JF-17 - Updates, News & Discussion

[RajaBaja]

I dont know much about the radars and jets in that detail but certainly know that rafale will eat up even a jf17 blck3....a j10ce and jf17 are quite different in capabilites if you compare them side by side and there is no way we are gonna be producing jf17 radars with gallium nitride in near future....

1) Rafale was built as a superior platform than the JF-17, no questions. But PL-15 eliminated that difference in individual capability. In WVR, Rafale will destroy the JF-17. But dog fight days are gone. Nowhere in my post I compared a platform to another. It was just a Radar related comparison discussion. With a higher powered engine, the JF-17 will use it's radar optimally. Due to better chips, it will equate the Rafale's radar range. Not beat the Rafale in everything else.

Example: How many Pentiums will you need to make a Core I-7, 8 core processor? What's faster?

2) Pakistan has already finalized the Radar for PFX. It will be JF-17's enhanced Radar at the same level as J-10C's built in Kamra. Some details are already out. More will come, give it time.

 

[kimjongun]

1) Rafale was built as a superior platform than the JF-17, no questions. But PL-15 eliminated that difference in individual capability. In WVR, Rafale will destroy the JF-17. But dog fight days are gone. Nowhere in my post I compared a platform to another. It was just a Radar related comparison discussion. With a higher powered engine, the JF-17 will use it's radar optimally. Due to better chips, it will equate the Rafale's radar range. Not beat the Rafale in everything else.

Example: How many Pentiums will you need to make a Core I-7, 8 core processor? What's faster?

2) Pakistan has already finalized the Radar for PFX. It will be JF-17's enhanced Radar at the same level as J-10C's built in Kamra. Some details are already out. More will come, give it time.

JEFF PROPAGANDA...
Our jeff is a good midrange plane but not good in comparison to the rafale...ik about the dog fights part...BVR combat is a tie when we see rafale with a meteor....It was the retardness of the IAF and superior tactics and kill chian technique..even a guy who has wet dreams of the jeff will tell you that rafale is a better jet...i am not talking about future variants or better engines but current latest variants..please dont ragebait

 

[ghazi52]

For a second, I was confused. !!

 

[Bentley777]

1) Rafale was built as a superior platform than the JF-17, no questions. But PL-15 eliminated that difference in individual capability. In WVR, Rafale will destroy the JF-17. But dog fight days are gone. Nowhere in my post I compared a platform to another. It was just a Radar related comparison discussion. With a higher powered engine, the JF-17 will use it's radar optimally. Due to better chips, it will equate the Rafale's radar range. Not beat the Rafale in everything else.

Example: How many Pentiums will you need to make a Core I-7, 8 core processor? What's faster?

2) Pakistan has already finalized the Radar for PFX. It will be JF-17's enhanced Radar at the same level as J-10C's built in Kamra. Some details are already out. More will come, give it time.

One thing for PL15 fan boys it's advantages will be very less next time IAF will fly 300km away they will rely on solely on stand off munitions which brings rafale stand off capabilities very potent againt jf17 and j10c. PAF only has two options to up there stand off game on both j10c and jf17 to make IAF come close as much as possible or cross the loc to get their jets in BVR range which is to complex because s400 needs to be neutralized and also If paf jets gets shot down they will fall in Indian territory.

 

[Oscar]

Don’t overstate what the JF-17 is supposed to do - or what it can do. It’s designed to provide effective force in case of conflict.

If it has to face off against the Rafale it will and will be employed in a manner that maximizes it’s advantages versus the Rafale while minimizing its shortcomings.

The aircraft has a very small frontal RCS - it was already small with the block-2 - rumors Ive read here and heard there say some efforts were made to reduce it further in Block-3.

Regardless - it doesn’t have to launch PL-15 when its radar picks a lock - so long as it has a track available to it via link there is a high possibility of LOAL.

Even if such a case doesn’t exist, it can still launch within sufficient range to push the Rafale away and then try to escape the meteor.

So long as you can push the enemy and force them to either abandon their original mission or delay it - job is done.

 

[studsmart]

I just love jf17 and proud of blk 3 however I am bit disappointed that jft is not able to score a single hit to date specially on may 7 when 72 options were in the air. It has full support of multi domain operation but still ...

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

I just love jf17 and proud of blk 3 however I am bit disappointed that jft is not able to score a single hit to date specially on may 7 when 72 options were in the air. It has full support of multi domain operation but still ...

According to senior and well respected members here Block-3 were armed with PL-15 and lock-on on different IAF jets like Mig-29/Mirage-2000H/MKI but authorization to fire PL-15 onto the targets were not allowed by PAF higher command

 

[BonPlan]

Why do your big talk and weapons produce 6-0? Allow me to educate you a little on Rafale's radars!

The JF-17's radar is a little smaller than J-10C's AESA. Both of these jets are using a generation ahead technology than Rafales. J-10C and JF-17 are using Gallium Nitride chips with longer range and speed to process information. This technology is considered "second generation" AESA tech.

J-35 and J-20 use 3rd generation technology based on Silicon Carbide. a whole generation ahead of the J-10C and JF-17, with much faster data processing and ranges! So going back to JF-17, it's generation 2 with a few less TR sensors than Rafale, but with better range and data processing speed. It's equal to, or a little superior than the Rafale's AESA. While the J-10C has a larger range gap with Rafales.

Why is Rafale AESA inferior? Because it was made on generation 1 of AESA technology from 2005-2010's technologies. This technology is based on "Gallium Arsenide". So even though this radar has more TR's, the technology is gen 1 and old with chips capable of lesser ranges and data processing speed than the gen 2 Gallium Nitride technologies used in AESA for J-10C and JF-17.

Pakistan will be producing these Radars with Galium Nitride in house for our future JF-17 and PFX jets under TOT.

JF-17 needs a more powerful engine to make use of it's radars to it's full capacity. That's already an item in works by the PAF.

It is full bull shit my dear.
JF17 radar uses AsGa modules, with air cooling, reducing the output power. I don't know about the J-10.

The prototyp of RBE2 AESA was made in 2010 with US modules, gen1, allowing only a 25% improvement over PESA radar. Then Thales decided to wait a little so as to use brand new european T/R modules, with a 100% improvement. This is probably what you called 2nd gen.
The mastery of Thales was that RBE2 was from scrtch studied as a PESA but with AESA in mind. To remove the PESA antenna for an AESA one takes one hour, but more interesting : all the soft and data bases developp for PESA can be used on AESA (the contrary is false) so when the first european AESA jet radar took the sky, in 2013, it was already a mature and multimission one.

And about GaN radar, wake me up when a 100% pakistanese radar will fly.

And at the end, the 6-0 is false. 6 is false and zero is false.

 

[MirageV3ff]

It is full bull shit my dear.
JF17 radar uses AsGa modules, with air cooling, reducing the output power. I don't know about the J-10.

The prototyp of RBE2 AESA was made in 2010 with US modules, gen1, allowing only a 25% improvement over PESA radar. Then Thales decided to wait a little so as to use brand new european T/R modules, with a 100% improvement. This is probably what you called 2nd gen.
The mastery of Thales was that RBE2 was from scrtch studied as a PESA but with AESA in mind. To remove the PESA antenna for an AESA one takes one hour, but more interesting : all the soft and data bases developp for PESA can be used on AESA (the contrary is false) so when the first european AESA jet radar took the sky, in 2013, it was already a mature and multimission one.

And about GaN radar, wake me up when a 100% pakistanese radar will fly.

And at the end, the 6-0 is false. 6 is false and zero is false

 

[TopGun786]

Yes it is false after the addition of 4th IAF Rafale which was written off later due to extreme damage it sustained after being hit by PL-15E.
Score now stands at 7-0 (8-0 if you also include the large IAF drone shot by PAF).

 

[TopGun786]

Yes it is false..... after the addition of 4th IAF Rafale which was written off later due to extreme damage it sustained after being hit by PL-15E.
Score now stands at 7-0 (8-0 if you also include the large IAF drone shot by PAF).

Quote

 

[BonPlan]

Yes it is false..... after the addition of 4th IAF Rafale which was written off later due to extreme damage it sustained after being hit by PL-15E.
Score now stands at 7-0 (8-0 if you also include the large IAF drone shot by PAF).

Quote

You have to write it twice to convince yourself it is true ?

 

[TAC]

It is full bull shit my dear.
JF17 radar uses AsGa modules, with air cooling, reducing the output power. I don't know about the J-10.

The prototyp of RBE2 AESA was made in 2010 with US modules, gen1, allowing only a 25% improvement over PESA radar. Then Thales decided to wait a little so as to use brand new european T/R modules, with a 100% improvement. This is probably what you called 2nd gen.
The mastery of Thales was that RBE2 was from scrtch studied as a PESA but with AESA in mind. To remove the PESA antenna for an AESA one takes one hour, but more interesting : all the soft and data bases developp for PESA can be used on AESA (the contrary is false) so when the first european AESA jet radar took the sky, in 2013, it was already a mature and multimission one.

And about GaN radar, wake me up when a 100% pakistanese radar will fly.

And at the end, the 6-0 is false. 6 is false and zero is false.

Yeah the whole world is now well aware of how French tech ( in Indian hands) performs against Chinese tech, so you don’t need to provide all this detail.
As for 6-0 it’s fact and associated evidence is easily available for all to see but not to Indians like you for who the truth is too horrific and painful to accept. Coping’s a bitch.

 

[RajaBaja]

JEFF PROPAGANDA...
Our jeff is a good midrange plane but not good in comparison to the rafale...ik about the dog fights part...BVR combat is a tie when we see rafale with a meteor....It was the retardness of the IAF and superior tactics and kill chian technique..even a guy who has wet dreams of the jeff will tell you that rafale is a better jet...i am not talking about future variants or better engines but current latest variants..please dont ragebait

You are a sensible person, I always add you into my posts because I think you add value to the topic. I don't know what's happening here.

Read my posts two more times and it will make sense to you. Rafale is a superior platform. I've clearly called it out. The discussion was about it's Radar and JF-17's Radar. I explained the technology set being used in them. JF-17 and J-10C's are using the Radar tech that was built by China AFTER Rafale's radar tech. Rafale's Radar chips were Gen 1. JF-17 which really uses J-10C's radar with less TR's, was built on gen 2 technology using chips that process much faster and longer range.

A platform like Rafale or J-10C or F-16's, aren't measured by ONE sensor. A platform is a full package of dozens of critical sensors, all combined making a jet. So like I said before, in that sense, Rafale by design is a superior platform. Not sure where the disconnect it.

Lastly, JF-17's major issue has been it's engine power. Let's pretend that in block III, a near J-10C's engine is added, airframe further strengthened for more load and J-10C's sensors are installed and they optimally function, then you can go head to head with Rafale comparison. Otherwise, Rafale is superior and comparable to J-10C.

 

[ViperStrike]