Pakistan-Saudi Arabia mutual defense pact: News & Discussion

[r3alist]

Very good point..yes we must be selective.....one country's veto can bog down the decision making process.

I wish we would pause to ponder whether a Western style organization is even suitable


If you look at Russia and Chinese corporation, it exceeds with duration and breadth and depth to any Islamic cooperation

It's clearly based on some very solid major principles and they don't even have a treaty

It's also able to resist external pressure

So why not think along these lines?

The NATO style agreement has become a joke and everyone here wants to pick it up

 

[SABRE]

Its unfair to compare Egypt to Pakistan. Egypt under Nasser was a great power and they fought the whole AngloSaxon front and western navies simultaneously. If it were not for treason of MB and their western supporters, today Israel couldn't exist.

Anwar Sadat was a piece of shit, its true. But Egypt as a country still has great potentials. Hope this old country with that old civilization behind itself rises again.

They were never a great power, not since the Octavian put them in their place, or perhaps not even before that. But under Nasser they were respected, perhaps because Nasser had a self respect, respect for his nation, and vision for sovereign Egypt representing a sovereign non-aligned Third World.

Egypt indeed has potential, and I have immense respect for Egyptian forces, who I think are brave and intelligent men held back by dependency imposed on them.

 

[HAIDER]

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[mythbuster]

I wish we would pause to ponder whether a Western style organization is even suitable


If you look at Russia and Chinese corporation, it exceeds with duration and breadth and depth to any Islamic cooperation

It's clearly based on some very solid major principles and they don't even have a treaty

It's also able to resist external pressure

So why not think along these lines?

The NATO style agreement has become a joke and everyone here wants to pick it up

Historically ,Western culture is based on legality ( moral aspects of legality are debatable )...... Entire countries had gone under the sovereignty of another country because of the blood lines and marriages..... that's the reason they make treaties/ agreements taking into account minutest of details....... that's another topic ..... what sketch / outline do you have in your mind for the forthcoming treaty ?

 

[arsalan345]

They are agressive only because of the unconditional backing they have from the USA. They are more like a brigade of the US Military than a country.

When nuclear thresholds are involved it changes things significantly.

Without the massive unconditional support, most of the Israelis will move back to their "back-up" home countries.

The days are not far off. The USA is a dying empire, although still an empire, with a large population that is unable to pay bills on time, with increasing tensions at home.

It all depends on the USA, and so far all signs show that the USA will not engage with a nuclear power directly.

I don't think so. I think Israel doesn't fear nuclear weapons even if we place them on arabian soil. It will not change Israeli mindset as they are backed by superpower. this theory that american economy is dying etc, it's overhyped. They are rebuilding again. They still have the strongest army in this world.

 

[mulj]

I wish we would pause to ponder whether a Western style organization is even suitable


If you look at Russia and Chinese corporation, it exceeds with duration and breadth and depth to any Islamic cooperation

It's clearly based on some very solid major principles and they don't even have a treaty

It's also able to resist external pressure

So why not think along these lines?

The NATO style agreement has become a joke and everyone here wants to pick it up

It is same essence actually formal treaty without strong principles engraved and followed is just that, you pointed out very well importance of principles as guideline.

 

[mulj]

I don't think so. I think Israel doesn't fear nuclear weapons even if we place them on arabian soil. It will not change Israeli mindset as they are backed by superpower. this theory that american economy is dying etc, it's overhyped. They are rebuilding again. They still have the strongest army in this world.

What israel fear most is any islamic pact groupation strong enough to be independent and self sustained in weapons procurement, economy and ability to project that power in now troubled their neighbors countries like syria, iraq, jordan and even egypt.

 

[mythbuster]

Israel has bitten more than it can chew......all the indicators suggest reality is dawning upon her .

 

[Watandar]

Either your rock's been really cozy or you're willfully blind to the unprecedented and increasing worldwide condemnation against Israel, including from its traditionally unwavering and complicit allies. The self-serving and cowardly Arab Governments are not the litmus test you can bank on.

Arab govts are indeed self serving, corrupt and cowardly. If Saudis and GCC didnt have easy oil money, they would be in same state as the hapless Palestinians.

The non response to Israeli attack on Qatar means that may be their eventual fate anyway.

 

[maxpane]

what israel feared is unity among muslim countries. israel's best weapn was divide and rule. arab vs arab . arab vs ajam . shia vs suni and dealing them one by one . if muslims just integrate economically as well as militarily then its game over. no more hegemoney on middle east

 

[r3alist]

Historically ,Western culture is based on legality ( moral aspects of legality are debatable )...... Entire countries had gone under the sovereignty of another country because of the blood lines and marriages..... that's the reason they make treaties/ agreements taking into account minutest of details....... that's another topic ..... what sketch / outline do you have in your mind for the forthcoming treaty ?

Exactly well said, and I don't have a sketch in mind.

And there might not be any objection to what is proposed, the point I was raising was we keep talking about NATO, but that concept has expired, treaty bound all for one one for all agreements are very difficult to implement in today's world

Taking the Russia and China example, they clearly have some absolute principles which bind them together and having a syncretic dialogue over time is what is needed, consistent and gradually growing

This deal came out of nowhere, and don't get me wrong it's very positive but it may well fall short in terms of having the depth and longevity some are hoping.

The Saudis generally take their cues from the Americans and if the Indians make right with Americans they may well readjust back, this might have American blessing because it forces India further to look towards America as well as gaining a foot back into Pakistan

Take this one moment at a time, nothing good is built up quickly

 

[Pakistan Space Agency]

why trump wants bagram right now? keep a close eye on united states. either they want to put pressure on paf or might hand over bagram to israel secretly. everything is so fast. something will happen soon in this region.

How does that happen when it's not in American hands in the first place?

Donald Trump has nothing to criticise Afghan Taliban with so he makes stupid statements for the sake of saying something stupid.

 

[mythbuster]

Exactly well said, and I don't have a sketch in mind.

And there might not be any objection to what is proposed, the point I was raising was we keep talking about NATO, but that concept has expired, treaty bound all for one one for all agreements are very difficult to implement in today's world

Taking the Russia and China example, they clearly have some absolute principles which bind them together and having a syncretic dialogue over time is what is needed, consistent and gradually growing

This deal came out of nowhere, and don't get me wrong it's very positive but it may well fall short in terms of having the depth and longevity some are hoping.

The Saudis generally take their cues from the Americans and if the Indians make right with Americans they may well readjust back, this might have American blessing because it forces India further to look towards America as well as gaining a foot back into Pakistan

Take this one moment at a time, nothing good is built up quickly

Overarching principles have been reached...1) attack on one attack on both....2) all means will be used.......it leaves little room to wiggle out of it.

 

[gangsta_rap]

There should've been a clause of some sort in the agreement that neither country will support another in a conflict against another OIC member state

 

[Distant_Observer]

Chinese media suggesting it will be a full tilt to Chinese hardware. Big orders are coming.