shahed 136?

Laakhon manufacture ker re hain monthly.

So much easier just pushing button to launch 100 of them and target gone bhai!

No need to even have army you know…..

 

[Khansaheeb]

What exactly is your "backup" for thinking his claim is stupid?

Yes 2026 is a bit early but by 2027/2028 is defintely possible, as China is a mature 5th generation fighter plane developer with the successful incorporation of the WS-15 into the J-20 that has been in service for 7 years now.

It just needs to miniaturise the J-20 into the smaller J-35 and successfully develop the WS-19(they can always start off with WS-13A in initial planes as backup).

The plane was first shown to the public in 2012 and there have been numerous prototypes flying since then. China does not give a running commentary of new planes in development like the USA does.

Anyway China would want the J-31 to be ready at a similar time to when the Fujian carrier starts service in 2026-2027. They really don't want such an advanced carrier flying with J-15s on board for long if at all.

We know China and Pakistan were working on a 5th gen plane soon after JF17 was produced, so definitely possible and if we go by Chinese capabilities it maybe sooner.

 

[FuturePAF]

Yaar manned aviation on borrowed time anyway…….ye sub fuzool k shennanigans haingay……you know right?

Big capital warships are a huge liability now……aur tank/APC/ Eli-kaapturr sub junk ho gaey hain…..

The whole nature of warfare has dramatically changed with legacy weapons now exposed as junk.

We need better leadership and try acquiring AI controlled Irani kamikaze drones and hypersonic mayzile…..aur Irani hamain taqreeban muftay main day dain gay saari technology…..they owe us for the KRL centrifuges and what not.

Pata nahi kyun hum nay Turkish drones khareedi hain gee?…..do Minntt main they’d get shot down just like the MQ-9’s daily.

Bewquff leadership of ours not thinking right you know?

You are over estimating current drone technology and underestimating manned fighter technology. It doesn’t cost as much, especially in a country like Pakistan to train a pilot, while it costs a lot more to develop a modern AI system to securely and semi-autonomously guide a drone to a mission in a world of ever more effective jamming. Remember how Iran brought down a RQ-170 by spoofing it. The PAF seems to be cautiously entering the world of AI drones, with its Turkish drone acquisitions and building up that relationship to potentially acquire the Kizilelma. The PAF therefore knows it doesn’t have a first mover advantage and able to fund cutting edge tech, so it waiting to acquire or co-develop the right platforms for its needs. The PAF has a hedging strategy, and while there will be successes and failures along the way, it is a pragmatic approach to prepare for today and the future.

War between major militaries will still look closer to the Russo-Ukraine war that is currently on going, then wars between smaller powers like Azerbaijan and Armenia. Holding the high ground will be crucial, as we saw with the first gulf war. AirPower will be critical to success. Highly skilled and experienced pilots are still a valuable asset, in the air or on the ground controlling these drones. AI isn’t mature enough despite what we have seen with the autonomous USAF F-16 demonstrations recently.

On the ground, modern tanks are still necessary to hold the ground or maneuver forces with firepower and protection, but much more will have to be done to prepare the terrain to resist and enemy attack or carry out an attack into enemy territory.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

Supposedly---the J31 saw some changes starting 2018 and by 2021 a speculative version was ready---.

While posters were looking for the J-20's---the J31 was getting its systems working and functional.

After a massive amount of information on the F-35 was stolen around 2009---who stole the information or who got the information is anyone's guess but it has given the chinese enough time to develop and successfully built systems close to the workings of the F35's---.

Being a state funded project now---and with the technical resource available to china---endless funding and updated technology---this aircraft is way ahead of what the FC31 aircraft was---.

The minor differences in the aircraft physical design is just an advancement in structural design---.

This time---the posters have fooled themselves by ignoring the FC31 over the years---kept their focus on the J20's while forgetting where the J31 was headed---.

Many a times I had written in the past---china has shown the right---( J20 ) while it has been secretly or rather openly developing the J31 while no one was watching---.

The US would not admit to what they have lost in technology to espionage over the years---but if you can look at the list to spies in jail for selling or stealing precious information of the US stealth program---it will not be a surprise to see the J31 beat the F35 at its own game---.

Don't be surprised if you hear the news of the J31 going into production---.

 

[Deino]

....

Don't be surprised if you hear the news of the J31 going into production---.

Yes for sure it will, but only after the J-35 is in production and even this may not happen before 2026/27. So any such claims, the PAF might get its first serial aircraft in late 2026 are almost Indian-like claims, the Tejas Mk.2 will be superior to the F-16 Block 70 or J-10C!

...
In that case assuming a lot of the aerodynamics are similar to the J-35 then you could potentially speed up testing and evaluation to have PAF pilots undertaking training flights in Dec 2026 in parallel to ongoing R&D as was done in the case of JF-17. Although in that case there was a fairly large PAF contingent present both providing requirements and in some cases being assigned under Mr Yang’s various teams

Indeed, this would require a "a fairly large PAF contingent present both providing requirements and in some cases being assigned under Mr Yang’s various teams" at SAC!

The problem however - and IMO the point - is, in contrast to the JF-17's development, it was always a co-development product such posts were never made, there was never any rumour about a co-development, a Pakistani-cooperation at SAC.
The "J-31" was always portrayed as a privately-founded product (IMO also wrong, since in China no manufactor can invest Billions of $$$ do develop privately a high-end fighter product, this must always have been sanctioned by the PLA & the CMC).

As such - and again I'm pretty sure the usual suspects will explain it that way - to think there was since 2015/16 a secret cooperation agreement with Pakistan to bring the J-31 into action by late 2026 without any such rumour before is simply impossible.

But let's wait and see ... I'm pretty sure in November at Zhuhai we will learn more.

 

[S.Y.A]

Duss saal k ander main manned weapons nay obsolete ho jana hae……the way AI is progressing daily……

Hamaray bewquff jharrnail pata nahi kis dunya ich reh re hain?

You seein the way rhusshian pumping out those kaali shahed 136?

Laakhon manufacture ker re hain monthly.

So much easier just pushing button to launch 100 of them and target gone bhai!

No need to even have army you know…..

aap AI ki field main kaam kartay hain?

 

[Lulldapull]

aap AI ki field main kaam kartay hain?

nahi yaar!......just watching how legacy weapons are miserably failing on the modern battlefield.

Iss waqat I will downright refuse to sit in a tank and go charging at an enemy strong point.....I don't care how much money you willing to put on da table.

 

[S.Y.A]

nahi yaar!......just watching how legacy weapons are miserably failing on the modern battlefield.

Iss waqat I will downright refuse to sit in a tank and go charging at an enemy strong point.....I don't care how much money you willing to put on da table.

it is possible that the army has considered this possibility as well, and the tank will not be operating in an isolated environment. it is possible that the tank will be supported by drones of our own and low-level mobile air defense systems to counter any attack.

 

[SteppeWolff]

Yaar manned aviation on borrowed time anyway

It's here to stay for foreseeable future, 6th generation NGAD is a manned platform too supported intelligent by unmanned aircrafts, a man in the loop is necessary