Rafale M Deal: India and France to Fast-Track Negotiations After Elections

[DDG-80]

I was confused with a 3 carrier navy for indian plus having Mig29+Rafale-M there is not much roam left for TEDBF as the number would be so small for developing a new fighter. But as you mentioned 6 carriers, yes things are clear now.

Our growing economy, expanding at 8%, backs these ambitious goals.

 

[vikNerv]

I was confused with a 3 carrier navy for indian plus having Mig29+Rafale-M there is not much roam left for TEDBF as the number would be so small for developing a new fighter. But as you mentioned 6 carriers, yes things are clear now.

TEDBF won't come for another 15 years, even if we will have only 4 carriers, that's atleast 40 TEDBF fighters (on deck) despite having Rafales (mig 29ks will be retired or close to retirement by the time TEDBF flies). Add to that shore based fighters (not sure what numbers they are looking at) and potential export orders (again no idea on these numbers).

 

[HostileInsurgent]

No. What’s relevant if you want to compare this is MTOW to maximum weapons load or to compare up to what range this load can be carried, but just the MTOW says nothing .

Okay then, would like to see the above mentioned relevant figures for the aircrafts I mentioned.

 

[Deino]

Okay then, would like to see the above mentioned relevant figures for the aircrafts I mentioned.

Then good luck for your search! Why should I do the work for you to support any claim you want to make?

 

[HostileInsurgent]

Then good luck for your search! Why should I do the work for you to support any claim you want to make?

Because you watch PLA closely and I couldn't find much data online regarding their payload carrying capacity. And the ones I find show figures for CATOBAR.

 

[Deino]

Because you watch PLA closely and I couldn't find much data online regarding their payload carrying capacity. And the ones I find show figures for CATOBAR.

Sorry, I look what I find when I’m back home

 

[harpy1]

Rafale M is being purchased for Vikrant carrier only

The mig29k will operate on the vikramdiyta

We need more migs as they suffer down time more ie navy has over 40 mig29k but only uses about half on the Carrier vikramdiyta at a time giving rotation time for those migs in service workshops

If when Vishal comes on board in say 2032/2035 then expect another order for rafale M especially if Vikrant experience of Rafales is top notch

 

[Justin TruDont]

Rafale-M is indeed a step-up from MiG-29K but 26 is not a big count.

You are correct
That's barely enough for 1 squadron plus enough attrition reserves
Also
Out of these 26, only 22 are carrier capable Rafale M and remaining 4 are Twin seat Rafale B which will only be shore based

The number should have been atleast 36 Rafales with 32 being Rafale Ms
So that enough aircrafts are available for the full lifespan of Vikrant

Rafale is an extremely safe aircraft with majority of its crashes being caused by pilot error during airshow type maneuvers .

But I expect around 5-6 crashes over it's 30 years operation on board Vikrant

Vikrant can comfortably carry 20 Rafale Ms , compared to 24 Mig29Ks mainly due to it's lack of folding Wings

 

[UKBengali]

Not sure why we are bashing Tejas or j20 ...can we stick to the topic guys
Rafale is a beast for me
Right now the most sought after fighter in the world by some of the richest nations in the world bar F35...

That alone tells you every thing
And the most expensive
Maybe just may be the Indians who have field tested typhoon and all the USA teen fighters know more than us fan boys .

Just maybe the rafale is a road map.to future F5 versions with unmanned drones and who knows the FCAS

I will say it now

India will imo not stop and just 26 marine Rafales
I see govt to gove deal for another batch of air force Rafale. I don't see 114 but I see 36/40

Meaning India will have well over 100
Rafales in service next 5/10.years

I also stick my neck out say FCAS is a very realistic option. For India long term.beyond 2035...

Our strategic relationship with France is deep

India only chose Rafale over Eurofighter due to the fact that Rafale is carrier capable.

Eurofighter is a better air to air fighter.

 

[Justin TruDont]

India only chose Rafale over Eurofighter due to the fact that Rafale is carrier capable.

Eurofighter is a better air to air fighter.

Correction

IAF chose Rafale because its a better omnirole fighter , Eurofighter specially the Saudi Spec TR4s are excellent Air superiority platform .

but France is a better partner for India as compared to Germany which tends to throw a hussy fit over stuff like not supporting the UN resolution on Ukraine

Rafale also can carry greater payload @ 9000 kgs as compared to 7500kg of Typhoon and it has a longer ferry range with drop tanks at 4000km vs 3000km for Typhoons .

Indian Navy chose the Rafale because of its commonality with IAF and they can share the training and Maintenence Infrastructure as well as weapon's commonality

IAF bought 300 Meteors , 120 Scalp Cruise Missiles and 500 Hammer LGB with their Rafales

Indian Navy is only getting 150 Meteor and around 50 Exocet Anti Ship missiles with its 26 Rafales .
They will share the Scalp Missiles and Hammer LGB with IAF

 

[Yasser76]

Rafale M is being purchased for Vikrant carrier only

The mig29k will operate on the vikramdiyta

We need more migs as they suffer down time more ie navy has over 40 mig29k but only uses about half on the Carrier vikramdiyta at a time giving rotation time for those migs in service workshops

If when Vishal comes on board in say 2032/2035 then expect another order for rafale M especially if Vikrant experience of Rafales is top notch

Much less then half will be on the carrier. Also bizarre situation have different aircraft types for different ships

 

[Yasser76]

You are correct
That's barely enough for 1 squadron plus enough attrition reserves
Also
Out of these 26, only 22 are carrier capable Rafale M and remaining 4 are Twin seat Rafale B which will only be shore based

The number should have been atleast 36 Rafales with 32 being Rafale Ms
So that enough aircrafts are available for the full lifespan of Vikrant

Rafale is an extremely safe aircraft with majority of its crashes being caused by pilot error during airshow type maneuvers .

But I expect around 5-6 crashes over it's 30 years operation on board Vikrant

Vikrant can comfortably carry 20 Rafale Ms , compared to 24 Mig29Ks mainly due to it's lack of folding Wings

With 26 planes you may only manage about 10-12 on the carrier. Max.

 

[Justin TruDont]

With 26 planes you may only manage about 10-12 on the carrier. Max.

It wont be that low
but not more than 18 Rafale M on the carrier, given Rafale's 85% availability rate compared to 60% for the Mig29K

 

[Yasser76]

It wont be that low
but not more than 18 Rafale M on the carrier, given Rafale's 85% availability rate compared to 60% for the Mig29K

Let us do some maths.

85% availability. Only 22 are carrier capable.

So you will have around 20 available planes.

You will need 2 spares to cover any frontline planes that go unservicable. Even though you have four 2 seaters, some single seaters will be required for training. Call it 4 planes

That leaves you around 12 max

 

[MirageBlue]

Just ignore him, he has a well documented prejudice against everything Indian. He even let it slip once in this very forum. He may be knowledgeable in things China related but and may be even some Indian military developments, but for the majority part he lets his prejudice color his opinions. Best not bother with him.

Correct. I lost respect for him once his biases became so blatantly obvious. Best to ignore.