Tang dynasty battles with the caliphate
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ety
Trusted Member
I should more accurately say the loss of the battle of Talas was one of the reasons indirectly culminated in The An Shi Rebellion few years later.
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Waz
Administrator
Would these be the Hui?
_Arabia_
Trusted Member
Caliphates as in Arab (Arabian and Hejazi to be precise) imperial dynasties (Umayyad and Abbasid).
That was mostly purely the work of Arabs (Arabians) from modern-day KSA (Hejazis) and Yemen (Hadhramis) mainly.
en.wikipedia.org
Same Arabs that created numerous sultanates, kingdoms etc. in South East Asia. From modern-day Malaysia, Singapore, Indonesia, Philippines to Brunei.
The current Sultan of Brunei is for instance o Hejazi Hashemite ancestry.
en.wikipedia.org
Numerous Muslim dynasties in South Philippines (Mindanao) etc. as well. Including the Sultanate of Sulu that ruled for almost 500 years.
en.wikipedia.org
A few of the current Malaysian kingdoms are of Arab origin as well.
Arabs owned almost all of Singapore not long ago.
Quite a few former Indonesian Muslim dynasties of Arab ancestry as well.
There are around 10 + million people of Arab ancestry in South East Asia.
Even an Arab origin Sultanate in Borneo.
en.wikipedia.org
Last Sultan (until 1978):
en.wikipedia.org
I could go on.
Arabs left a lot of linguistic, religious, cultural, culinary, architectural, musical etc. influence.
Also the reason why most (almost all) Muslims in South East Asia (close to 350 million people) are mostly Shafi'i Sunni Muslims (main maddhab of Hejazis and Hadhramis traditionally).
Same thing with the Hui who were/are partially of Arab origin as well and have their own Arabic origin alphabet.
As for those battles - just a reminder - at the time Arabs controlled one of the largest empires in history (the largest in history back then) spanning almost 15.000 km from west (France/Spain/Portugal in the West) to modern-day Western Xinjiang/Eastern Central Asia.
It is absolutely stunning that such battles even took place given that Arabs defeated/took on 4 of the strongest empires within a very short time period (Byzantine, Persian, Frankish (strongest Western European power) kingdom/empire, Chinese Tang empire and everything in between. While facing (often) internal Arab-Arab conflicts.
That was mostly purely the work of Arabs (Arabians) from modern-day KSA (Hejazis) and Yemen (Hadhramis) mainly.
Islam in Southeast Asia - Wikipedia
Same Arabs that created numerous sultanates, kingdoms etc. in South East Asia. From modern-day Malaysia, Singapore, Indonesia, Philippines to Brunei.
The current Sultan of Brunei is for instance o Hejazi Hashemite ancestry.
House of Bolkiah - Wikipedia
Numerous Muslim dynasties in South Philippines (Mindanao) etc. as well. Including the Sultanate of Sulu that ruled for almost 500 years.
Sultanate of Sulu - Wikipedia
A few of the current Malaysian kingdoms are of Arab origin as well.
Arabs owned almost all of Singapore not long ago.
Quite a few former Indonesian Muslim dynasties of Arab ancestry as well.
There are around 10 + million people of Arab ancestry in South East Asia.
Even an Arab origin Sultanate in Borneo.
Pontianak Sultanate - Wikipedia
Last Sultan (until 1978):
Syarif Hamid II of Pontianak - Wikipedia
I could go on.
Arabs left a lot of linguistic, religious, cultural, culinary, architectural, musical etc. influence.
Also the reason why most (almost all) Muslims in South East Asia (close to 350 million people) are mostly Shafi'i Sunni Muslims (main maddhab of Hejazis and Hadhramis traditionally).
Same thing with the Hui who were/are partially of Arab origin as well and have their own Arabic origin alphabet.
As for those battles - just a reminder - at the time Arabs controlled one of the largest empires in history (the largest in history back then) spanning almost 15.000 km from west (France/Spain/Portugal in the West) to modern-day Western Xinjiang/Eastern Central Asia.
It is absolutely stunning that such battles even took place given that Arabs defeated/took on 4 of the strongest empires within a very short time period (Byzantine, Persian, Frankish (strongest Western European power) kingdom/empire, Chinese Tang empire and everything in between. While facing (often) internal Arab-Arab conflicts.
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Indos
INT'L MOD
Caliphates as in Arab (Arabian and Hejazi to be precise) imperial dynasties (Umayyad and Abbasid).
That was mostly purely the work of Arabs (Arabians) from modern-day KSA (Hejazis) and Yemen (Hadhramis) mainly.
Islam in Southeast Asia - Wikipedia
Same Arabs that created numerous sultanates, kingdoms etc. in South East Asia. From modern-day Malaysia, Singapore, Indonesia, Philippines to Brunei.
The current Sultan of Brunei is for instance o Hejazi Hashemite ancestry.
House of Bolkiah - Wikipedia
Numerous Muslim dynasties in South Philippines (Mindanao) etc. as well. Including the Sultanate of Sulu that ruled for almost 500 years.
Sultanate of Sulu - Wikipedia
A few of the current Malaysian kingdoms are of Arab origin as well.
Arabs owned almost all of Singapore not long ago.
Quite a few former Indonesian Muslim dynasties of Arab ancestry as well.
There are around 10 + million people of Arab ancestry in South East Asia.
Even an Arab origin Sultanate in Borneo.
Pontianak Sultanate - Wikipedia
Last Sultan (until 1978):
Syarif Hamid II of Pontianak - Wikipedia
I could go on.
Arabs left a lot of linguistic, religious, cultural, culinary, architectural, musical etc. influence.
Also the reason why most (almost all) Muslims in South East Asia (close to 350 million people) are mostly Shafi'i Sunni Muslims (main maddhab of Hejazis and Hadhramis traditionally).
Same thing with the Hui who were/are partially of Arab origin as well and have their own Arabic origin alphabet.
As for those battles - just a reminder - at the time Arabs controlled one of the largest empires in history (the largest in history back then) spanning almost 15.000 km from west (France/Spain/Portugal in the West) to modern-day Western Xinjiang/Eastern Central Asia.
It is absolutely stunning that such battles even took place given that Arabs defeated/took on 4 of the strongest empires within a very short time period (Byzantine, Persian, Frankish (strongest Western European power) kingdom/empire, Chinese Tang empire and everything in between. While facing (often) internal Arab-Arab conflicts.
Ibnu Batutah has already seen Arabic village and also Chinese living in Indonesia when he visited Indonesia.
I would say Indonesians are pretty much quite mixed. Even if you see Papuan, there are variation between them, there are black skin Papuan and there are brown skin one, the browne skin one are mixed with Austronesian people (majority of Indonesian)
_Arabia_
Trusted Member
Arab world and South East Asia likely traded with each for 1000's upon 1000's of years. Much longer than written sources can attest.
If predecessor ancient civilizations and cultures native to the Arab world (Arabia and Southern Mesopotamia/Northern Arabia in particular) had ties with IVC 5000 + years ago and much of South Asia (maritime) and East Africa as well, I see no reason why Arabs/our predecessors could not have arrived in South East Asia as well.
If you look at the earliest human migrations, people from Arabia, settled rest of Asia as a whole (many 10.000's of years ago) so I don't think it would be unthinkable if there were trade ties and human migrations (both ways) many millennia before the attested history.
There are annual surface ocean currents each monsoon season (June to October) that carries you (naturally) from Arabia towards South East Asia. During the winter it is in the opposite direction.
Take Madagascar as an example - an area of the world where peoples from Arabia and South East Asia have left their mark.
I believe our regions have been connected for many more 1000's of years than written history attests.
Same story with the Arab world and the Mediterranean - a similar but much, much smaller ancient highway.
Indos
INT'L MOD
These Papuan living in coast line, while those living in the mountain is pretty much pour ones
_Arabia_
Trusted Member
Indonesia is a very diverse country but I think that the vast majority of peoples and ethnic groups in Indonesia are native to Java and Sumatra. I also believe that Sumatrans and Javans are very close overall.
Indonesians elsewhere (most different are the local Papuans in West Papua) are a bit more different (correct me here).
For example I think that local Borneans and people from Sulawesi are closer to each other than with Sumatrans and Javans.
But it is all very interesting.
I wonder how close people of Mindanao in South Philippines are with Indonesians in Borneo - in particular eastern and northwestern? I think that the Sultanate of Sulu for instance controlled lands in both areas.
Another thing, I believe that Malay people are very close to Sumatrans as well.
ChineseTiger1986
Trusted Member
Both Uyghurs and Tibetans are gradually getting more integrated into the Chinese society.
Now it is Manchus who are getting more and more weary among us, and I previously thought that they were becoming very patriotic just like us the Han Chinese, but it turns out that I was wrong.
Indos
INT'L MOD
I think pretty much they are the same, Austronesians people that comes from Taiwan, and the variation between Indonesians are also influence by the mixing with Chinese, Arabic, and European (Dutch since Dutch making huge colonies in Indonesia, different with British in Malaysia, India, etc)
Great Kingdoms are usually originated from Indonesia, like Sulu in Philippine originated from West Sumatran or Great Kingdom in Malaysia with link to Palembang royal in Indonesia. Palembang is where Indonesian Kingdom of Srivijaya originated (center of power in Sumatra)
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Similarly, the rulers of Malacca, though of prestigious Palembang origin, had accepted Islam precisely in order to attract Muslim and Javanese traders to their port. This profitable network of communication with the Muslim world of Asia, combined with Islam’s assertion of the equality of all believers, helped propel such areas from the fringe of Shaivite-Mahayana culture toward positions of influence within the Indonesian archipelago.
Indonesia - Islamic, Culture, Traditions | Britannica
Indonesia - Islamic, Culture, Traditions: Foreign Muslims had traded in Indonesia and China for many centuries; a Muslim tombstone in eastern Java bears a date corresponding to 1082. However, substantial evidence of Islam in Indonesia exists only from the end of the 13th century, in northern...
www.britannica.com
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Indos
INT'L MOD
I think related to influence, it is not just Arabic when it comes to Middle East influence to Indonesia, but also Persian as word like Bandar that is absorbed with Indonesian language is exclusively Persian
MMM-E
Elite Member
Turks actively fought in the Battle of Talas and ultimately decided its outcome. In this historic clash in 751 AD, the Karluk Turks joined forces with the Abbasid Caliphate to defeat the Chinese Tang Dynasty
it was Turkic dynasties that established long-term Empires
The Turks were responsible for the massive, institutional and widespread expansion of Islam across India, Pakistan and Bangladesh
The Battle of Talas shattered China's political and military influence in Central Asia for a full 1.000 years.
it was Turkic dynasties that established long-term Empires
The Turks were responsible for the massive, institutional and widespread expansion of Islam across India, Pakistan and Bangladesh
The Battle of Talas shattered China's political and military influence in Central Asia for a full 1.000 years.
ety
Trusted Member
The Manchus descendants are very active in Chinese entertainment and education sectors and cultural arena. They have good influences on the cultural heritage and ideology of Chinese society, that's not very good for China as they bring polluted biased views on Chinese history and cultures.
ChineseTiger1986
Trusted Member
They are very aligned with the white/jewish liberal ideology, and hope the Han Chinese to keep getting depopulated.
Also keep bashing the Ming Dynasty and other Dynasties founded by the Han Chinese, and continue to overhype their prestige Qing Dynasty.
BTW, these savages were not even descended from the Jurgens of the Jin Dynasty, but a group of Buryats from Siberia who were taken in refugees by the Ming Emperor Yongle, but the Ming Dynasty was simply digging their own grave.
