Sea Sultan Long-Range MPA | Updates & Discussion

[Par 5]

Bombardier was relatively better at allowing off-market customization work on the Global Express series. In fact, I think that was one of the options presented to the PN for the LRMPA, but it lacked the payload capacity. That said, in 2023, a Canadian firm by the name of PAL Aerospace proposed a major modification (very similar to what the PN intends for the Sea Sultan) to increase payload (via under-fuselage bay).

It's unfortunate that the PAF, PN, and PA didn't standardize on one platform from the onset and pool a bigger order together. I'm sure that between them and their current and future special mission aircraft needs, they'd need around 20 aircraft in total. And besides working directly with the OEM to purchase and modify the aircraft, there was also the avenue of setting up an official, licensed MRO line that would service them and, eventually, carry out modification work domestically.

If PAF + PN + PA would have a combined/ joint Surveillance Command and with pooled resources, they could have hand-picked a BRAND-NEW PLATFORM from any manufacturer for the LRMPA, MPA or General Surveillance Role. We would not have any logistics issues like we are having today

 

[BlueMarlin]

There’s enough of a global E-Jet support ecosystem to keep Embraer support on the quiet side and not compete with Adani's interests. The bigger issue is actually getting a direct PIA order which could be problematic but nothing prevents PIA from getting E-jets for its needs.

The issue is PIA being tied into its 777(switching to 787 potentially) + 320 due to the traffic mix and wet-lease lock ins.

things can be done with out the manufacturer, but do you think they would be accessible?

do you genuinely believe the Indians will build the e jet in india...... your more hopeful than i thought, regardless of what they sign.

pia switching to the 787 is a natural choice and maybe the 77x later on the 3 e-jets dont havae the legs or capacity and the a320/737

 

[shark46]

yeah i think thats probably the bigger takeaway here is the lack of a common platform across the services makes these small special mission fleets harder to sustain regardless of how good the individual aircraft choice is.

a joint requirement from the start could have made the whole procurement and support side a lot more straightforward.

 

[Oscar]

things can be done with out the manufacturer, but do you think they would be accessible?

do you genuinely believe the Indians will build the e jet in india...... your more hopeful than i thought, regardless of what they sign.

pia switching to the 787 is a natural choice and maybe the 77x later on the 3 e-jets dont havae the legs or capacity and the a320/737

India does have enough of a domestic demand that Adani wants to be part of the pie.
Moreover, enough e-jets everywhere to allow Pakistan to sustain operations.

Keep in mind - the Saab-2000 is essentially out of production and parts support is now with 3rd parties including parts, service and so on.
Saab will still support critical components - but overall there are plenty of MROs and other suppliers available for it.

The same goes for the e-jets - it has a fairly decent ecosystem of MROs and suppliers (including its subsystems which dont all come from Embraer) that it can be kept running for decades without too much involvement from OEM.

 

[BlueMarlin]

India does have enough of a domestic demand that Adani wants to be part of the pie.
Moreover, enough e-jets everywhere to allow Pakistan to sustain operations.

Keep in mind - the Saab-2000 is essentially out of production and parts support is now with 3rd parties including parts, service and so on.
Saab will still support critical components - but overall there are plenty of MROs and other suppliers available for it.

The same goes for the e-jets - it has a fairly decent ecosystem of MROs and suppliers (including its subsystems which dont all come from Embraer) that it can be kept running for decades without too much involvement from OEM.

they have the demand but do they have the appetite? the pw-gtf engines took down goair and hit indigo too. they will stay away from the e2 series. or they could have gone with the a220 but didnt for the same reasons.

the saab 2000 example is a good one i would give you that with your local capability to rebuild them is known too. how many firms are capable of this types of work isnt alot. and honestly i dont know how they selected paramount group for the works... they’ve not done much major works recently.

 

[Quwa]

If PAF + PN + PA would have a combined/ joint Surveillance Command and with pooled resources, they could have hand-picked a BRAND-NEW PLATFORM from any manufacturer for the LRMPA, MPA or General Surveillance Role. We would not have any logistics issues like we are having today

If not a unified command, then at least a tri-services committee or office to demand and coordinate standardization in platforms. It's not just special mission aircraft, but also SAR helicopters and SAMs. This is precisely the type of work an office like the CDS/CDF should be doing, IMO.