J-31 to be inducted soon

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

These guys seem to be in more rush than us.

 

[PakAl]

These guys seem to be in more rush than us.

Karachi looks beautiful

 

[Asfandyar Bhittani]

These guys seem to be in more rush than us.

 

[j_hungary]

Most countries in the world will not import a weapon platform until the entire supply/support chain were mature. That's the reason why it's 17 years since the induction of F-35 Lighting II and not one single country outside the US has any serious adaption of the platform, even tier 1 partner didn't have more than 40 platform.

That's because it takes time to build accommodation to these aircraft, it takes time to build logistic hub to supply these aircraft, it takes time to train both pilot and service crew. It takes time to just about doing anything at all.

It would have been at least decade for anyone, not just Pakistan to adopt J-31/J-35, I mean you don't just buy those platforms and for China to drop it off like an amazon delivery and without any service support. I mean you are buying a bunch of fighter jets, not tissue paper.

 

[UKBengali]

Most countries in the world will not import a weapon platform until the entire supply/support chain were mature. That's the reason why it's 17 years since the induction of F-35 Lighting II and not one single country outside the US has any serious adaption of the platform, even tier 1 partner didn't have more than 40 platform.

That's because it takes time to build accommodation to these aircraft, it takes time to build logistic hub to supply these aircraft, it takes time to train both pilot and service crew. It takes time to just about doing anything at all.

It would have been at least decade for anyone, not just Pakistan to adopt J-31/J-35, I mean you don't just buy those platforms and for China to drop it off like an amazon delivery and without any service support. I mean you are buying a bunch of fighter jets, not tissue paper.

F-35 went into service with USA in 2016 and the Zionist entity actually inducted in the following year in 2017 - fully paid for by the US taxpayer of course!

The "serious adaptation" is more to do with finances and production capability than anything else. If UK actually had some money it would be flying something like 150 F-35Bs off its two large aircraft carriers but it is broke.

No your decade estimate is way off and does not tally with what has happened in the past and we all know that China would prioritise deliveries to PAF before any other country,

 

[PakAl]

Most countries in the world will not import a weapon platform until the entire supply/support chain were mature. That's the reason why it's 17 years since the induction of F-35 Lighting II and not one single country outside the US has any serious adaption of the platform, even tier 1 partner didn't have more than 40 platform.

That's because it takes time to build accommodation to these aircraft, it takes time to build logistic hub to supply these aircraft, it takes time to train both pilot and service crew. It takes time to just about doing anything at all.

It would have been at least decade for anyone, not just Pakistan to adopt J-31/J-35, I mean you don't just buy those platforms and for China to drop it off like an amazon delivery and without any service support. I mean you are buying a bunch of fighter jets, not tissue paper.

That is why alot of members are saying Pakistan will buy it around 2035s time, J35/J31 is not even inducted, if in a few years China inducted it then Pakistan will consider it based on its performance which will easily push it towards 2032/2035 timeline unless an emergency delivery is required due to war.

 

[j_hungary]

F-35 went into service with USA in 2016 and the Zionist entity actually inducted in the following year in 2017 - fully paid for by the US taxpayer of course!

The "serious adaptation" is more to do with finances and production capability than anything else. If UK actually had some money it would be flying something like 150 F-35Bs off its two large aircraft carriers but it is broke.

No your decade estimate is way off and does not tally with what has happened in the past and we all know that China would prioriotise deliveries to PAF before any other country,

First F-35 flew in 2006, that's 17 years til today.

Any country having less than 40 platform is seen as on IOC stage, and this wouldn't be count as a full deployment. In fact, only one country in the world other than the US have more than 40 F-35, and that's Australia. With 65 platforms.

US had been in IOC stage since 2015, and was just exiting that stage last year with the initial batch production, it take times to even written the manual on the F-35 maintenance, it take just more than money to field the platform.

Of course China can dump 200 J-31 to Pakistan as soon as they can make it without training your ground crew or pilot or even have made enough spare parts and engine so you can do proper maintenance, do you want that is another issue.

 

[j_hungary]

That is why alot of members are saying Pakistan will buy it around 2035s time, J35/J31 is not even inducted, if in a few years China inducted it then Pakistan will consider it based on its performance which will easily push it towards 2032/2035 timeline unless an emergency delivery is required due to war.

I will say 2035 is probably a more optimistic view.

How long does it take depends on a lot of different factors. It depends firstly and most foremost whether or not Pakistan has any money to field any of the jet. J-35 would be cheaper than F-35 but they are by no mean cheap, you are talking about 50-65 mil per at least. Very much doubt would China offer a loan for Pakistan to field any meaningful number of J-35, I mean you probably talking about 20-30 billion for a full package of 100 airframe with weapon, training and parts

Then it come to how much China themselves want to invest in the platform, if they are just making it for their Navy, it won't field that many, and unless it also rolled open international market, they may not be inclined to even make those platforms for export. Bear in mind, by 2035, most countries in the world would already had moved on to 5th gen. I mean, the market for 5th gen fighter won't be as big as they are now, probably only the Global south or African nation are left off, all other either have already adopted 5th gen platform by 2035 or have their own jet on the pipeline.

I mean, they may still make it and sell it to Pakistan, but it won't be in any euthanistic way unless they also have a lot of order from other country.

 

[MastanKhan]

Most countries in the world will not import a weapon platform until the entire supply/support chain were mature. That's the reason why it's 17 years since the induction of F-35 Lighting II and not one single country outside the US has any serious adaption of the platform, even tier 1 partner didn't have more than 40 platform.

That's because it takes time to build accommodation to these aircraft, it takes time to build logistic hub to supply these aircraft, it takes time to train both pilot and service crew. It takes time to just about doing anything at all.

It would have been at least decade for anyone, not just Pakistan to adopt J-31/J-35, I mean you don't just buy those platforms and for China to drop it off like an amazon delivery and without any service support. I mean you are buying a bunch of fighter jets, not tissue paper.

Hi,

17 years ago---the F35 was not available to all these countries that have them now---and adapting to a 5th gen aircraft is in a totally different league of operation---.

Tier 1 partners did not need this aircraft---who are they going to fight with.

The maintenace cost of this aircraft is outrageous for those who were used to flying migs till yesterday---.

You should not consider the time period when this aircraft was not available to the "partner" nations---.

But it is totally different between pakistan and china---.

China produces everything for the J31-35--so supply line is not an issue---. Pakistan finds it to be a necessity to have this aircraft---so integration / adaptation will happen just like any other aircraft---.

 

[j_hungary]

Hi,

17 years ago---the F35 was not available to all these countries that have them now---and adapting to a 5th gen aircraft is in a totally different league of operation---.

Tier 1 partners did not need this aircraft---who are they going to fight with.

The maintenace cost of this aircraft is outrageous for those who were used to flying migs till yesterday---.

You should not consider the time period when this aircraft was not available to the "partner" nations---.

But it is totally different between pakistan and china---.

China produces everything for the J31-35--so supply line is not an issue---. Pakistan finds it to be a necessity to have this aircraft---so integration / adaptation will happen just like any other aircraft---.

Well, a lot of partner nation have day 1 access to F-35 (The UK, The Aussie, The Israeli, The Norwegian and the Dutch). Well, yes, those aircraft were stationed in the US, but those are specifically for training and familiarisation for partner nation and all those are reverted back to their respective nation once enough platform were made.

The problem is, you can't migrate into a new platform without knowing how you are going to deal with that, it doesn't matter if we are talking about J-35 or F-35 or death star, it doesn't really matter. No country in the world would want to just have the platform now and figuring out all the kinks later that's not about the military aspect, but rather the commercial aspect.

Would China make an exception for Pakistan? Maybe, but you can't simply count on that especially when Pakistan is not a developmental partner like they did with JF-17.

 

[PakAl]

Well, a lot of partner nation have day 1 access to F-35 (The UK, The Aussie, The Israeli, The Norwegian and the Dutch). Well, yes, those aircraft were stationed in the US, but those are specifically for training and familiarisation for partner nation and all those are reverted back to their respective nation once enough platform were made.

The problem is, you can't migrate into a new platform without knowing how you are going to deal with that, it doesn't matter if we are talking about J-35 or F-35 or death star, it doesn't really matter. No country in the world would want to just have the platform now and figuring out all the kinks later that's not about the military aspect, but rather the commercial aspect.

Would China make an exception for Pakistan? Maybe, but you can't simply count on that especially when Pakistan is not a developmental partner like they did with JF-17.

If Pakistan is interested in J35s then it's possible paf pilots are already training on the plane, giving constructive feedback to China, our relationship are very close. Pakistan did not purchase Chinese z10 helicopters but 3 were given to Pakistan for training and giving feedback, just shows how close our militaries are. But from the historical purchase prospective, Pakistan was interested in 2006 to buy J10s but waited another 15odd years to buy it, so that the technologies are mature, we ended up buying J10C than J10As. It would be better for Pakistan to wait till J35/J31 is mature, and possibly buy the upgraded plane around 2035 time, our airforce today is strong enough to deal with Iaf. We have Jf17s, F16s, J10Cs, a lethal airforce.

 

[UKBengali]

If Pakistan is interested in J35s then it's possible paf pilots are already training on the plane, giving constructive feedback to China, our relationship are very close. Pakistan did not purchase Chinese z10 helicopters but 3 were given to Pakistan for training and giving feedback, just shows how close our militaries are. But from the historical purchase prospective, Pakistan was interested in 2006 to buy J10s but waited another 15odd years to buy it, so that the technologies are mature, we ended up buying J10C than J10As. It would be better for Pakistan to wait till J35/J31 is mature, and possibly buy the upgraded plane around 2035 time, our airforce today is strong enough to deal with Iaf. We have Jf17s, F16s, J10Cs, a lethal airforce.

The two situations are completely different.

In 2006, there was no indigenous engine for the J-10A and its avionics, radar and missiles were lacking compared to the F-16Cs that were available from the USA.

In 2024, whatever is designed for the J-31 is absolutely cutting-edge and so there is no need to wait to allow it to "mature".

 

[MastanKhan]

Well, a lot of partner nation have day 1 access to F-35 (The UK, The Aussie, The Israeli, The Norwegian and the Dutch). Well, yes, those aircraft were stationed in the US, but those are specifically for training and familiarisation for partner nation and all those are reverted back to their respective nation once enough platform were made.

The problem is, you can't migrate into a new platform without knowing how you are going to deal with that, it doesn't matter if we are talking about J-35 or F-35 or death star, it doesn't really matter. No country in the world would want to just have the platform now and figuring out all the kinks later that's not about the military aspect, but rather the commercial aspect.

Would China make an exception for Pakistan? Maybe, but you can't simply count on that especially when Pakistan is not a developmental partner like they did with JF-17.

Hi,

That is a basic part of procurement---. Pakistan will not accept the aircraft unless it is capable of managing and maintaining the aircraft---. Paf has never done that before and now is not the time to start doing it---.

The part that is not known is that for how long Paf been involved with this machine---.

Oh yes---china has always made exception when it comes to pakistan---and it will keep doing so---.

 

[silicon0000]

Shenyang Aircraft Corporation Unveils Details of New Chinese J-31B Fifth-Generation Fighter.​

Shenyang Aircraft Corporation Unveils Details of New Chinese J-31B Fifth-Generation Fighter

Shenyang Aircraft Corporation Unveils Details of New Chinese J-31B Fifth-Generation Fighter

armyrecognition.com

 

[PakAl]

In 2024, whatever is designed for the J-31 is absolutely cutting-edge and so there is no need to wait to allow it to "mature".

We don't know what is the final design and spec of the j31 to speculate if its cutting edge or not, also the ws19 engine for it is not ready, in a decade time the plane will be upgraded even more, 5.5++ generation j31 with high possibility of ws19 being ready. Sounds perfect.