J-31 to be inducted soon| Pilot training reportedly in progress

[kmc_chacko]

You are right here, but right now India has 5 different competing fighter projects. Turkey and SoKo are examples of how fast you can proceed bu just focusing on one project. If they can do it so can India. issue is resources being stretched in many directions and of course project management by HAL (Or the 4th branch of Pakistan's military as many are nicknaming it!)

In comparison size-wise IAF is equal to combined AF of Turkey & SoKo and requirements also differs Turkey uses only single engine and primarily F-16s where as SoKo uses F-16s & F-15s and its variants.

You are also comparing Western AF which depends on single Multirole Fighters (French has Rafael, UK-Germany has EF) with Eastern AF wherein Russia/China/India have more than 4 types of aircrafts & projects.

In next 20 years IAF needs to replace 350+ Mig-21, 23, 27 & 29 & Jaguar and present projects like Tejas Mk1 & MK2, ORCA will eventually not only replace them 1 to 1 but also reduce no of types of fighters and boost indigenization also

 

[Yasser76]

In comparison size-wise IAF is equal to combined AF of Turkey & SoKo and requirements also differs Turkey uses only single engine and primarily F-16s where as SoKo uses F-16s & F-15s and its variants.

You are also comparing Western AF which depends on single Multirole Fighters (French has Rafael, UK-Germany has EF) with Eastern AF wherein Russia/China/India have more than 4 types of aircrafts & projects.

In next 20 years IAF needs to replace 350+ Mig-21, 23, 27 & 29 & Jaguar and present projects like Tejas Mk1 & MK2, ORCA will eventually not only replace them 1 to 1 but also reduce no of types of fighters and boost indigenization also

That is not the point, even the US and China, which eclipse India do not have as many ongoing projects in development combined!

China

FC-31/J-35
6th Gen

US

NGAD - USAF
NGAD - USN

India

Tejas Mk1/Mk1A
Tejas MK2
ORCA
TEDBF
AMCA


Every country has a finite amount of resources and even Japan/UK/Italy need to combined resources for 1 single fighter. India attempting 5 on it's own is madness.

 

[Michael]

I think China will have a nice "surprise" for the USA by having a mixed airwing of J-35s and J-15s on the Type-003 carrier when it is commissioned in 2026.

Oh, no

The Fujian aircraft carrier did not enter combat duty state so quickly.

This is the first time that China has equipped a catapult type aircraft carrier. After it officially enters the PLA Navy sequence, it will undergo a long period of high-intensity training. The first batch of soldiers will establish a new training outline and operation process based on training feedback, while training the second batch of soldiers.

After the completion of the second batch of military training and a period of practical operation on the Fujian aircraft carrier, the Fujian aircraft carrier will officially enter the combat duty queue.

At this time, the world will see the complete Fujian aircraft carrier battle group. That must be after 2026

 

[Deino]

I'm not sure how other countries do it.

PLA has no shortage of troops. In China, serving in the military is a very honorable thing, and your family will also enjoy many special treatments because of it. Many young people want to join the military. PLA currently selects the best young people to become warriors.

So, the rule of PLA is: 'Only personnel can wait for equipment, equipment is prohibited from waiting for personnel'

PLA Navy ordinary soldiers participate in the J35 maintenance competition, indicating that the PLA Navy has completed the training of multiple maintenance teams. The purpose of the competition is to screen and inspect. They are about to start maintenance work on J35.

The pilot's appearance in the camera is not accidental, indicating that the J35 pilot is ready.

So, J35 is coming soon ..........This is really 'coming soon..........'

But is it truly a "J35 maintenance competition" or not just a "maintenance competition" and these guys are carrying a J-35-patch in "eager anticipation" - or maybe even to fool the OSINT-community like us? - for their new toy?

My general stance since years is to be careful and not to be over-enthusiastic on reading too much into any image or like hear patch on the arms of soldiers.

But just we are on it ... how likely is it that we will be surprised by an appearance of a J-35 - or even the not yet confirmed true J-31/FC-31 - at the Zhuhai Airshow in November?

 

[CombatCorner]

Over the past 70 years, there have been several episodes between the two countries.

PAF had the advantage until 1960's, 1970's - balance was achieved, 1980's - PAF gained the advantage by having F16 fighters, 1990's - IAF gained the advantage with BVR until PAF received block 52 of F 16's.

There was a balance state until the burst was introduced and the PAF followed, but Rafale still has advantages-

When J31 is inducted by PAF - it will have an advantage over IAF - but when it will be inducted and when to counter-banalaced by IAF is the question now.

Still not sure - how he calculated 14 years

You really need to read into history to understand that what effect the PAF acquirment of F-16s had on Indian psyche.
Mrs Gandhi virtually went berserk at Washington. By IAF'S own admission, PAF'S 40 F-16s forced New Delhi to purchase over 200 various fighter aircraft. Rafale I'm sure is an excellent aircraft but it's purchase didn't exactly forced PAF to run around , instead it calmly inducted the J-10s and armed with PL-15 Missiles, PAF is satisfied that if any imbalance existed then it has been restored.
Not sure either what he meant by 14 years.

 

[Yasser76]

You really need to read into history to understand that what effect the PAF acquirment of F-16s had on Indian psyche.
Mrs Gandhi virtually went berserk at Washington. By IAF'S own admission, PAF'S 40 F-16s forced New Delhi to purchase over 200 various fighter aircraft. Rafale I'm sure is an excellent aircraft but it's purchase didn't exactly forced PAF to run around , instead it calmly inducted the J-10s and armed with PL-15 Missiles, PAF is satisfied that if any imbalance existed then it has been restored.
Not sure either what he meant by 14 years.

So true. For 40 years almost everyone in India knew what an F-16 was.

Almost no one in Pakistan could name an Indian fighter type bar generic "MIG" term.

 

[Michael]

But is it truly a "J35 maintenance competition" or not just a "maintenance competition" and these guys are carrying a J-35-patch in "eager anticipation" - or maybe even to fool the OSINT-community like us? - for their new toy?

My general stance since years is to be careful and not to be over-enthusiastic on reading too much into any image or like hear patch on the arms of soldiers.

But just we are on it ... how likely is it that we will be surprised by an appearance of a J-35 - or even the not yet confirmed true J-31/FC-31 - at the Zhuhai Airshow in November?

Usually, when we judge PLA messages:

If the information comes from frontline officers and soldiers of the PLA, then the information is very reliable

If the information comes from retired PLA officers or non frontline PLA officers and soldiers (such as military academy professors, political work officers, civilian officers, etc.), then the information usually needs to be suspected, with a credibility of about 50%

If the informant uses some vague words, it is usually not trustworthy

If the news is hidden in PLA life reports, then it is usually absolutely true

So, you can judge for yourself

The training task for PLA frontline officers and soldiers is very heavy, and there is not much time or mood to do such 'fake news'. Fake news "is usually done by some" military experts "and" military academy professors ".

 

[Deino]

Usually, when we judge PLA messages:

If the information comes from frontline officers and soldiers of the PLA, then the information is very reliable

If the information comes from retired PLA officers or non frontline PLA officers and soldiers (such as military academy professors, political work officers, civilian officers, etc.), then the information usually needs to be suspected, with a credibility of about 50%

If the informant uses some vague words, it is usually not trustworthy

If the news is hidden in PLA life reports, then it is usually absolutely true

So, you can judge for yourself

The training task for PLA frontline officers and soldiers is very heavy, and there is not much time or mood to do such 'fake news'. Fake news "is usually done by some" military experts "and" military academy professors ".

Thanks again ... highly apprechiated all your explanations!

But again: since we are on it ... how likely is it that we will be surprised by an appearance of a J-35 - or even the not yet confirmed true J-31/FC-31 - at the Zhuhai Airshow in November?

 

[lightning f57]

I wonder, when considering the J31 and J35 are they different aircraft and their timelines would need to be treated as such?

If so its valid to ask, even if we assume Pak has the money why would the PLA prioritise the J31 for Pak over the J35 for its carriers? Unless they also plan on having J31s in numbers and are comfortable with the J35s coming later.

Or maybe both are in development together in parallel to leverage resources.

Just too many unknowns and logical inconsistencies for me to accept the J31 coming to the PAF within next 2 years.

Ofcourse id be happily proven wrong

 

[Michael]

Speaking of this issue, it is necessary to kindly remind:

Regarding this: Retired Chinese Rear Admiral Zhang Zhaozhong

He often appears in various Chinese military programs, and his views require a very high level of intelligence to understand

If your military intelligence is not sufficient, please do not watch his videos easily.

 

[lightning f57]

Seriously why would India go for F21

 

[Michael]

Thanks again ... highly apprechiated all your explanations!

But again: since we are on it ... how likely is it that we will be surprised by an appearance of a J-35 - or even the not yet confirmed true J-31/FC-31 - at the Zhuhai Airshow in November?

I can only say that in my personal opinion, the possibility of J35 appearing at the Zhuhai Airshow is zero. Mature FC31 may appear(The model is not included)--------- I hope I made a mistake in my judgment!

 

[Michael]

I wonder, when considering the J31 and J35 are they different aircraft and their timelines would need to be treated as such?

If so its valid to ask, even if we assume Pak has the money why would the PLA prioritise the J31 for Pak over the J35 for its carriers? Unless they also plan on having J31s in numbers and are comfortable with the J35s coming later.

Or maybe both are in development together in parallel to leverage resources.

Just too many unknowns and logical inconsistencies for me to accept the J31 coming to the PAF within next 2 years.

Ofcourse id be happily proven wrong

There is a significant difference in the body between J31 and J35. J35 has made many adjustments to the characteristics of carrier based aircraft.

There is currently no official news indicating that PLAAF will purchase J31. If PLAAF really does not purchase J31, J31 will be a pure export model and its internal electronic system will not be the same.

PAF funds are absolutely sufficient, and PLAAF has officially decided to purchase J31. If these two conditions are met simultaneously, I believe SAC has the absolute ability to deliver to PAF next year.

At present, the only publicly available client is the PLA Navy, and SAC will definitely prioritize the production of J35 as soon as possible. After all, the Fujian aircraft carrier has undergone multiple sea trials and urgently needs J35.

According to my friend's information about the production situation of WS19, the current production capacity can only meet J35............

 

[Taimoor]

P

Biggest problem of india is - Hal timeline.

They never able to achieved their targets.

The same company is doing preety well in helicopter manufacturing but with fighter planes - schedule is a biggest problem.

The biggest problem is not India or any Indian institution but the options available to India to buy 5th gen off shelf. Lets be very clear here, India is NOT making any fifth gen on its own. There is a reason why only three nations build 5th gen and they have huge industrial and technological base to achieve that.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

I don't want to discuss this issue in a public forum like a PDF, nor will I provide relevant data. I have no intention of hurting the feelings of our Pakistani brothers.

In fact, the current debt of the Pakistani government far exceeds its repayment ability. Pakistan has not yet defaulted because of the support from friendly countries like China, Saudi Arabia, and the UAE.

As I have mentioned before, I am not sure whether the Pakistani military operates independently of the government. If it operates independently and has its own funding channels, then the procurement of the FC31 would be unrelated to the government’s financial situation. Otherwise, it would inevitably be affected by the government’s financial crisis.

However, the current Pakistani government's fluctuating stance, especially its military cooperation agreement with the United States, has angered the Chinese government. The current level of media openness in China is quite high, and the signing of the military cooperation agreement between Pakistan and the US (including the current Pakistani government's indifference towards CPEC) has led Chinese citizens to question the Chinese government's aid to Pakistan. Based on public opinion, the Chinese government has had to readjust its strategic deployment regarding Pakistan.

Thus, we see that the Chinese government has already made many changes regarding Pakistan. The Chinese government is now focusing more on Central Asia and Southeast Asia rather than Pakistan. This is not good news for Pakistan.

We do not know the method by which the Pakistani military procures Chinese weapons. Both China and Pakistan do not disclose contract details. What we do know is that Pakistan has purchased many Chinese weapons, owes China a lot of money, and currently cannot repay these debts.....................Any business dealings with Chinese people, as long as they are cash transactions in real-time, Chinese people will deliver products at an unimaginable speed. But if it's not a cash transaction in real-time, the delivery speed will not be very fast. This principle applies at all times, whether it is with the government or the private sector, whether it is civilian goods or military trade.

The Chinese government has no intention of interfering in any country's policies, but it is unacceptable for China to provide aid on one hand while being courted by China's imagined enemy on the other. If the current Pakistani government could adjust some policy directions, many issues could be resolved easily. Otherwise, the relationship between the two sides will undergo many subtle changes.............

That's all I can say.

It's the economy, stupid - President Bill Clinton

Pakistan is run by her Deep State, which maintains her very own deep financing sources that are kept out of the watchdogs, especially the international ones. According to some media reports, its "black economy" is worth around a half a trillion $s. Former Pak PM IK has publicly stated that he'd be able to replicate the rule of Sher Shah Suri (a legendary Hindustani Emperor from the 16th century) had he had the access to those resources under the control of her Deep State....

The moment Pak gets out of the IMF program, which is a principal tool of the Imperialists, she's dead. There's a price to pay for being the sole Muslim country with nukes....